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RAAF Flight Screening Programme

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RAAF Flight Screening Programme

Old 22nd Mar 2018, 09:20
  #3501 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 310
Originally Posted by hansfalkenhagen View Post
C'mon mate. You're a pilot in the RAAF. You have the best wicket in the world.

Most people could only dream of what you do for a living.

If you don't mind me asking, what aircraft are you assigned to?
Yeah, below average pay, moving every 3 years, secondary duties that have zero to do with being a pilot, ground jobs, etc...

The best wicket it aint, don't get me wrong, it's good for a while but you cant do it forever.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 09:26
  #3502 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
I get what your saying, but the civilian alternative isn't much better: 6 figure student debt then off to the outback to do tourist flights on 30k a year is the reality for most.

It's that or you have loaded parents who pay the $150,000 to secure you an airlines cadetship.

If I ever make it as a pilot in the ADF I am sure I will have my gripes, but serving your country has gotta be better than serving Qantas.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 09:27
  #3503 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
but perhaps I am being too optimistic about a career in the ADF
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 10:41
  #3504 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Aus
Age: 28
Posts: 466
Dude, you havenít done it, donít pretend you know more than the people who have.

Like I said, itís the best flying I have or ever will do.

Thatís about the end of it.
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Old 25th Mar 2018, 00:31
  #3505 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 7
Long time reader first time poster
My application has been going on for three years now due to some medical issues (had a knee recon took a year to get cleared). I have sat two assessment days and passed both with flying colours. My last one was November 2017. I received a call two weeks ago from ASP to attend the next available session as someone had dropped it. (Last week of March) Unfortunately i had to say no as i was on holidays in Melbourne at the time. (shame it was so close to East Sale) However i was advised the next ASP was in May and should expect a call in April. All the information on this forum has been so beneficial in getting me into the position i am today. So fingers crossed i get the call for the next ASP.
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Old 27th Mar 2018, 00:22
  #3506 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: NSW
Posts: 1
Originally Posted by tayra View Post
Haha, I got my first job out of high school for being the only one at a group interview not wearing thongs and boardies.

I don't think it's unreasonable for people going through these first ASPs to only want the job they've applied for. I want to be a pilot and an Officer in the RAAF... at the same time. It's going to be different for everyone. If it actually becomes the case that you don't know which job pathway you're on till after OTS then yeah, it seems very likely that some people will jump ship during their IMPS grace period if they dont get what they want. So as it stands, those self-selecting themselves out of contention is good thing. As for the people being bitter after failing, this is likely the first major 'NO' that some of them have received in their lives. Especially because it's almost a personal attack of 'no you as a person do not have the aptitude to do this job'. Whether or not they bounce back and learn from it before having another crack is the main concern.

After some more cyber sleuthing I found those 7 domains that you mentioned. Looks like they've introduced some new names for them whilst the tests remain the same. Hope you did well on the CLAN test if it was covered. It's the most significant (statistical) indicator of IFR performance apparently.

My ASP is coming up in 2 weeks time. Any tips on where to find those 7 domains for ASP practice
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Old 28th Mar 2018, 07:24
  #3507 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 41
In the RAF thread on this very forum!
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Old 28th Mar 2018, 07:59
  #3508 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
Originally Posted by tayra View Post
In the RAF thread on this very forum!
Nice.

I thought it was funny that no one caught on to the fact the images on the joining instructions were copyrighted with "UK MOD". If that wasn't enough of a hint than I don't know what is.

How did you go?
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Old 29th Mar 2018, 07:45
  #3509 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 8
Hey All,

Im wondering if anyone has been given any indication of how long we will wait for an officer selection board now that weíve progressed through the ASP? Also, how much notice do you usually get?

Iíve heard the next intakes for initial officer training for RAAF are July and August and then not until next year.

Itís hard to organise your life when youíre stuck in this waiting game.
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Old 29th Mar 2018, 09:51
  #3510 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
Originally Posted by EttaJames29 View Post
Hey All,

Im wondering if anyone has been given any indication of how long we will wait for an officer selection board now that weíve progressed through the ASP? Also, how much notice do you usually get?

Iíve heard the next intakes for initial officer training for RAAF are July and August and then not until next year.

Itís hard to organise your life when youíre stuck in this waiting game.
What stage are you up to?

You are notified during the ASP as to whether you have passed. 10 business days later you will receive a letter to say whether you will be offered an OSB based on your preferences. After that you wait until Canberra decides to lock in a date for your OSB.

Not everyone will get an offer to attend an OSB, even those who rank very highly with their ASP scores.

I have been told I will have the opportunity to go to a Pilot's OSB but I do not know when it is yet. I may get notified of my OSB date next week, or perhaps it will be months down the track.

My EC emailed me saying:
"Small RAAF intakes are currently scheduled for July & August 2018 and January & February 2019.
Small RAN intakes are currently scheduled for July 2018 & January 2019."

Note the word "Small".

I've got my heart set on the Navy (or Army but they aren't hiring) but have been told that there are only 2 positions for NEOC Navy Pilots this July, and 3 for Jan 2018. If the Navy are only hiring 5 pilots for the next year and my EC refers to a "small" RAN intake, then the RAAF's "small" intake may be similar. I am unsure as to where the "we're crying out for pilots" term comes from.
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Old 29th Mar 2018, 10:09
  #3511 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 8
Hey Hans,

Thatís amazing news - congrats! I passed both pilot and mission at the ASP, but have only received an offer of progression for ACO at this point. Just deciding whether to wait the 12 months and retest or progress with this offer.

I suppose it canít hurt to keep moving with this offer. If it ends up dragging out till next Jan anyway, I can always change my mind and resit ASP.

Just wondering how much notice they usually give you before officer selection boards. Not sure how frantically I should be studying up and visiting bases etc
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Old 29th Mar 2018, 10:40
  #3512 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
EttaJames29,

I was looking over the officer's thread on Ausmilitary. Some people were offered OSB dates (for all roles, not pilot roles) a week or so after their assessment day. Some waited in excess of 6 months before hearing back.

Further to this, many candidates were giving a letter of offer a week or two before their officer training started. For anyone who passes an OSB, make sure you've got you shit in order leading up to June/July.

Also, EttaJames, check you mailbox

Last edited by hansfalkenhagen; 29th Mar 2018 at 10:53.
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Old 30th Mar 2018, 14:35
  #3513 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Oz
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by hansfalkenhagen View Post
I get what your saying, but the civilian alternative isn't much better: 6 figure student debt then off to the outback to do tourist flights on 30k a year is the reality for most.

It's that or you have loaded parents who pay the $150,000 to secure you an airlines cadetship.

If I ever make it as a pilot in the ADF I am sure I will have my gripes, but serving your country has gotta be better than serving Qantas.
Pilots in general like most humans are a fickle bunch. I doubt many RAAF pilots would change joining if they had a time machine. But there comes a time for most where they either want out or get out. The grass is always greener after all.

The money is good depending on if you are on new or old pay scheme. But the locational instability and the effect that has on relationships outside of defence is likely the reason most get out.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 08:17
  #3514 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Perth
Posts: 23
Hey Hans, great info on ASP and thanks. Do you think this website will be helpful for the exams? https ://pilotaptitudetest. com/knowledgebase/royal-air-force/ (remove the space between . and com and s and this is based off the RAF testing which is what I presume we have switched to going off what everyone is saying and a little bit of evidence in their joining instructions.

Not sure how accurate this is but seems like it matches with how many tests there are, 20 for ASP and about 19 on the website. Also Tarya/Hans , what order do you think the 7 domains go for the pilot tests and the 6 for mission elementary?
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 08:43
  #3515 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Perth
Posts: 23
Hans, great insight, I found a website which trains for RAF testing, it's called Pilot Aptitude tests and it has a data base of various defences forces and air lines, which also includes the tests for RAF and RAAF. It also matches with how many tests there will be on the day, which is about 20, and in the RAF data base, there are 19. Also Tarya/Hans, in what order do you think they prioritise the 7 domains for pilot and 6 domains for mission elementary?
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 11:28
  #3516 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 41
If you are referring to https://pilotaptitudetest.com/ then save your money it wont help you (my opinion). There is another similarly named website (pilot aptitude systems) which I believe is a well known scam. If it costs hundreds to thousands of dollars it's not worth it.

If the ADF are using the same weightings as the RAF (highly likely) then each of the 7 domains has a roughly equal weighting (11-16% of total score) for pilot whereas ATC/ACO is skewed heavily towards "strategic task management". Each domain has a specific stanine cutoff from the 2nd-5th stanine which in statistical terms essentially ranges from below average to average. One could assume the ADF gets a slightly right-shifted distribution of individuals compared to the general population so below average may not appear as so. If you fail to meet the cutoff in any domain you do not pass for that role regardless of overall score.

The testing feels very much like an "either you have it or you don't" situation. As far as preparation goes, I could only confidently say that mental maths practice had a definite positive effect on my score. That and 20+ years of solid video games is likely your best bet for success. So go do your timetables and play some PUBG.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 12:15
  #3517 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Perth
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by tayra View Post
If you are referring to pilot then save your money it wont help you (my opinion). There is another similarly named website (pilot aptitude systems) which I believe is a well known scam. If it costs hundreds to thousands of dollars it's not worth it.

If the ADF are using the same weightings as the RAF (highly likely) then each of the 7 domains has a roughly equal weighting (11-16% of total score) for pilot whereas ATC/ACO is skewed heavily towards "strategic task management". Each domain has a specific stanine cutoff from the 2nd-5th stanine which in statistical terms essentially ranges from below average to average. One could assume the ADF gets a slightly right-shifted distribution of individuals compared to the general population so below average may not appear as so. If you fail to meet the cutoff in any domain you do not pass for that role regardless of overall score.

The testing feels very much like an "either you have it or you don't" situation. As far as preparation goes, I could only confidently say that mental maths practice had a definite positive effect on my score. That and 20+ years of solid video games is likely your best bet for success. So go do your timetables and play some PUBG.
Haha, great insight, I presume you have done the exams. From what I have gathered, there's no point trying to slack in any of the domains (not that I was planning to), my mental math is alright, could be better, gaming I've done since I was a child, was almost a professional in one at one stage. I think my hand eye coordination is ok, and my multi tasking maybe ok because in the game, I had to make fast paced decisions, communicate with my team and play well on the sticks. But I can't become over confident.

Also if you don't mind me asking, how many candidates passed in your session? was trying to calculate how many would be in an OSB pool before my session And was the short term memory stuff difficult? I struggle sometimes with that but I've seen significant improvement in my scores the last few days since I've been practising hard. Cheers.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 14:04
  #3518 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 96
pilotaptitudetest.com is a joke. I paid the $70.00 and can quite confidently say it will not help.

Computer games will help on the provision you have good hand/eye coordination and spatial awareness in the first place. Do not jump on the Xbox the night before thinking that getting a few chicken dinners will somehow help. Like tayra said, it's either a case of you have it or you don't.

I lost a couple of points with the psychomotor test despite being pretty good at computer games myself. If you're tall like me (6'3") you may find this test a bit more difficult. Take the time to reposition the desk, chair and equipment. If you're tall you're knees will either hit the top of the desk or your feet will hit the back of the desk, depending on how you're positioned. This will mess you up a lot on a couple of tests. Another candidate in my group complained of this too. She was 6'2.

Go in confident and try to enjoy the experience. Even if you don't get an offer for a Pilot OSB still consider other roles. The ASP is a great opportunity for you to speak to ACOs/ATCs/ABMs/etc and to go on the base tours (yes DFR have paid me to say this). You might find you have a strong interest for one of the mission elementary roles while you're there. ATC certainly wasn't for me but I'd still strongly consider ACO and pursue a civilian license in my own time if I am unsuccessful with my first preference.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 23:21
  #3519 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 41
Originally Posted by quantify View Post
Also if you don't mind me asking, how many candidates passed in your session? was trying to calculate how many would be in an OSB pool before my session
Are you going for DEO or ADFA?

My group had 5 passes for pilot, 2 competitive. The group after had 4 passes for pilot with none competitive. Those pass rates were apparently quite high compared to prior groups.
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Old 4th Apr 2018, 01:50
  #3520 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Gold Coast
Posts: 1
Question New RAAF Aviation Selection Program 2018 (PC-21)

Hi all,

My intention here is not to be spoon feed information on the new ASP for Officer candidates (starting early 2018), rather I wish to know if anyone has come across any helpful sites/links in regards to any of the following domains:
  • Perceptual processing
  • Short-term memory and capacity
  • Spatial reasoning
  • Symbolic reasoning
  • Central information processing
Any other helpful links for other domains for the new ADF Officer ASP would be GREATLY appreciated!

Cheers guys.
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