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Life in the Airforce - how is it really?

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Old 18th Apr 2008, 19:06
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Life in the Airforce - how is it really?

Hello everyone,

I've stumbled upon your website whilst looking for information about life in the RAF, especially from a partners point of view.

My fiance is planning (or at least seriously considering) on joining up as a pilot (assuming that they will take him, but for arguments sake I'll assume that he does) and I've been looking for information about what its like to be the partner/wife of a serviceman - especially a pilot. There is very little information, but what I can find doesn't look that positive.

I was brought up as a forces child (RAF ground crew) but my father left when I was quite young, however I have lasting memories of not knowing where daddy was and not seeing him for ages at a time. These feelings have been compounded by being a boarding school with a strong military background. To say that I am less than enthusiastic is an understatement, but I do not want to stand in the way of his dreams.

I wont be moving to a base (that I point blank refuse - I like my independence in my own home far too much) and I want my own career - hopefully I have secured a dream job that will keep my in my current location. I am also not one for doing the socialising thing with work colleagues outside of working hours - when I leave work I like to leave it behind and not touch it until the next morning. From what I've read, it sounds like I'll be signing up for an utterly miserable existence.

Would you kind people be able to give me a realistic view of life for forces partners? I've read a lot of the posts on here, and although I really don't understand much of it (planes are not my thing and I hate flying) you all come across as lovely, articulate and truthful people. I want a realistic view as in the end, I don't want to be miserable for the next however many years and doubt that I would be able to do that to myself.

My specific questions are:
1) How much say does one get in postings? Realistically, how much do you move about and how long are postings?
2) What is a wives roll in supporting her husband? Would she be expected to participate to further his career and would non participation be frowned upon?
3) What support is there for the families of servicemen whilst they are away?

Its been a long week and I'm sure there were other things I'd have liked to ask, so I shall keep thinking.

Thank you so much for reading it, and I look forward to reading your replies.

Jolly.
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 22:29
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If you think it was bad when your father was in then don’t even bother.

From what you have said I would give you two months.....tops
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 22:44
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Would you care to elaborate on your post please? I'm interested to know why you said that.
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 23:34
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Hi. I have just read your post and if I am honest you are probably not going to like my response.
As a young FJ pilot myself, not long out of training I would say that you seem to have a good grip on what life would be like but here is my opinion for what it is worth.

Through training you obviously have no say in where you are going, it will depend on flying ability. Training will take a while, IOT to OCU is probably 3-5 years depending on the stream (FJ, Rotory, Multi). With that in mind planning where your first real posting will be is impossible until the end of training. At the end of training you have a limited input as to where you end up but is largely a case of bums on seats.

That leads you to your first tour which is around 3 years (often less) at the end of which there will be more uncertainty as to where you will be. Exactly how much you will have to move around is impossible to say as it depends upon a/c type and career ambitions.

It would be very hard to plan your career around his especially through training. The friends I have who were married through training just had to accept that they would live apart.

Then on the front line you have constant deployment and exercises in almost all fleets. This may change but I would not hold my breath.

Not trying to say that it can't be done but it is difficult.

Not wanting to get involved socially is not a big problem but if you want support from the RAF when your partner is away then you would have to get to know the other wifes etc.

I hope that is of some help.
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 23:39
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My specific questions are:
1) How much say does one get in postings? Realistically, how much do you move about and how long are postings?
2) What is a wives roll in supporting her husband? Would she be expected to participate to further his career and would non participation be frowned upon?
3) What support is there for the families of servicemen whilst they are away?
1. None whatsoever. You can make your preferences known, and the RAF will try to put you somewhere you want to go, but at the end of the day the needs of the Service overrule anything else. If they say you're going, you're going.

2. Yes, and yes.

3. Cock-all.

I wont be moving to a base (that I point blank refuse - I like my independence in my own home far too much) and I want my own career - hopefully I have secured a dream job that will keep my in my current location.
Then you will never see your fiancee / husband, simple as that. Your 'career' will have to play second fiddle to his. If you don't like that, don't marry him. You will be forcing him to commute what may well be a long distance every weekend just for your convenience - what relationship you get out of that won't last very long, I assure you.

If he wants to join, and you want to stay with him, I'm afraid you're going to have to show alot more flexibility and a little less selfishness. I have seen many a mate's marriage suffer and fail (as well as their performance at work suffer because of it) due to circumstances just like this.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but this is the reality of it. Being a Pilot in the RAF is a damn hard job - the training is fast-paced and hard work, and the job at the front line these days is just as demanding. The LAST thing he will need is an inflexible wife at home giving him grief for things beyond his control.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 07:02
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Nothing much has changed since I was in except, perhaps, the number and length of deployments. My wife couldn't stand the career-wife syndrome, the pointless coffee mornings and the superficiality of the social circuit. That was one of the reasons I left after having given it the best 17 years of my life. It was either that or divorce. If you want to get on as an RAF officer you are expected to put the Service above all else - including your family.

My experience was that an ambitious RAF officer needed to choose his wife very carefully and with his career in mind. It took a certain kind of woman and probably not one with much of a brain and education let alone a profession. There were wives who were bright and independent when I was in but the significant thing is that they didn't last long or, like me, their husbands left the Service

It does make me wonder though - what about female aircrew officers? Are their husbands/men expected to go to all the coffee mornings and show willing in order to support their careers? If not, it's a bit sexist is it not?

A Jolly Tar - it seems to me that it isn't for you. Sorry.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 07:39
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When I married it was unusual to live off the patch in your own home. We knew that we had a gratuity coming that was enough to buy a place to live in retirement, so why bother with the encumbrance of a house?

Married Quarters were busy, vibrant places. We all went for a beer at the Mess after work and walked across the green to get home. There were no drink driving issues. We were always in and out of each other's houses, and there was always a party somewhere. Our wives did not need to work, though some did. The "I'm Mrs Wing Commander" type did exist, but were ridiculed behind their backs. Postings meant moving to other such patches, being made welcome and an instant social life. And there were a good variety of postings........

Yes, maybe my spectacles are rose tinted and I've glossed over the crap condition of some homes, but you get the picture.

Now, Family Quarters seem to be transit camps where people stay for the shortest possible time until they can move out. You must get on the housing market now, or suffer horribly later. Wives have to work to help with the mortgage. Your gratuity wouldn't buy a mobile home. No one drinks because everyone drives, so the social focus and community spirit has gone. Most people forget the job at the camp gates, which reduces the commitment felt and the sense of responsibility. Most people want to find a good post and stay put.

Again, I know these are sweeping generalisations, and a great many people adapt and enjoy.

Could you adapt and enjoy?

Hubby can always commute. This means he will be in the Mess during the week with other displaced husbands and the young single officers. He will have no housework to do, dinner will be cooked for him, and the bar is open. Or maybe a run into town for a bit of action. He won't look forward to ringing home, because despite being lonely, when he rings you for solace, you pour out your frustrations on him and give nothing but grief.

Now add children to the equation....

For what its worth, we had a great time, my wife had a job, we rented the house out and lived in Quarters, and the kids grew up loving it. But then, I managed 2 x 7-year tours during the school years, very unusual then and now.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 07:49
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Hi Jolly,

You might get good feedback here.

http://www.rearparty.co.uk/

I'm not being facetious, the insight might be more appropriate, thats all.

Good luck.

Al.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 07:56
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Let me turn the question inside out.

There was a WRAF officer clearly looking to marry an RAF officer with good career prospects. Now she clearly had a career but was probably not wishing to continue for ever.

She found a good mate and he was OK but at that point perhaps not exceptional. She was a flt lt and he was a bit younger as a fg off.

He then applied for a branch change to become aircrew. He qualified and was posted as a fairly young flt lt to his new unit. She was fully supportive and I suspect also the driving force in the relationship.

He rose rapidly through the ranks and I lost sight of him when he became an air commodore in his early 40s.

The moral is that an air force career needs the full support of the team. I don't know who cleaned his shoes or pressed his pants but undoubtedly she would have done the shopping, laundry and all the other essential support admin jobs.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:11
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Jolly Tar,

I would disagree with certain things mentioned and would say the answers to your questions are:

1. Not much, and around 2-3 years.
2. Not as much as you'd think but there is an element of it.
3. If you live off base as you want to (and I do) then as much as you want to participate in.

I'll elaborate by saying that postings and deployments can be very dependant upon which fleet your fiancé ends up on. All fleets are working hard but there are some that are better than others. I'd say the Helicopter fleets have it the worst, closely followed by the Multi-Engine guys then the fast-jet guys. There is obviously some variation in this of course.

Since your bloke has to go through training you can expect a turbulent 3-5 years as mentioned. The chances of buying your own house at each place in this time, given the current climate, are nil. So you will have to live in quarters.

Once he gets to the front line some stability could be assured but where you end up and for how long is anyone's guess. Personally, as aircrew I've been at the same place now for 8 years and own my own house and my wife has her own career, so it can be done but that's a rarity. I don't think I'll be lucky for ever though....

I hope this helps somewhat.

Last edited by skaterboi; 19th Apr 2008 at 08:14. Reason: spelling again!
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:14
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From what has been said here and by others, I get the feeling that if I want more from my life than being ¨admin¨ for my husband, I will be hauled over bricks for being a terrible person.

I'm rather saddened by the majority of the responses but I did ask for the truth and it certainly hasn't been sugar coated.

For the record, I am not a selfish inflexible cow -I just want to be able to live my own life to a degree that allows me to decide what I want. I haven't spent the best part of 20 years in education to be a doormat. It seems however, that I would be viewed as such a monster in the military environment. It really does appear that wives are commodities and not people in themselves.

I am genuinely hurt by the accusations that I'm selfish - perhaps I should now take my leave and go back to my hole.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:16
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I would just like to thank those who have pointed me in the direction of other information and also for other helpful posts.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:24
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Life as a partner is what you make it but here goes on what it is really like:

The expectation of weekly coffee mornings on a Thursday in the Officers' Mess;

Flower arrranging with the snr officers wives normally happens on a Tuesday followed by a Bridge School in the afternoon:

Flower arranging in the evenings running up to dining-in nights and official functions;

Ballroom dancing classes with husband whilst he is a JO;

Hubby will be expected to go to Happy Hour on a Friday starting at 1700 and ending as required. It is expecetd that you will collect him from the Mess but don't worry, you will have plenty of company from the other wives as as you loiter in thge Mess carpark waiting for hours to see him stagger from the bar.

finally, all year round he will sport a fine sun tan from all the time he spends in sunnier climes.
..........

ps please don't tell my fiancee any of the above
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:26
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At 23 - I'm far too young for that ^



Kill me, kill me now.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:47
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Do you love him? Tha is really the crux of the matter. All the above to some extent or another are true, however it is what you make of it. I live a good way from the base where I am at now, my wife has her own career as a doctor - the bonus is that she can move easier than most jobs when I am posted, but this does not mean that we have always lived together. There are lots of guys with wives who live apart during the week - the question is, can you handle it? As for the leaving work at work thing - I agree. but you don't have to get involved in all the 'flower arranging' anymore!!! You can if you want but..... It may get a little more difficult if your husband ascends to high rank - then more will be expected - but that is a LONG way off..... And, at the end of the day, the parties are GOOD!

Hope it helps.......

But then, you probably will not bring this situation to a head before the OASC results come out
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 08:54
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For the record, I am not a selfish inflexible cow -I just want to be able to live my own life to a degree that allows me to decide what I want. I haven't spent the best part of 20 years in education to be a doormat. It seems however, that I would be viewed as such a monster in the military environment. It really does appear that wives are commodities and not people in themselves.

I am genuinely hurt by the accusations that I'm selfish - perhaps I should now take my leave and go back to my hole.
On the contrary, I thought your initial post was nicely thought out and well meaning. I certainly don't view you as selfish and I'm not sure most would either. The RAF is only just starting to realise that spouses are entitled to their own careers now but it's a slow process.

Ignore The Inquisitor, he's not known for his tact and diplomacy - certainly not when he was at my station, anyway.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 09:02
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Has your fiance considered the Royal Navy's Fleet Air Arm to fly?
The only reason I ask is that whilst time away etc is probably no better depending on which fleet of aircraft you fly, there is a reasonable likelyhood of never having to move home base.
Our Junglys and Lynx boys stay there whole careers at Yeovilton, and our Pingers etc stay in Cornwall.
If however he has a hard on for flying really fast, he would be back in the same boat as the RAF
Just a thought.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 09:04
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Hmmmm lots to think about! I am writing this on my husbands login so this is Mrs. El Mirador.
It is workable but you did need to have a huge understanding about what your fiance/husband does for a living. A pilot (from my understanding/experience and my husband is not one, though serves in the RAF) lives and breathes his job. There is no other way that he/she can do it well otherwise! It is truly vocational and is up there with being a Doctor/vet etc.
You will have constant 'let downs' that you will have to cope with. Planes go 'poorly' all the time and that great weekend you had planned can be kissed bye bye if Hubbs is stuck somewhere with a u/s plane.
This may sound slightly pappy, but if you love your fiance there is always some compromise.
I don't do flower arranging and coffee mornings but I do and have made an appearance and 'PR' my husband because I love him and genuinely believe he is the greatest and has much going for him. That done I consider my role satisfied and get on with my own life. The Military life is not overly conducive to a separate career but it again depends on character and whether you want kiddies. When my Hubbs joined up he was 19 and I went off to Uni. and we lived separately for 8 years before we married. Hubbs has been in for 18 years now and I have embarked on the long and arduous road to becoming a Barrister. I see it working out ok with the odd privations that come with standard separation.
I am a little bit concerned only in the fact that if your fiance was seriously thinking about being a pilot, you might already have a fair idea of how much aircraft will be a subject of conversation. Maybe I am wrong as I am a geek and love aircraft nerdery.
Nil desperandum! It can work and I can see you having your cake and eating it! I am criminally shy but through all the time I have been a service wife, good and bad, I would not have changed the experience one bit. It has developed me as a person and I have made some terrific friends. You do not lose your identity if you have the slightest bit of character. In fact you can positively influence your husband by just being you! You don't have to be somebody else. I kind of viewed it all as a mischievious challenge and loved pitting myself against a conventional image of the 'flower arranging' twin set and pearls...(not that there is anything wrong with flower arranging perse).
Anyway, have a good long talk with your fiance and good long think. You are you and he is him. It can work but only you can really say.
Best of luck to you and your fiance for the future.

Last edited by El Mirador; 19th Apr 2008 at 17:07.
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 09:06
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What is the maximum age for joining the RAF as a pilot?
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Old 19th Apr 2008, 09:28
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Jolly
I admire your approach and don't think anyone is accusing you of being selfish. And if you choose to put your own career first, noone would consider you a monster. The first thing to learn when in contact with the military is to take everything said with a large pinch of salt!
I was in the Army and we had 24 moves of home, but my son is an RAF FJ pilot and has had much more stability. His wife was a highly qualified midwife but had to give it up when they had kids. They lived happily on base for a long time as there was only one base for what he flew. They had a good social life, made lifelong friends and were protected and comfortable.
Now they have bought their own house and he has been posted abroad, so they are having to let it out and move the kids' school because their priority is to live together as a family.
There is a lot of good stuff on this thread for you to learn from, and some rubbish too. The main things to hoist in are:
a. Married life in the Services is not like civilian life, but there are great rewards as well as significant disadvantages.
b. Life on a married patch is usually actually quite pleasant, friendly, supportive and not at all rigid and "officers' wifey" as some have portrayed. Most of your neighbours will be PLUs (people like us) with a lot in common. Most officers' wives are actually bright, intelligent, fun and very practical.
c. You will have to decide your priorities early: perhaps have seperate careers to start with and at some point live together, buy home, have children. It will be a great test of your commitment to each other, so make sure you discuss and agree your choices.
You are doing exactly the right thing in gathering as much information as you can. If you have friends in the RAF, visit and get a feel for their way of life.
Good luck!

Last edited by Clockwork Mouse; 19th Apr 2008 at 09:34. Reason: Remorseless pursuit of perfection.
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