Any Phantom stories out there?
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Emptying the litter bin
Age: 65
Posts: 409
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Following on from the Nav. ejection, a caption on a Squadron Prints picture of XS571 includes the following,
Join Date: May 1999
Location: flat & wet
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
27 feet
From a hazy memory I think it was "officially" logged at 27 feet, not 30.
Believe it was also in the times of the Death Star (Mt.Pleasant), not Stanley.....
no names though......
Believe it was also in the times of the Death Star (Mt.Pleasant), not Stanley.....
no names though......
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
some Horiz stab angle in that picture ......
'member the 1435 'phinal phling and looking DOWN into the cockpits as the gentleman whizzed their way along the taxiway and into history.......dunlops definitely stowed before you ask!
Pity the new 'staish had a hand/head interface fail when he swapped over to the F3....
OLD RED DAMASK
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lancashire born. In Cebu now
Age: 70
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Apologies for intruding on this wonderful thread.
Ex Army but had a lot of connection through the RAF with my Mum's cousin and my Dad was ex RAF. Also always wanted to be a pilot but got glasses at 12, so that put paid to any idea at the time of being a RAF pilot.
I digress however.
There is another thread with a COI film about the Jaguar, in it the narrator says it is superior to the Phantom.
Your input Gents to any who flew both types would be read with enthusiasm.
Ex Army but had a lot of connection through the RAF with my Mum's cousin and my Dad was ex RAF. Also always wanted to be a pilot but got glasses at 12, so that put paid to any idea at the time of being a RAF pilot.
I digress however.
There is another thread with a COI film about the Jaguar, in it the narrator says it is superior to the Phantom.
Your input Gents to any who flew both types would be read with enthusiasm.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Sussex UK
Age: 66
Posts: 6,995
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I'm told by a highly skilled ex Jag Engineer (NutLoose) that, in terms of build quality, this is what the Jag looked like under the skin ...
Struggling to find an appropriate metaphor pic for the F4 ... But Brick Built Shi7e House comes to mind with a proper pair of engines !
Struggling to find an appropriate metaphor pic for the F4 ... But Brick Built Shi7e House comes to mind with a proper pair of engines !
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lincolnshire
Posts: 543
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
lasernigel, not many F4 guys cross trained but I had a few rides in a Jaguar and "a few more" hours on the F4.
The Jaguar was an inferior airframe developed, eventually, to its maximum potential by some dedicated individuals who worked the airworthiness system well. It was not a match for the Phantom in any area; performance, load carrying or all weather capability. If the F4 had been given the same avionics update it would have been a world beater; which in fact, in its day, it was.
The Jaguar was an inferior airframe developed, eventually, to its maximum potential by some dedicated individuals who worked the airworthiness system well. It was not a match for the Phantom in any area; performance, load carrying or all weather capability. If the F4 had been given the same avionics update it would have been a world beater; which in fact, in its day, it was.
Last edited by Geehovah; 20th Nov 2012 at 19:37.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jag superior to Phantom - not
No, get off the fence Courtney (I agree with you).
There was an ex Jag pilot on my F4 OCU course; I think that says enough.
I loved the way you could chase a Jag down at low level and even if you couldn't be bothered to close to 'winder range give them a squirt of CW which caused them to break into 'winder range... Doh!
Anything that takes the curvature of the earth to get airborne without anything offensive on the pylons is definitely no match. No radar and no BVR weapons... Max altitude determined by ears going "pop" or a nosebleed... A wing loading that makes air combat with a starfighter like a knife fight in a phone box... Whoever wrote that drivel (Jag superior to Phantom) hasn't done their homework.
Does anyone have ODMs to compare? I'd take a C44+8 F4 against any Jag configuration (NB Being an ex air defender I have no GA experience other than strafe and I am also biased).
There was an ex Jag pilot on my F4 OCU course; I think that says enough.
I loved the way you could chase a Jag down at low level and even if you couldn't be bothered to close to 'winder range give them a squirt of CW which caused them to break into 'winder range... Doh!
Anything that takes the curvature of the earth to get airborne without anything offensive on the pylons is definitely no match. No radar and no BVR weapons... Max altitude determined by ears going "pop" or a nosebleed... A wing loading that makes air combat with a starfighter like a knife fight in a phone box... Whoever wrote that drivel (Jag superior to Phantom) hasn't done their homework.
Does anyone have ODMs to compare? I'd take a C44+8 F4 against any Jag configuration (NB Being an ex air defender I have no GA experience other than strafe and I am also biased).
Jaguar?
Poor old Jag, it was never in the same league as the Phantom, but then it was never intended to be was it? It was a replacement for the Gnat and the Hunter but was then turned into what it was at the end, a fairly decent 'light bomber'.
As for superior? Well it served for longer and saw combat maybe that might count for something.
As a former recce dude the Phantom pod beat the Jag pods for multi-sensor image quality.
As for superior? Well it served for longer and saw combat maybe that might count for something.
As a former recce dude the Phantom pod beat the Jag pods for multi-sensor image quality.
Last edited by HAS59; 21st Nov 2012 at 10:47.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: London
Age: 58
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Okay this is an old thread but.....
I loved the Jag.
It looked like it was meant to be driven by dashing young pilots, driving sports cars, flashy young upper class women on their arms.
The F4 however looked like it should be flown by the Pilot equivalent of Navvies.
Hard nosed, seen the world, taken it all in and threw the crap back at anyone who dared poke their head above the parapet. You flew the Phantom or you didn't.
The sort that growled when ATC didn't clear them within 2 seconds of asking for a new heading/altitude.
The sort that looked for women who had the same attributes as the beast they flew, bit rough, not afraid to ask for what they needed and was sure as sh*t not going to accept any excuses when you failed to satisfy them. Get it wrong, push a little to hard, just once, and she would buck and whisper "Off You Get".
So I love the Jag. But the F4 Phantom is the one I would have flown.
I loved the Jag.
It looked like it was meant to be driven by dashing young pilots, driving sports cars, flashy young upper class women on their arms.
The F4 however looked like it should be flown by the Pilot equivalent of Navvies.
Hard nosed, seen the world, taken it all in and threw the crap back at anyone who dared poke their head above the parapet. You flew the Phantom or you didn't.
The sort that growled when ATC didn't clear them within 2 seconds of asking for a new heading/altitude.
The sort that looked for women who had the same attributes as the beast they flew, bit rough, not afraid to ask for what they needed and was sure as sh*t not going to accept any excuses when you failed to satisfy them. Get it wrong, push a little to hard, just once, and she would buck and whisper "Off You Get".
So I love the Jag. But the F4 Phantom is the one I would have flown.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: earth
Posts: 1,397
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My first back seat ride in a Jag I asked the front-seater why he hadn't used reheat on take-off. There was a long period of non-communication from the front and it transpired he was pissed because he had.
No contest with the F4
No contest with the F4
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Age: 78
Posts: 389
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Unheated reheat
We Canberra boys used to chase Jags in the LFA, in theory they were faster at low level because our straight wing did not react well to 300+ in turbulence but in pursuit you could always tell by the reheat flash when they were about to turn and could cut the corner
Got some good pics but it went out of style to send them photos after a certain incident in Germany
Got some good pics but it went out of style to send them photos after a certain incident in Germany
