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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Old 21st May 2014, 22:48
  #4481 (permalink)  
 
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Jeez, Spaz, sometimes you post material way faster than anyone can deal with it. Do you ever go out? Great info, but find a pub one evening.
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Old 21st May 2014, 23:33
  #4482 (permalink)  
 
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By inference is the MB seat in the F-35 better? Or is that an ejection too far.

Congressional Panel Warns Aging Ejection Seats Could Kill Pilots - Forbes
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Old 22nd May 2014, 00:46
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I've been at Eglin and seen a late block GE powered F-16 take-off in full burner closely followed by an F-35A...OMG! Not only was the F-35 considerably louder, but it's a much higher 'tearing' pitch compared to the deeper F-16 'rumble'.


At Amberley in Oz the transition from the F-111 (very deep rumble sound) to the (much louder and higher pitched) Super Hornet required an intense EIS and considerable engagement with the local community at Ipswich, and some amendments to the flight paths around the base. Fortunately, the Ipswich mayor and the town's folk are generally very supportive of the RAAF base and the economic benefits it brings to the community.
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Old 22nd May 2014, 04:47
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The RAAF and other users intend to mitigate noise by doing as few A/B takeoffs as possible with the F-35. Meanwhile I found this pub....

AS Journal 14 / SPRING: F135 PROPULSION SYSTEM LIVE FIRE TEST (LFT)

http://jaspo.csd.disa.mil/images/arc...014_spring.pdf (1.5Mb)

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Old 22nd May 2014, 08:33
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The Honourable Member for East Sussex would like to thank the Honourable Member from Australia in respect of the excellent info-graphic posted @ #4478. One has now been able to reassure ones domestic staff here at Coffman Towers that there is no need for Ear Defenders to be worn when putting out the Recycling and Refuse Bins to the main gate each week.

Those kind Euro Bureaucrats have rated my Brown Recycling Bin at 89dB



Coff.
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Old 22nd May 2014, 10:42
  #4486 (permalink)  
 
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Wink

I am impressed that the F35 has demonstrated the advances in aircraft electrical design with the current round of survivability testing.

Indeed the airframe is a game changer for the entire aviation industry, one that can only lead to more efficiency now that the use of electrical protection devices can bypassed.

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Old 22nd May 2014, 10:55
  #4487 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by CoffmanStarter
...Those kind Euro Bureaucrats have rated my Brown Recycling Bin at 89dB
That's not very 'green'. What's the rating when it's moving?
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Old 22nd May 2014, 11:26
  #4488 (permalink)  
 
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Aces 5 was being offered as a substitute seat for the F-35 a couple of years ago, when the F-35 seat was in trouble and LM, MB and VSI (the helmet people) were alternately blaming one another and the customer.
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Old 22nd May 2014, 11:40
  #4489 (permalink)  
 
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FODPlod ...

My Brown Recycling Bin would appear to be a Mk3 (2013) "Stealth" variant as the Grey Landfill Bin is a Mk2 (2010) rated at 99dB ... perhaps a bit of NATO standardisation is required here ...
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Old 22nd May 2014, 12:42
  #4490 (permalink)  
 
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Spaz:
Thanks for the links to the EIS.
To give you an idea of how much of a clusterhump I think that the F-35 program has been, our conservative estimate on the EIS initial was 2005-2006, with a final in 2009-2010. I seem to recall that a risk factor in all this was the BRAC rounds going on in the early 00's.

This Final EIS looks to me to be five years late ... standard acquisition / ops / integration FUBAR that makes me intensely glad I am not on that ing hamsterwheel anymore.
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Old 22nd May 2014, 15:08
  #4491 (permalink)  
 
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At the Navy League Sea-Air-Space Expo earlier this year, Dan Ratcliff, program manager of aircrew systems for Naval Air Systems Command, stated that the F-35C SPL is 152db, higher than the figures in the charts that show numbers for the F-35A.

Numbers in an EIS don't directly translate to the flight deck environment. Measurements around an air station are taken from areas (neighborhoods) most likely to be affected by noise, i.e. approach and departure ends of the runways, and underlying the patterns. whereas flight deck / on-field measurements for personnel safety are taken quite a bit closer to the aircraft.

Last edited by Maus92; 22nd May 2014 at 15:31.
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Old 22nd May 2014, 15:19
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Sad for ACES 5 that it was not an alternate seat for the F-35 - good news but that it may be resurrected as described earlier for those seat upgrades for older aircraft with their cumbersome if not lethal during high speed ejection helmets with addons.

And whatever the full burner noise is it likely will be less on the catapult (when people are nearby) when at something like 122% power. See: http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ml#post8486246
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Old 22nd May 2014, 17:06
  #4493 (permalink)  
 
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Pax River Ski Jump Survey

Pax ski jump readied for future F-35B Lightning II launches 22 May 2014 Sarah Ehman

Pax ski jump readied for future F-35B Lightning II launches -- DCMilitary.com
"...The Pax River ITF partnered with ATR’s Geomatics and Metrology team to perform a high fidelity survey of the shore-based ski jump at Naval Air Station Patuxent River’s center airfield. The survey is a prerequisite to future F-35B flight testing by the Pax River ITF, the United Kingdom and Italy....

...said Bob Nantz, the Pax River F-35 ITF external environment and performance lead. “The significance of the Pax ski-jump shape is connected to aircraft loads and performance modeling. Ideally, the loads will never limit the launch weight or speed, thus allowing the maximum performance benefit.”...

...Hancock noted that the team achieved readings accurate to within one millimeter — approximately the thickness of a credit card.

“The razor-sharp accuracy of the Geomatics team’s survey is a key part of the process leading to future ski-jump operations at sea,” Nantz said."
http://www.dcmilitary.com/storyimage...-140529960.jpg
"U.S. Navy photo/Jennifer Amber The Atlantic Test Ranges Geomatics and Metrology team, from left, Fred Hancock, Sung Han and Warren Kerr survey the ski jump ramp that was assembled at Naval Air Station Patuxent River in 2009 to document potential deviations from the original design plan."

Last edited by SpazSinbad; 22nd May 2014 at 17:18. Reason: Photo/Caption
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Old 26th May 2014, 19:43
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No vertical landings planned yet in the UK visit:

Why Can?t America?s Newest Stealth Jet Land Like It?s Supposed To? - The Daily Beast

Matters less than it might if the Marines are correct in predicting that one operation in ten will be a VL: they may not be planning even to match the "one off-main-base action per major war" standard that they set in four decades of the Harrier. But... Guadalcanal, I suppose. It only cost $21 billion or so.
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Old 26th May 2014, 20:34
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Somewhere wayback on this thread there is a LONG series of posts about the concrete/asphalt issues with the pizza oven effect so I'll not repeat that whilst this news makes the DAILY BEAST old news eh.

Page 219 of this thread on 12 - 13 May 2014 here is some old news:

F-35B 700 VLs already by April 2014: http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ml#post8469783

News about no VL in UK: http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ml#post8475765

'Creeping' VLs as opposed to 'runny landings of some kind' is somewhere on this thread but anyway...

“...BF-1 accomplished the first F-35 five Creeping Vertical Landings (CVLs) on August 23 [2012]....” F-35 Lightning II Program Status and Fast Facts September 5, 2012

f-35.ca - f-35 Resources and Information. This website is for sale! I see this website is Kaput so here is a graphic of that part of that PDF.


Last edited by SpazSinbad; 26th May 2014 at 20:50. Reason: ad grafik
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Old 26th May 2014, 21:35
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Posting old and mostly irrelevant stuff may impress the teenyboppers elsewhere.

The question is when anyone plans to demonstrate sustained STOVL/STOSL passes on the kind of surface likely to be found at the site of a forward operating location. Since that (in the US) is half the justification for the B, it would seem to be relevant.
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Old 26th May 2014, 22:12
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If we get a sqn of F35, will we be doing engine ground runs late on a night shift? Or will there be a curfew? It could make trying to generate sufficient serviceable aircraft for the next morning interesting. By the way, parking a jet in front of a tube with a 90 degree bend in it, doesn't make all the noise magically disappear.
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Old 26th May 2014, 22:50
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'LO' said: "...The question is when anyone plans to demonstrate sustained STOVL/STOSL passes on the kind of surface likely to be found at the site of a forward operating location...."

QOT from that BEASTly site:
"...Rolling or creeping vertical landings can spread the heat load over a greater area. But there is no sign that they have been tested on concrete, asphalt, or AM-2 over asphalt...."
Signs given above bro LO.

Being a reader and NOT A REPORTER my ability to discover information is limited. I like the BEATLES reference on the BEASTIE BOY site though. 'LO' said: "Posting old and mostly irrelevant stuff may impress the teenyboppers elsewhere...." I guess the young ones are impressed by the white bearded Bill Sweetman up to the minute music references eh.

http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ml#post8469783
"...began crosswind landings and expeditionary operations....”
April Marks New F-35 Flying Records · Lockheed Martin

I wonder if youse Brits will be treated to the F-35B TWERKING at YOUSE in Hover Flight?

TWERK DEMO:

3 Bearing Swivel Duct Vector Capability:
Pitch Angle - Axial to 95 degrees
YAW Angle - +/- 13 degrees
Lift Fan Vectoring - -5 degrees Forward & -42 degrees Aft

http://4.bp.blagspot.com/-ABF2yIXwyt...hangeTimes.jpg [change 'a' for 'o' in 'blagspot']


Last edited by SpazSinbad; 26th May 2014 at 23:01. Reason: ad grfx + Utube Vid Twerky
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Old 26th May 2014, 23:07
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Well someones taken the bait....
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Old 27th May 2014, 01:45
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Creeping VLs have been tested at Pax, on the AM-2-over-concrete pad. Not what you are likely to find on a 3000-foot runway in Filthistan.
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