Decompression....
Thread Starter
Decompression....
The Army has decreed it necessary that ALL personnel coming back from Afgan are to complete decompression at RAF Akrotiri.
I completely agree that formed units who have been under severe stress for months on patrols, watching comrades die, operating in FOBs and seeing the full horrors of Afgan first hand need to do it.
However, this one seems an "army catchall' and personnel living in relative comfort at Kandahar/Kabul etc, doing office jobs or not on the front line will find themselves often as individuals caught up in a lot of 'venting' at the decompression.
This will also be another two days travel time, add stress and inconvenience to an awful journey home from theatre which already takes 2-3 days.
Yet another thing that we have to put up with just to try and do a job we are ordered to in Afgan.
I completely agree that formed units who have been under severe stress for months on patrols, watching comrades die, operating in FOBs and seeing the full horrors of Afgan first hand need to do it.
However, this one seems an "army catchall' and personnel living in relative comfort at Kandahar/Kabul etc, doing office jobs or not on the front line will find themselves often as individuals caught up in a lot of 'venting' at the decompression.
This will also be another two days travel time, add stress and inconvenience to an awful journey home from theatre which already takes 2-3 days.
Yet another thing that we have to put up with just to try and do a job we are ordered to in Afgan.
Their is a difference between front line and rear ech troops, however everyone will need to do some sort of "de-stress" before returning home wether you spent all day in camp its still has some effect. Duty of Care?
Thread Starter
There is a huge difference between front line and support branches. From my 8 years of doing Ops in Iraq and afgan, i've never decompressed and haven't had any problems in not doing so.
I've been lucky and not seen the full horrors of this war; I live in relative comfort, eat reasonably well and maintain good contact with friends and family back home. I am not stressed at all, and apart from the normal minor gripes, am fairly content on Ops.
There are many procedures in place that already cover 'duty of care' and decompression for non front line isn't the way forward.
From the reports of what happens on decompression, I am fearing that I will need decompressing after decompression!!!!!
I've been lucky and not seen the full horrors of this war; I live in relative comfort, eat reasonably well and maintain good contact with friends and family back home. I am not stressed at all, and apart from the normal minor gripes, am fairly content on Ops.
There are many procedures in place that already cover 'duty of care' and decompression for non front line isn't the way forward.
From the reports of what happens on decompression, I am fearing that I will need decompressing after decompression!!!!!
Off Hot
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Joined this weekend and this is your first post? Whether it is old news to you is fairly irrelevant, it may not be to others and it has certainly changed since I was made to decompress as it was just formed units then. If it now really means all troops, then this is army beurocracy gone mad. It was a total waste of time and effort when my formed unit did it.
Seems the army top brass have lost any vestige of common sense.
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Originally Posted by Off Hot
This is old news...
Seems the army top brass have lost any vestige of common sense.
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How do you differentiate. What about the techies cleaning up the gore after an IRT shout, or the fireman dealing with the severely injured and bodies at HLS Nigtingale? it would be too hard to police. Its not that bad when do it, and the staff try to make it as comfortable as possible. Accommodations okay and the food is quite good.
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Presumeably this has more to do with heading off future litigation than applying common sense.
@Timex. It's fair to say the pool of those needing it is broader than just formed units, but the thought of everyone having to do it is laughable. The most stressful thing about KAIA is the speed limit, closely followed by the pizza queue and the $/Euro exchange rate applied in the PX.
@Timex. It's fair to say the pool of those needing it is broader than just formed units, but the thought of everyone having to do it is laughable. The most stressful thing about KAIA is the speed limit, closely followed by the pizza queue and the $/Euro exchange rate applied in the PX.
Its annoying but I can see the logic behind it - I recall finding it pretty weird going from BAS to Brize in the space of 9 hours and then straight on leave. A short stop would have helped me get my head reacclimatised and helped me 'reset' ahead of getting back.
But that said, when I came back from HERRICK I felt glad I wasnt jumping off at AKT, and glad to be heading home.
I don't think we'll ever get the balance quite right.
But that said, when I came back from HERRICK I felt glad I wasnt jumping off at AKT, and glad to be heading home.
I don't think we'll ever get the balance quite right.
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When I have a 'Gozomee head' on, all I wish to do is get on a jet at BAS and get into a car (ideally driven by DCoS) at BZN and go home. There is enough support from friends, family, curry house and pub to complete a full reset. I appreciate though that not everybody has that luxury and the differences exist between service, task completed, and age of individual.
That said; it should be a single service procedure rather then an ARMY Rule OK mandate. The Army already bully certain members of the RAF by mandating that they can complete RAF PDT but must also complete Army PDT (OpTag) in addition, prior to deployment. Somebody in the RAF Chain of Command needs to put the senior members of the Army fraternity back in their box, especially in regard to joint units.
Youngsters on tour have their needs, which can be quite different from mature members of the armed forces. This is like the walking-out rules in NI being written for the benefit of three pissed paras in a Ford Fiesta.
That said; it should be a single service procedure rather then an ARMY Rule OK mandate. The Army already bully certain members of the RAF by mandating that they can complete RAF PDT but must also complete Army PDT (OpTag) in addition, prior to deployment. Somebody in the RAF Chain of Command needs to put the senior members of the Army fraternity back in their box, especially in regard to joint units.
Youngsters on tour have their needs, which can be quite different from mature members of the armed forces. This is like the walking-out rules in NI being written for the benefit of three pissed paras in a Ford Fiesta.
Having had one of "my" guys commit suicide, partly because of what he saw on Telic, partly because of the crap state of affairs for NFU guys and for a whole heap of other stuff, then anything that the system can do to help NFU guys gets my vote. And that's exactly what I told the SI!
Originally Posted by whohenwhy
Having had one of "my" guys commit suicide, partly because of what he saw on Telic, partly because of the crap state of affairs for NFU guys and for a whole heap of other stuff, then anything that the system can do to help NFU guys gets my vote. And that's exactly what I told the SI!
Surely we ought to be able to trust our officer and NCO cadre to identify anyone who may need help, with the assistance of trained medical staff.
Personally, I think I'd be under more stress cooped up at Akronelli on the way home wondering whether the creaking old antique allocated to the AKT-BZN sector would get me back within at least a day or two of the planned arrival date.....
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I am with PTC REMF on this one - it is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. There will be some (many?) from FUs who have been through tough times but would cope perfectly well without decompression but it would be nigh impossible to differentiate. Against this background, allowing a separate approach from the different Services could create extra stresses, such as to the soldier who has to go through he process while watching others excused. In the circumstances it is not unreasonable (although not popular, and I say that as one who is as vulnerable to it as anybody else) to just get on with it and plan for the arrival day at BZN accordingly. In any case, the rules are unlikely to change and "fighting the white" is potentially more stressful than relaxing and enjoying....
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and it seems to me that most people who slag decompression in Akrotiri have never actually had any experience of it.
Fair enough to bitch and moan if having done it you found it irrelevant or lacking, but if not, there is little evidence to back up an opinion of it?
Bit like some jet jock moaning to me about having to go to the Falklands. "Oh, how many dets have you done?" I asked, "Oh none" he said, "but I bet it's rubbish!" was the reply. Which it probably was for him becaus he'd made his mind up he was going to have a sh*t time. Personally, I found the mixture of history, wildlife, flying, gym, social and other stuff which can't be mentioned here all rather appealing.
Never got on with the spicy though, try as I did...
Fair enough to bitch and moan if having done it you found it irrelevant or lacking, but if not, there is little evidence to back up an opinion of it?
Bit like some jet jock moaning to me about having to go to the Falklands. "Oh, how many dets have you done?" I asked, "Oh none" he said, "but I bet it's rubbish!" was the reply. Which it probably was for him becaus he'd made his mind up he was going to have a sh*t time. Personally, I found the mixture of history, wildlife, flying, gym, social and other stuff which can't be mentioned here all rather appealing.
Never got on with the spicy though, try as I did...
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When we did decompression on return from herrick 13, even though wed only been rocketed a few times and not gone through anything the front line guys do it was a good way to chill out, have a laugh with your mates over a few beers without thinking about whats going on around you. The staff there are excellent in helping you have a good time and the CSE shows are excellent!
Overall i spent 2 nights there and would definetly give it a 9 almost 10 out of 10!
Overall i spent 2 nights there and would definetly give it a 9 almost 10 out of 10!
Thread Starter
I think most people have a point on here, with various experiences both on Det and also of RSOI. But my original post was to show that there is little flexibility and greater responsibility should rest with Sqn/Regt bosses to decide whether guys need it.
I am out here 3-4 times a year for 6-8 weeks. With the catchall of RSOI ( which sadly has little relevance to the job I do) and now the decompression, they add at least another week to a relatively short det. All in all, it means another 4 weeks away a year, carrying out catchall, arse covering policies when in my very humble opinion, I don't need to do.
Before I get shouted at; I do at least 7 days pre det training, which covers all the good stuff of weapons/mines/100m shoot etc. But on top, we now have to do the RSOI which is aimed at a more 'fresh' recruit. We were told how to open bottles of water, how to set up PT in Fobs, how to wipe our backsides - the list goes on!! All of which had no relevance to my job, or life in Kandahar/Kabul on a main base.
When I return from det, I have a debrief with my Flt Cdr, there is Trim, and we have immense support in Kandahar should we witness anything, feel pressure, have concerns.
This isn't just what some RAF guys think. Having spoken with an Army Colonel, he was also extremely skeptical of the decom; he witnessed many things on his last one, which I wont list on here, but were horrific in nature. On paper, decom is a great idea, BUT for the guys that need it.
All in all, I just think that a greater flexibility would be better suited to both RSOI and Decom to meet the needs of individual units, than a catchall and arse covering exercise, which could be sorted out at unit level.
I am out here 3-4 times a year for 6-8 weeks. With the catchall of RSOI ( which sadly has little relevance to the job I do) and now the decompression, they add at least another week to a relatively short det. All in all, it means another 4 weeks away a year, carrying out catchall, arse covering policies when in my very humble opinion, I don't need to do.
Before I get shouted at; I do at least 7 days pre det training, which covers all the good stuff of weapons/mines/100m shoot etc. But on top, we now have to do the RSOI which is aimed at a more 'fresh' recruit. We were told how to open bottles of water, how to set up PT in Fobs, how to wipe our backsides - the list goes on!! All of which had no relevance to my job, or life in Kandahar/Kabul on a main base.
When I return from det, I have a debrief with my Flt Cdr, there is Trim, and we have immense support in Kandahar should we witness anything, feel pressure, have concerns.
This isn't just what some RAF guys think. Having spoken with an Army Colonel, he was also extremely skeptical of the decom; he witnessed many things on his last one, which I wont list on here, but were horrific in nature. On paper, decom is a great idea, BUT for the guys that need it.
All in all, I just think that a greater flexibility would be better suited to both RSOI and Decom to meet the needs of individual units, than a catchall and arse covering exercise, which could be sorted out at unit level.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
little flexibility and greater responsibility should rest with Sqn/Regt bosses to decide whether guys need it
"Why me boss?" etc
I had the chance of returning a couple of days early from a 6-month det - no leave, no phones. My boss wanted to hang on to me until my time was up but I managed to escape.
I would not have been a happy bunny if I had had to stop off enroute for a day or so. As it happens it would probably have been better for me had I stopped off and managed to slow down from the work tempo before I got home.
Same with Miss PN. She was on motor mouth for a few days and a couple of days enforced rest may well have helped her too.
Last edited by Pontius Navigator; 26th Apr 2011 at 08:39.
3 Bladed Beast - having doen some time at KAF, there are lawful ways and means of avoiding RSOI - a sensible chat with OC RSOI (or whtever the post has morphed into) should see sense prevail...mind you, you are dealing with the Army.