Historical RAF Uniform Question
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KD
I am working on smart phone and can't go all the way through this thread. When was KD phased out in the Royal Air Force? Also I never wore shorts. Were officers always allowed to wear shorts? Big argument with 'her who thinks that she is always right'
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KD actually went out in 1972 to be replaced by Stone.
I saw Stone being worn in Cyprus only a couple of years ago. There was a mix of stone, CS95 and Desert. What you wore seemed to be up to you.
One reason for combats replacing Stone (or Blues) is practically the same reason that aircrew wear onesies
- they are free whereas blues and stone have to be paid for if you are an officer.
I think the Army goes the same way with officers avoiding barrack dress on the slightest pretext. I know my colonel had combats several sizes larger than his No 2 dress uniform. I am sure his blues would not have fitted at all.
I saw Stone being worn in Cyprus only a couple of years ago. There was a mix of stone, CS95 and Desert. What you wore seemed to be up to you.
One reason for combats replacing Stone (or Blues) is practically the same reason that aircrew wear onesies
- they are free whereas blues and stone have to be paid for if you are an officer.I think the Army goes the same way with officers avoiding barrack dress on the slightest pretext. I know my colonel had combats several sizes larger than his No 2 dress uniform. I am sure his blues would not have fitted at all.
Exascot I spent about two and a half years altogether in Aden and the Far East in the late 60s. We always wore shorts in the daytime and long trousers in the evening (anti malaria precaution, sleeves rolled down at night as well). Shame the bush jacket went out, it was smart and much more comfortable than the No 6 which required a shirt and tie.
Last edited by Tankertrashnav; 17th Jun 2013 at 16:42.
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Zoot Suit
"I understood that only V-force and Lightning aircrew were entitled to it" Because we wore the same flying kit as V force (Taylor helmet and pressure jerkin) PR9 crews were also issued with the "Breast Feeders" and got the pre and post flight meals too. A useful add-on for the under 25s on minimal allowances. In Kenya the Eastleigh mess couldn't provide the meals so we ate in the Embakasi airport restaurant which was very tasty, and they did our in flight sarnies too!
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We were issued "KD" in the late 80's for Deci..... shorts and all, though thankfully not the underwear which apparently were longer in length than the shorts that went over them, by a good inch from what I was told.
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Get your Knees Brown !
Exascot,
All ranks wore shorts in India (and all the rest of the tropics) when I was there ('42-'46). Stores issue was 'orrible - get the dherzi to run them up for next to nothing.
Americans sweated in their KD slacks and greatly envied us !
Danny
All ranks wore shorts in India (and all the rest of the tropics) when I was there ('42-'46). Stores issue was 'orrible - get the dherzi to run them up for next to nothing.
Americans sweated in their KD slacks and greatly envied us !
Danny
KD
PN
KD actually went out in 1972 to be replaced by Stone.
Quite correct. I was in Cyprus 71-73. I did not get issued with the new 'stone' uniform on my tour. We did get a loan of one pair of trousers and one long sleeved shirt to take part in a Squadron Standard presentation.
While on detachment at Akrotiri in the winter/Spring of 1984 we were required to stay an extra two months because of the 'do' that was going on in Beirut at that time. With only blues to wear we were issued with the old style KD (Big buckles etc) which at that time only issued for working on aircraft. It was very scruffy and we did look out of place and received lots of comments from certain quarters, especially in the Sgts' Mess.
Aaron.
KD actually went out in 1972 to be replaced by Stone.
Quite correct. I was in Cyprus 71-73. I did not get issued with the new 'stone' uniform on my tour. We did get a loan of one pair of trousers and one long sleeved shirt to take part in a Squadron Standard presentation.
While on detachment at Akrotiri in the winter/Spring of 1984 we were required to stay an extra two months because of the 'do' that was going on in Beirut at that time. With only blues to wear we were issued with the old style KD (Big buckles etc) which at that time only issued for working on aircraft. It was very scruffy and we did look out of place and received lots of comments from certain quarters, especially in the Sgts' Mess.
Aaron.
Stone Uniform
All the Stone items ("safari" jacket, long trousers, shorts, long sleeve shirt and short sleeve shirt) were issued to those who were sent to AHQ Riyadh during GW1 in 1990-91. Most of us wore the "Part Worn Serviceable" (ie multiple previous loaners) Tropical DPMs the whole time - at least I managed to get a couple of sets with shirt / trouser colours that matched and without holes in them by being allowed to rummage behind the counter at Innsworth by appointment instead of trusting to luck with whatever was sent to Uxbridge.
For those of us that volunteered to do a double tour + for the duration, the ill-fitting Desert DPMs arrived just in time to go home in !
How times have changed for the better with the way CS95 and PCS was / is available.
For those of us that volunteered to do a double tour + for the duration, the ill-fitting Desert DPMs arrived just in time to go home in !
How times have changed for the better with the way CS95 and PCS was / is available.
Last edited by RAFEngO74to09; 17th Jun 2013 at 23:21.
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The GWI reference is interesting
When that happened, Survival Aids (of Morland, Cumbria) got a massive UOR to supply desert clothing to replace what in many cases was preserved WWII kit!
Of course, they never got paid by the MOD so went bust......thats why the shops at Euston and Colchester suddenly closed, stopping you getting the bespoke combat gear.
But....the really strange thing is, that clothing was only ordered at the very last minute when someone realised how crap the stored clothing was. Yet Angus Fire Armour (of High Bentham) got MOD orders for fuel and water hoses for desert use for a major war three years before GWI kicked off.....one suspects a lack of information supply in planning
Of course Angus never got paid either, meaning they had to sell out to Kidde of the USA after the war ended
When that happened, Survival Aids (of Morland, Cumbria) got a massive UOR to supply desert clothing to replace what in many cases was preserved WWII kit!
Of course, they never got paid by the MOD so went bust......thats why the shops at Euston and Colchester suddenly closed, stopping you getting the bespoke combat gear.
But....the really strange thing is, that clothing was only ordered at the very last minute when someone realised how crap the stored clothing was. Yet Angus Fire Armour (of High Bentham) got MOD orders for fuel and water hoses for desert use for a major war three years before GWI kicked off.....one suspects a lack of information supply in planning
Of course Angus never got paid either, meaning they had to sell out to Kidde of the USA after the war ended
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
When Stone came in in 1971-72 the Officers' Mess at Akrotiri placed an order for a number of bolts of material so that we could have uniforms made up. We had a very generous allowance for the new issue No 6 and also shorts, shirts, trousers and jackets. It was very welcome.
Naturally a number of us, looking at tourex dates during the winter season of 72-73 decided to avoid buying No 6s.
OC Admin Wing, knowing this, decided the Station would parade for AOCs in the last week of summer 1972 which saw a flurry of officers rushing to get No 6s made up for a one-off. With a bit of forward planning I ensured we were the ferry crew to take an aircraft back to UK.
When I next wore tropical rig 12 years later I found it had all shrunk and Au Wai Lam came to the rescue.
My 5a jacket, run up by the Paki tailor still fitted but was now in disruptive white and orange. The spousal dhobi walla got it more or less white and the laundry in Aberdeen did a good job of final restoration. It had to be returned however for a liberal application of starch. The starched jacket was looking very much the worse for wear after 6 or 7 dining in nights on my rigorous tour - Red Sea rig became the norm during that period but I didn't have the right shirt and Mrs PN couldn't find a suitable one in the UK winter.
Naturally a number of us, looking at tourex dates during the winter season of 72-73 decided to avoid buying No 6s.
OC Admin Wing, knowing this, decided the Station would parade for AOCs in the last week of summer 1972 which saw a flurry of officers rushing to get No 6s made up for a one-off. With a bit of forward planning I ensured we were the ferry crew to take an aircraft back to UK.
When I next wore tropical rig 12 years later I found it had all shrunk and Au Wai Lam came to the rescue.
My 5a jacket, run up by the Paki tailor still fitted but was now in disruptive white and orange. The spousal dhobi walla got it more or less white and the laundry in Aberdeen did a good job of final restoration. It had to be returned however for a liberal application of starch. The starched jacket was looking very much the worse for wear after 6 or 7 dining in nights on my rigorous tour - Red Sea rig became the norm during that period but I didn't have the right shirt and Mrs PN couldn't find a suitable one in the UK winter.
Mid-October 1965, and it's our Nav Course's overseas trip (by Varsity) to Gib, where they are still in KD. Stores at Stradishall issue us students a set of KD for our day off down there - shirt and shorts crammed into a plastic wallet, of a type that I'm sure I later knew as a headset bag. What it would have looked like in use we never knew, as our Dep Course Commander went immediately after arrival to the Station Commander to request permission for us to stay in Blue. And happily, that was granted.
Later I recall the 1971 and 72 get-togethers of those on Exchange with the USAF at the Air University in Alabama, during the RAF Staff College's annual visits there. At the first night Reception, we all look pretty much identically kitted in our new Stone-coloured No 6s. However, on the next morning as we show up for the day's lectures etc, the full panoply of KD shades available at the time, from ivory to yellow, depending on place of origin, is on display. Uniformity, indeed!
Edited to add: It wasn't just the different colours, but different kit - Bush Jackets, shirts with long or short sleeves, different weave patterns in the cloth and, no doubt, the odd Stable Belt thrown in just to add to the variety to the whole.
Later I recall the 1971 and 72 get-togethers of those on Exchange with the USAF at the Air University in Alabama, during the RAF Staff College's annual visits there. At the first night Reception, we all look pretty much identically kitted in our new Stone-coloured No 6s. However, on the next morning as we show up for the day's lectures etc, the full panoply of KD shades available at the time, from ivory to yellow, depending on place of origin, is on display. Uniformity, indeed!
Edited to add: It wasn't just the different colours, but different kit - Bush Jackets, shirts with long or short sleeves, different weave patterns in the cloth and, no doubt, the odd Stable Belt thrown in just to add to the variety to the whole.
Last edited by ICM; 18th Jun 2013 at 09:21. Reason: To complete the picture!
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On posting to RAF Sharjah in 1963 all my KD was dated 1947 or earlier. I also received a pair of sandals which were worn with socks in the winter and without socks in the summer; also a pair of sunglasses with NHS-style frames. The ridiculous thing was that we had to take ALL our kit (including greatcoat) to Sharjah. It was stored on station and returned to us on tourex.
And in response to an earlier question - yes, everybody from Air Rank down wore shorts during the daytime in the Persian Gulf, Cyprus, Malta, Gibraltar, El Adem.
And in response to an earlier question - yes, everybody from Air Rank down wore shorts during the daytime in the Persian Gulf, Cyprus, Malta, Gibraltar, El Adem.
Milo,
I echo 500N's comments. if a contract was awarded, why were the companies not paid?
On a separate issue (and I've asked elsewhere) if anyone has a set of No 6s and a Tropical Mess jacket that they wish to part with, (44 inch chest 34-36 inch waist) let me know. I am in the market for a second lot and can't afford the ludicrous prices that are proffered for a new set.
NZWP
I echo 500N's comments. if a contract was awarded, why were the companies not paid?
On a separate issue (and I've asked elsewhere) if anyone has a set of No 6s and a Tropical Mess jacket that they wish to part with, (44 inch chest 34-36 inch waist) let me know. I am in the market for a second lot and can't afford the ludicrous prices that are proffered for a new set.
NZWP