Lightning Down At FAOB
I was asked to fly a Jet Provost newly imported into the US, and flew a few qualification flights in it. When it became clear that the owner was not going to follow the full Service maintenance schedule, I walked away. Glad I did.
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That is a pretty damning report, no wonder they closed their doors soon after, the poor guy had all the cards stacked against him 
I am suprised that no one appears to have ended up in court.
.
I am suprised that no one appears to have ended up in court.
.
Last edited by NutLoose; 24th Aug 2012 at 18:02.
More bang for your buck
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No wonder they decided to close the company down, they couldn't possibly have carried on with that record even if they were allowed to which I doubt.
As Daysleeper said: Well that makes pretty depressing reading.
As Daysleeper said: Well that makes pretty depressing reading.
When one leaves the RAF and climbs into a ex-mil jet, there is (certainly in mine and Thunder City's cases) the option of ignoring a large number of RAF procedures. After pouring over the Aircraft maint logs (which I'd never seen in the RAF), one realises that 98% of that annoying nausea is in fact very important.
I made it my business to know the Service record, life expiry and servicing schedule of every major component on my civvy mil jet. I also insisted on knowing the background and quals of every guy working on it.
And when the "delayed till next scheduled maintenance" plus "requested extension on scheduled maintenance" game started, I left.
I made it my business to know the Service record, life expiry and servicing schedule of every major component on my civvy mil jet. I also insisted on knowing the background and quals of every guy working on it.
And when the "delayed till next scheduled maintenance" plus "requested extension on scheduled maintenance" game started, I left.
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Thinking just how close I was to booking a flight with them, this leaves me chilled to the bone.......
From Thunder City's website (which has not been updated for a couple of years)
Thunder City
These amazing jets are meticulously maintained by former air force engineers and always flown well within their performance limitations. Even so we do not take safety for granted. Therefore you will be trained to safely use the aircraft’s emergency systems such as the ejection seat, emergency oxygen etc.
Last edited by Tableview; 24th Aug 2012 at 19:20. Reason: Must have been $9000, not 900!
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I do wonder how the passengers signing a waiver would stand up in court, as they were signed under the belief the aircraft were legal, Servicable and correctly maintained.
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Sad tale indeed.
One thing that does strike home is the culture that seemingly spread downwards through the company.
I don't see how they could just ignore the quite damming audits. Really who in their right mind would, unless it was all about the [lack of] money?
One thing that does strike home is the culture that seemingly spread downwards through the company.
I don't see how they could just ignore the quite damming audits. Really who in their right mind would, unless it was all about the [lack of] money?
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The report states that the passenger should have been issued with a ticket. I suspect that the absence of that, which is a contract outlining legal liabilities and limitations, would, in the event of an accident, have placed the company (and not the pilot, for it is not his responsibility) in a very tenuous situation.
I am somewhat surprised to hear how bad things were at Thunder City as I have been there several times and know someone who was involved in its PR side. I had always held Mike Beachy Head in high regard. No longer. I hope he faces criminal charges.
Quote from guess who ............
I am somewhat surprised to hear how bad things were at Thunder City as I have been there several times and know someone who was involved in its PR side. I had always held Mike Beachy Head in high regard. No longer. I hope he faces criminal charges.
Quote from guess who ............
Flying this fleet of seasoned fighters is one thing; keeping them going is another. Some of them are nearly 50 years old and just to keep the Lightning in the air for 40 minutes takes about 55 man hours of maintenance and preparation.
'Every little tiny thing, if it is not done right, becomes a weak link in the chain. If you cock up in business, you lose a bit of money and at worst it goes bust. If we cock up, you die,' says Mike.
'Every little tiny thing, if it is not done right, becomes a weak link in the chain. If you cock up in business, you lose a bit of money and at worst it goes bust. If we cock up, you die,' says Mike.
Last edited by Tableview; 24th Aug 2012 at 19:51.
Originally Posted by NutLoose
the poor guy had all the cards stacked against him
As for TC's maintainance proceedures
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The report and some of your informed comments in other countries have put paid
to my idea of going for a fly in one of the ex mil jets here in Aust.
to my idea of going for a fly in one of the ex mil jets here in Aust.
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Damning indeed, especially to someone as unmechanical as me. Bl**dy terrifying actually, esp. as I'd promised myself a go at some point, and delighted that one of my friends who did go (and absolutely loved it) was lucky.
Could any of the Brunty LPG guys comment? Are they intending to take on the remaining ex-TC Lightnings?
S41
Could any of the Brunty LPG guys comment? Are they intending to take on the remaining ex-TC Lightnings?
S41
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But that could never happen over here, could it?
Our main operator of a Complex former military aircraft is constantly reminding us of how their aircraft is operated by former RAF personnel and how safety is always at the forefronts of their mind.
...and surely their failure to adhere to RAF procedures, and then introduce a system of intentionally introducing FOD into the intakes of that aircraft, against all wisdom and practices of 30 years of RAF service, with no safeguards to remove it therefore resulting in the destruction of two priceless Olympus engines was nothing more than a mistake that anyone could have made.....
One day....
Our main operator of a Complex former military aircraft is constantly reminding us of how their aircraft is operated by former RAF personnel and how safety is always at the forefronts of their mind.
...and surely their failure to adhere to RAF procedures, and then introduce a system of intentionally introducing FOD into the intakes of that aircraft, against all wisdom and practices of 30 years of RAF service, with no safeguards to remove it therefore resulting in the destruction of two priceless Olympus engines was nothing more than a mistake that anyone could have made.....
One day....
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I too thought if you are concerned about engine corrosion issues, especially with steel turbine discs then put the Silica in the Exhaust where it isn't going to go through an engine and have a foolproof system in place to remove it, what suprised me even more bearing in mind they are now down to I believe 1 spare engine and the above corrosion concerns to see it doing low passes over the salt ladened sea near cliffs in a high bird environment..
But to compare the Vulcan operation to that report and the Thunder City operation seems to be miles apart in real life, especially as the Vulcan still has full manufacturers support.
But to compare the Vulcan operation to that report and the Thunder City operation seems to be miles apart in real life, especially as the Vulcan still has full manufacturers support.
Last edited by NutLoose; 24th Aug 2012 at 22:08.
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But to compare the Vulcan operation to that report and the Thunder City operation seems to be miles apart in real life, especially as the Vulcan still has full manufacturers support.
As it goes, apparently, the were concerned with the corrosion in the HP and LP compressor casings as opposed to the turbines, and therefore, I'm as surprised as you are as to their chosen path to deal with that. They are also down to a supply of NO further certified engines now, there are no spares.
Perhaps in light of this, as harsh as it may seem, it might be a good time to look over the proceedures and practices of all former military aircraft operators.
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In the Uk I would say 99% of all operators of ex warbirds in the Uk are rigorous in their attitude and working practices, I know there have been a few issues, but the CAA seem to work to a higher standard than most... Hence no Lightnings flying here.
The trouble is no matter what the rules, you will always get the good, the bad and the damn right ugly, the problem is recognising the ugly and dealing with it, unfortunately you often find they are very good at throwing up smoke screens.
The trouble is no matter what the rules, you will always get the good, the bad and the damn right ugly, the problem is recognising the ugly and dealing with it, unfortunately you often find they are very good at throwing up smoke screens.