Pay Rise on 1st April 09?
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Up North
Posts: 801
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Statement made in Parliament at the end of 2008:
Armed Forces: Pay Review Body
Statement
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Defence (Baroness Taylor of Bolton): My right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Defence (John Hutton) has made the following Written Ministerial Statement.
I am pleased to announce that I have appointed John Steele, Mary Carter and the Very Reverend Graham Forbes as members of the Armed Forces Pay Review Body, each for a three-year term of office commencing on 1 March 2009. These appointments have been conducted in accordance with the guidance of the Office of the Commissioner for Public Appointments.
Maybe this explains any delay - three new members.
Maybe there's lots of arguing going on!
I hate the RAF and I'm going to PVR....oops did that ages ago!
I've still got my OxPat shoes (over 10 years out of that pair!), no-one's filled them to my knowledge.
Armed Forces: Pay Review Body
Statement
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Defence (Baroness Taylor of Bolton): My right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Defence (John Hutton) has made the following Written Ministerial Statement.
I am pleased to announce that I have appointed John Steele, Mary Carter and the Very Reverend Graham Forbes as members of the Armed Forces Pay Review Body, each for a three-year term of office commencing on 1 March 2009. These appointments have been conducted in accordance with the guidance of the Office of the Commissioner for Public Appointments.
Maybe this explains any delay - three new members.
Maybe there's lots of arguing going on!
I hate the RAF and I'm going to PVR....oops did that ages ago!
I've still got my OxPat shoes (over 10 years out of that pair!), no-one's filled them to my knowledge.
More Dosh.
As much as I'd like a payrise and firmly believe that I'm worth every penny (and then a bit more), the simple fact of the matter is that it should be spent on operational allowances.
There are limits to how much the salary of your average squaddie can be increased (everyone above would need more money to maintain the status quo and there just isn't the cash).
The fact remains though, that your average squaddie (before anyone gets on their high horse, I'm using the term generically, I know there are lots of other people who spend alot of time OOA) who spends alot of time in dusty sh1tholes getting shot at deserves a little more financial recompense than they currently receive.
Increase the operational allowances and you target those most deserving of more cash.
Simple.
BV
There are limits to how much the salary of your average squaddie can be increased (everyone above would need more money to maintain the status quo and there just isn't the cash).
The fact remains though, that your average squaddie (before anyone gets on their high horse, I'm using the term generically, I know there are lots of other people who spend alot of time OOA) who spends alot of time in dusty sh1tholes getting shot at deserves a little more financial recompense than they currently receive.
Increase the operational allowances and you target those most deserving of more cash.
Simple.
BV
Jess ....
".........each for a three-year term of office commencing on 1 March 2009...... "
indicates they started working 12 days ago .. and you want an answer now ??
".... Maybe this explains any delay - three new members.
Maybe there's lots of arguing going on! ..... "
Methinks you have found the members of NEXT years board ???
".........each for a three-year term of office commencing on 1 March 2009...... "
indicates they started working 12 days ago .. and you want an answer now ??
".... Maybe this explains any delay - three new members.
Maybe there's lots of arguing going on! ..... "
Methinks you have found the members of NEXT years board ???
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 734
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As much as I'd like a payrise and firmly believe that I'm worth every penny (and then a bit more), the simple fact of the matter is that it should be spent on operational allowances.
There are limits to how much the salary of your average squaddie can be increased (everyone above would need more money to maintain the status quo and there just isn't the cash).
The fact remains though, that your average squaddie (before anyone gets on their high horse, I'm using the term generically, I know there are lots of other people who spend alot of time OOA) who spends alot of time in dusty sh1tholes getting shot at deserves a little more financial recompense than they currently receive.
Increase the operational allowances and you target those most deserving of more cash.
Simple.
BV
There are limits to how much the salary of your average squaddie can be increased (everyone above would need more money to maintain the status quo and there just isn't the cash).
The fact remains though, that your average squaddie (before anyone gets on their high horse, I'm using the term generically, I know there are lots of other people who spend alot of time OOA) who spends alot of time in dusty sh1tholes getting shot at deserves a little more financial recompense than they currently receive.
Increase the operational allowances and you target those most deserving of more cash.
Simple.
BV
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: On the edge of reality.
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have heard a rumor of 26 March for the announcement.
I have also heard the FRI is being closely looked at in the current options round. FRIs have never been popular with the Treasury and they can cite increasing recruitment and retention as a rationale to drop them.
Notwithstanding this, the military pay award has been below the RPI for more than 10 years. What does this mean? Every year our standard of living has been dropping, especially in the context of above-inflation increases in energyl, council tax, housing and food. We become largely blind to this because we receive increases in the form of increments, promotion and AFPRB awards. You need to compare the purchasing power of your rank ten years ago to that of today.
So What? Every year a career in the military less and less attractive, whilst we continue to be asked to do more and more - egged on by FRI, Op allowance, LSA et al. FRIs and Op Allowances, whilst pleasant, are just sticking plasters. The bottom line is the military salary is woefully below where it should be.
Also, I wouldn't retire before 2020 if you want a decent pension. Quantitive easing will cause circa double digit inflation for a significant period commencing in the next 5 years. You are quids in if you have a mortgage though - look to those long-term fixed rate deals.
I don't hate the RAF/Army/Navy-I want to stay in. But I do wish to be fairly recompensed for what I do and I don't think we are at the moment. Should we be expected to work for peanuts because we enjoy what we do?
If there was a PPRUNE in the seventies I expect exactly the same argument would have been raised in 1978/9. It wasn't until the double digit forces pay-rises of the early 80s that the military got back to a living wage.
Nothing will change whilst the current neo-socialist regime is in power, but I suspect on the now-inevitable change in government there is unfortunately nothing left in the pot for us, except a convenient location to urinate in.
Also, how many of you have been given reassurance or an explanation by chains of command as to the delay in announcing the pay award?
Rant over,
I have also heard the FRI is being closely looked at in the current options round. FRIs have never been popular with the Treasury and they can cite increasing recruitment and retention as a rationale to drop them.
Notwithstanding this, the military pay award has been below the RPI for more than 10 years. What does this mean? Every year our standard of living has been dropping, especially in the context of above-inflation increases in energyl, council tax, housing and food. We become largely blind to this because we receive increases in the form of increments, promotion and AFPRB awards. You need to compare the purchasing power of your rank ten years ago to that of today.
So What? Every year a career in the military less and less attractive, whilst we continue to be asked to do more and more - egged on by FRI, Op allowance, LSA et al. FRIs and Op Allowances, whilst pleasant, are just sticking plasters. The bottom line is the military salary is woefully below where it should be.
Also, I wouldn't retire before 2020 if you want a decent pension. Quantitive easing will cause circa double digit inflation for a significant period commencing in the next 5 years. You are quids in if you have a mortgage though - look to those long-term fixed rate deals.
I don't hate the RAF/Army/Navy-I want to stay in. But I do wish to be fairly recompensed for what I do and I don't think we are at the moment. Should we be expected to work for peanuts because we enjoy what we do?
If there was a PPRUNE in the seventies I expect exactly the same argument would have been raised in 1978/9. It wasn't until the double digit forces pay-rises of the early 80s that the military got back to a living wage.
Nothing will change whilst the current neo-socialist regime is in power, but I suspect on the now-inevitable change in government there is unfortunately nothing left in the pot for us, except a convenient location to urinate in.
Also, how many of you have been given reassurance or an explanation by chains of command as to the delay in announcing the pay award?
Rant over,
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The lack of news regarding our pay is yet another example of the government playing politics with a working persons pay.
Surely all personel play a part in getting the military job done and therefore should be rewarded with a pay rise that at least keeps up with inflation over the financial year!!
Rant over....
Surely all personel play a part in getting the military job done and therefore should be rewarded with a pay rise that at least keeps up with inflation over the financial year!!
Rant over....
Whilst I agree that the military should be financially rewarded for the hard times they face on ops etc, I think it would send completely the wrong message to the public who are going through an equally, if not more daunting prospect of mass unemployment and job cuts.
This financial crisis has a long way to go yet and when you compare the markets to the last big crisis (1973/4/5) there are striking similarities. The current rally in stocks is only a bear market rally. The secret to making money in bear markets is to short the rallies. The Dow could see 5000 and the FTSE 2500 before all this is over. There is just too much ugly news to come from company balance sheets. Who'd want to buy shares for a dividend that is very likely to be cut?? No, me neither!
As was mentioned above inflation will rear it's ugly head and your diminishing money supply will buy less and less. We are in a very privileged position of being paid by the taxpayer - as long as those taxes keep coming in.
There is even scope for the BoE going cap-in-hand to the IMF for a loan as the country could default on it's debt (same as when Labour were in last time).
I'm just glad that Gordon Brown's chickens are coming home to roost whilst he's at the tiller -reap what you have sowed Brown!!
So, if we don't get a good rise – just be thankful that we still have a job and money coming in to put food on the table. Just look at your history books – The Great Depression 1930s. This time there is scope for it to be much, much worse as the levels of toxicity in the debt markets are still largely unknown.
This financial crisis has a long way to go yet and when you compare the markets to the last big crisis (1973/4/5) there are striking similarities. The current rally in stocks is only a bear market rally. The secret to making money in bear markets is to short the rallies. The Dow could see 5000 and the FTSE 2500 before all this is over. There is just too much ugly news to come from company balance sheets. Who'd want to buy shares for a dividend that is very likely to be cut?? No, me neither!
As was mentioned above inflation will rear it's ugly head and your diminishing money supply will buy less and less. We are in a very privileged position of being paid by the taxpayer - as long as those taxes keep coming in.
There is even scope for the BoE going cap-in-hand to the IMF for a loan as the country could default on it's debt (same as when Labour were in last time).
I'm just glad that Gordon Brown's chickens are coming home to roost whilst he's at the tiller -reap what you have sowed Brown!!
So, if we don't get a good rise – just be thankful that we still have a job and money coming in to put food on the table. Just look at your history books – The Great Depression 1930s. This time there is scope for it to be much, much worse as the levels of toxicity in the debt markets are still largely unknown.
A couple of points:
Firstly, as I have already said, the next set of inflation figures (Feb 09) are issued on 24 March. They are likely to be very low, with RPI possibly even being negative. A low pay rise for the military, say 1%, announced shortly after low inflation figures, say -1%, will look good to the GENERAL PUBLIC!!
Secondly, and alternatively (grassy knoll theory coming up), the government may play a subtly dufferent game. There is talk that all public sector pay increases will be announced at once. That is A LOT of people (over 1 million in the NHS alone). There is due to be a general election in the next 15 odd months (May 2010 is the latest possible date I believe). So this is the last chance the government will get to create a good impression before the election, in terms of a pay rise at least, of a couple of million voters. Therefore the pay rise might be reasonable???
Firstly, as I have already said, the next set of inflation figures (Feb 09) are issued on 24 March. They are likely to be very low, with RPI possibly even being negative. A low pay rise for the military, say 1%, announced shortly after low inflation figures, say -1%, will look good to the GENERAL PUBLIC!!
Secondly, and alternatively (grassy knoll theory coming up), the government may play a subtly dufferent game. There is talk that all public sector pay increases will be announced at once. That is A LOT of people (over 1 million in the NHS alone). There is due to be a general election in the next 15 odd months (May 2010 is the latest possible date I believe). So this is the last chance the government will get to create a good impression before the election, in terms of a pay rise at least, of a couple of million voters. Therefore the pay rise might be reasonable???
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Swindon
Age: 55
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
AFPRB
I'm interested to see what inflation measurement they will use this year. For the last few years they've been using the CPI because it was lower than the RPI but the last figures I saw published were 3.1% CPI and 0.1% RPI in Feb!
My money is on a 2.5% increase, despite the downturn, as there is a retention issue everywhere due to overstretch which is recognised right at the top - CDS said so on Andrew Marr's show.
I'm hoping my increase in quarter charges are delayed as suggested by a previous thread, too!
Ever the optimist
My money is on a 2.5% increase, despite the downturn, as there is a retention issue everywhere due to overstretch which is recognised right at the top - CDS said so on Andrew Marr's show.
I'm hoping my increase in quarter charges are delayed as suggested by a previous thread, too!
Ever the optimist
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 734
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Biggus
Secondly, and alternatively (grassy knoll theory coming up), the government may play a subtly dufferent game. There is talk that all public sector pay increases will be announced at once. That is A LOT of people (over 1 million in the NHS alone). There is due to be a general election in the next 15 odd months (May 2010 is the latest possible date I believe). So this is the last chance the government will get to create a good impression before the election, in terms of a pay rise at least, of a couple of million voters. Therefore the pay rise might be reasonable???
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 310
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just a thought on inflation:
Is the pay rise designed to compensate for inflationary pressures over the preceding year, or predictively compensate for expected inflationary pressure expected in the comming year?
Either way, we 'should' get a reasonable award, as inflation was high all last year, and as been explained, is expected to be so again!
Just a thought, but realistically, they will probably just use the lowest possible figures that they can justify.
In terms of job security, etc my view is aligned to the poster who mentioned that there is no such consideration for us when the private sector are enjoying better times. A few years ago, service personel were actively discriminated against in getting mortgages, due to their (percieved) circumstances (Moving etc).
Although we may enjoy what we do, and are offered a relatively stable income, this comes at a personal cost of; reduced freedoms, danger (for some) commitment and limited rights. Many of the general public, would neither consider or accept our terms of employment. So simply, why should we 'take one for the team'? The 'team' sure as hell didn't and won't take one for us!!
Advo
Is the pay rise designed to compensate for inflationary pressures over the preceding year, or predictively compensate for expected inflationary pressure expected in the comming year?
Either way, we 'should' get a reasonable award, as inflation was high all last year, and as been explained, is expected to be so again!
Just a thought, but realistically, they will probably just use the lowest possible figures that they can justify.
In terms of job security, etc my view is aligned to the poster who mentioned that there is no such consideration for us when the private sector are enjoying better times. A few years ago, service personel were actively discriminated against in getting mortgages, due to their (percieved) circumstances (Moving etc).
Although we may enjoy what we do, and are offered a relatively stable income, this comes at a personal cost of; reduced freedoms, danger (for some) commitment and limited rights. Many of the general public, would neither consider or accept our terms of employment. So simply, why should we 'take one for the team'? The 'team' sure as hell didn't and won't take one for us!!
Advo
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 734
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not sure what the formula is, but suggest it's a hard and fast rule when it keeps the cost down, and a case of 'unique circumstances call for unique solutions' when we might benefit just a little too much from historical arrangements. That said, pay isn't the thing that's pissing off the forces, and any high award is probably akin to the VAT decision - quick headline, but ultimately wasted money - however, our short-termist government would like to inject cash into the economy, which can be done through banks lending more money, but that doesn't get as many smiles as pay rises.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: hampshire
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You Should Still Be Happy And Content
As this is an aviation forum I thought you might of had the intellect to work out that when we commented on being well paid it was in relation to Aircrew and not the rest of the military. So as stated before BE HAPPY for what you have; an amazing job to be proud of, self respect and worth and a hansome pay packet. If you are not happy then leave and see what the real world brings you!Also guys I have to say that when you consider what the average infantry soldier goes through on operations, for the pay he receives, you might want to stop harking on about FRIs; it is slightly disappointing and as stressed before inappropriate in the current climate. You are bright and choose this job and I am sure that when you stood on parade and were presented your wings that the last thing on your mind was money; just pure pride! (Stand in the mirror and ask yourself what became of that man the next tie you feel hard done by).
SO BE HAPPY
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 310
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thirtymill,
Yes, many years ago, I stood and got my wings, yes, I was full of pride and would probably have done it all for nothing. But, life and reality changes. Now, with wife, kids, a house and mostly rising costs to look at, forgive me, but I have a different view. I don't begrudge any other personel either their lot, or their view, and I truely respect and admire everyone involved in close combat ops....... but,
We ALL deserve to be paid 'relatively' what we were last year. Note I said ALL of us. It's not greedy, unfair or crass to say that.
So, please, ditch the rose tinted specks. Retro-thrust, and return to earth.
Advo
Yes, many years ago, I stood and got my wings, yes, I was full of pride and would probably have done it all for nothing. But, life and reality changes. Now, with wife, kids, a house and mostly rising costs to look at, forgive me, but I have a different view. I don't begrudge any other personel either their lot, or their view, and I truely respect and admire everyone involved in close combat ops....... but,
We ALL deserve to be paid 'relatively' what we were last year. Note I said ALL of us. It's not greedy, unfair or crass to say that.
So, please, ditch the rose tinted specks. Retro-thrust, and return to earth.
Advo