Cornet Wales (Prince Harry)
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
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News reports here are now suggesting that the insurgents have put a bounty on Harry's head - something in the order of $1Mil., I think.
Hi
According to the press yesterday (FRI) Harry stated " I AM NOT AFRAID TO DIE". What about the poor crews of the vehicles ? I always thought that an OFFICER is supposed to think of the men under his command and Not be selfish and thik ONLY about themselves.
According to the press yesterday (FRI) Harry stated " I AM NOT AFRAID TO DIE". What about the poor crews of the vehicles ? I always thought that an OFFICER is supposed to think of the men under his command and Not be selfish and thik ONLY about themselves.
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To be honest he needs to pull his finger out and grow up. He's meant to be a commissioned Officer, a leader, he prances around over here falling out of clubs getting in to this that and the other trouble. If that was one of us we would be up before the CO quicker than a bullet flies! Even in training i think he had his fair share of mr meners (excuse the spelling!!) Again, I'm sure after that any one of us would have been out the gate!
This deployment will hopefully change things and see him come back with honours, a new man and hopefully a bit more mature.
Best of luck to him
This deployment will hopefully change things and see him come back with honours, a new man and hopefully a bit more mature.
Best of luck to him
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It's the fault of the Treasury. Too many cutbacks. If they had left a regiment or two spare, then those units blessed with the Royal presence could simply have been sent somewhere non-dangerous.
This is also down to the government's desire to avoid the slightest chance of the very bad news that any unfortunate incident involving this particular officer would generate. I am sure that HM believes he should do his bit, the rest of them as well - after all, he is the "spare" (and ginger at that). However, the spinners in Whitehall must have twitching sphincters at the thought of something happening to Hazza and the media disaster that would follow.
This is also down to the government's desire to avoid the slightest chance of the very bad news that any unfortunate incident involving this particular officer would generate. I am sure that HM believes he should do his bit, the rest of them as well - after all, he is the "spare" (and ginger at that). However, the spinners in Whitehall must have twitching sphincters at the thought of something happening to Hazza and the media disaster that would follow.
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I haven’t waded through all the posts on this thread, so apologies if this had already been said.
In an ideal world, Cornet Wales would complete his tour and the fact that he had been on active service not announced until he was (hopefully) safely home. That would be the best for both him and probably even moreso, the poor sods who’ll have to serve alongside him. But five minutes listening to Sky News would convince anyone that’s not going to happen. If the MoD tried something like that, some cretin looking for news scoop would announce every detail of the deployment down to Harry’s jockstrap size the moment he could learn it, including the grid co-ordinates of the bunker he was to sleep in and the khazi he’ll be taking his morning bog in.
Which led me to thinking that surely the military in Iraq could put this whole Harry business to their advantage? Having high profile people on the battlefield isn’t new. From Alexander the Great to Shakespeare’s Henry the Fifth, doubles (and triples and quadruples) have been used to confuse the enemy and have them expend major effort in trying to kill or capture the king. From the times of the ancient Greeks, it was common practice for more than one knight to dress in the king’s armour to confuse the enemy. (Anyone remember poor old Eric Bana aka Hector thinking he’s got Brad Pitt in the first reel of ‘Troy? - or was it the other way around?)
Surely having Harry (and a half dozen doubles) in theatre could be used to flush out as many bad guys as are willing to present themselves for slaughter? It goes without saying that there will be a huge force in place to ensure Harry doesn’t find himself in a Third Retreat from Kabul situation, so why not put that force to good use and troll him (and his many doubles) past the bad guys and invite attack – on our terms?
In an ideal world, Cornet Wales would complete his tour and the fact that he had been on active service not announced until he was (hopefully) safely home. That would be the best for both him and probably even moreso, the poor sods who’ll have to serve alongside him. But five minutes listening to Sky News would convince anyone that’s not going to happen. If the MoD tried something like that, some cretin looking for news scoop would announce every detail of the deployment down to Harry’s jockstrap size the moment he could learn it, including the grid co-ordinates of the bunker he was to sleep in and the khazi he’ll be taking his morning bog in.
Which led me to thinking that surely the military in Iraq could put this whole Harry business to their advantage? Having high profile people on the battlefield isn’t new. From Alexander the Great to Shakespeare’s Henry the Fifth, doubles (and triples and quadruples) have been used to confuse the enemy and have them expend major effort in trying to kill or capture the king. From the times of the ancient Greeks, it was common practice for more than one knight to dress in the king’s armour to confuse the enemy. (Anyone remember poor old Eric Bana aka Hector thinking he’s got Brad Pitt in the first reel of ‘Troy? - or was it the other way around?)
Surely having Harry (and a half dozen doubles) in theatre could be used to flush out as many bad guys as are willing to present themselves for slaughter? It goes without saying that there will be a huge force in place to ensure Harry doesn’t find himself in a Third Retreat from Kabul situation, so why not put that force to good use and troll him (and his many doubles) past the bad guys and invite attack – on our terms?
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Wiley,
your expecting a bit much from the selection of morons that we have running (I use the term very loosely) this country !
It would appear from all the mistakes (''that we will learn from'' ) that these chosen ones make that they dont have the ability to think inside the box let alone outside it
As for press integrity an oxymoron surely
your expecting a bit much from the selection of morons that we have running (I use the term very loosely) this country !
It would appear from all the mistakes (''that we will learn from'' ) that these chosen ones make that they dont have the ability to think inside the box let alone outside it
As for press integrity an oxymoron surely
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No Question - Harry Should Go
So what if the insurgents know he's in theatre? It's too late to worry about that now. The application of half-decent OPSEC would mean that the insurgents would have no idea where he is at any particular time, and they should therefore be unable to tgt him specifically. However, they are already ramping up their activity again, and that's nothing to do with Prince Harry.
Didn't Napoleon say something alnong the lines of: 'the moral is to the physical as 10 is to 1'? This issue is about political will and moral courage. If the insurgents can dissuade our leaders (through our own media
) from sending Harry because they are afraid of the political consequences of his death or wounding in action, the insurgents will score a major propaganda victory. More seriously still, they will prove that we do not have the moral wherewithal to defeat, or even control, the insurgency.
If the Government and Service Chiefs want the British Armed Forces to be taken seriously in future, they must prove that they have the will to win and determination to fight this war properly. We've already suffered numerous setbacks in this area, most recently through the capture and release of Cornwall's boarding party. Our reputation for military effectiveness and determination is an intangible, but nevertheless priceless, asset - one which is worth real sacrifice to retain.
An officer's men are, indeed, one of his highest priorities - but not his highest. In war, winning is the highest priority - and it is utterly peurile to suppose that winning can be achieved at no cost. In the case at hand, winning back some our tattered reputation is what matters, and that can be achieved here by showing that we are prepared to pay the butcher's bill.
That's what I think, anyway.
BM
Didn't Napoleon say something alnong the lines of: 'the moral is to the physical as 10 is to 1'? This issue is about political will and moral courage. If the insurgents can dissuade our leaders (through our own media
) from sending Harry because they are afraid of the political consequences of his death or wounding in action, the insurgents will score a major propaganda victory. More seriously still, they will prove that we do not have the moral wherewithal to defeat, or even control, the insurgency. If the Government and Service Chiefs want the British Armed Forces to be taken seriously in future, they must prove that they have the will to win and determination to fight this war properly. We've already suffered numerous setbacks in this area, most recently through the capture and release of Cornwall's boarding party. Our reputation for military effectiveness and determination is an intangible, but nevertheless priceless, asset - one which is worth real sacrifice to retain.
An officer's men are, indeed, one of his highest priorities - but not his highest. In war, winning is the highest priority - and it is utterly peurile to suppose that winning can be achieved at no cost. In the case at hand, winning back some our tattered reputation is what matters, and that can be achieved here by showing that we are prepared to pay the butcher's bill.
That's what I think, anyway.
BM
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We could win back some of our 'tattered reputation' by the media showing our soldiers on the frontline, doing their jobs and trying to help the Iraqis and Afghans. The speculation in the media regarding Prince Harry surely only makes the upper echelons of our command structure look like doddering fools, which the public then assumes applies to the whole of the Armed Forces. I have the utmost respect for all our troops out there, but I'm serving. The general public's perception comes almost entirely from what they see and hear in the media which, at the moment, makes us look like fools.
Last edited by letsgoandfly; 29th Apr 2007 at 09:22. Reason: Spelling
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Many Ppruner's have served, or are serving in Iraq/Afghanistan. There are also many complaints or gripes on this site about poor conditions, and long separations for family and loved ones.
IMHO these deployment's are too regular, and many don't see any benefit to the UK from anything WE are doing in Iraq/Afghanistan. But in the true professional British military tradition, the men and women in our forces answer the call, and perform in a class of their own.
BUT, I can't help but think that I had been offered the chance not to risk life and limb, then it may have been much harder to want to go!
I'm not sure if I feel this way due to being a civilian for some time now, or maybe I'm suffering LMF, or whatever reason!. Certainly, when I was younger, I would have wanted to be with my squadron/friends, and to do my bit. But as I say above, would it have been different if I didn't have to go.
IMHO. All credit to Harry, for stepping up to the plate, and having watched both Harry and William on TV recently, Harry seems very at ease and natural in uniform. It seems harry may also have a natural flair for banter!
PLEASE NOTE. I have not offered a spell checker, or criticised anyone's grammar here. so let me off if I have missed a few thing's
Barnstormer1968
IMHO these deployment's are too regular, and many don't see any benefit to the UK from anything WE are doing in Iraq/Afghanistan. But in the true professional British military tradition, the men and women in our forces answer the call, and perform in a class of their own.
BUT, I can't help but think that I had been offered the chance not to risk life and limb, then it may have been much harder to want to go!
I'm not sure if I feel this way due to being a civilian for some time now, or maybe I'm suffering LMF, or whatever reason!. Certainly, when I was younger, I would have wanted to be with my squadron/friends, and to do my bit. But as I say above, would it have been different if I didn't have to go.
IMHO. All credit to Harry, for stepping up to the plate, and having watched both Harry and William on TV recently, Harry seems very at ease and natural in uniform. It seems harry may also have a natural flair for banter!
PLEASE NOTE. I have not offered a spell checker, or criticised anyone's grammar here. so let me off if I have missed a few thing's
Barnstormer1968
Bob C, lets face it, journos aren't stupid. You can't really hide the unit that he's serving with, someone will find out. Then announcement that said unit deploys to iraq.... 2+2=4 and young harry isn't to be found anywhere abouts... Not exactly rocket science!
(BTW to all those that slate him for being found making a fool of himself in clubs/pubs/bars, he's significantly better behaved than most of the country's youth today, so don't knock it!)
(BTW to all those that slate him for being found making a fool of himself in clubs/pubs/bars, he's significantly better behaved than most of the country's youth today, so don't knock it!)
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A few of you are a bit naive re the media. My close association shows me that if there is no story they will make up the story. The facts of this story probably come from a few wannabes with a very vague association with his circle who believe they think they know what he might have said - give that crap to the media and you've got a story they can milk for weeks on end - there is very little truth in the "pages" of today's "meeja"!
I say good on the bloke - he joined - he trained - there's a war on - he wants to go. My son did all this and he's over there. Only difference is my son is a prince in my eyes only!
And for those serving officers who imbibe perhaps a little too much occasionally and say/do things you may regret - sorry but news about you does not sell papers!
GAGS E86
I say good on the bloke - he joined - he trained - there's a war on - he wants to go. My son did all this and he's over there. Only difference is my son is a prince in my eyes only!
And for those serving officers who imbibe perhaps a little too much occasionally and say/do things you may regret - sorry but news about you does not sell papers!
GAGS E86
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There was a time when Kings led their armies into battle. I am touched by the young man's willingness to sacrifice so much for Queen and Country. The bastards know he is coming and they will be gunning for him and all units like his will undoubtedly suffer casualties because of it. The die is cast. The world will be watching. All eyes will be on the young Prince and his youthful exuberance.
Plant your flag young Harry. Let the heathen know they are opposed by a Prince and grandson of a most extraordinary and gracious Queen of the most extraordinary Monarchy of all time. The heathen will surely not understand, and, let them be the worse for it, but the world will!
Long live His Royal Highness Prince Harry!
Plant your flag young Harry. Let the heathen know they are opposed by a Prince and grandson of a most extraordinary and gracious Queen of the most extraordinary Monarchy of all time. The heathen will surely not understand, and, let them be the worse for it, but the world will!
Long live His Royal Highness Prince Harry!
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I see some eminent defence experts, Messrs Portillo and Nott, have been lining up to resist the Prince's deployment sharp and sandyside http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...7/nharry27.xml . What folly it would be to ignore them, eh?
If only we could shut the sodding Media up for the duration
If only we could shut the sodding Media up for the duration
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If only we could shut the sodding Media up for the duration
Was never going to happen though.
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Anyone think he'd have even made it to the Sandhurst assessment stage on his bum A levels in art history and underwater basket weaving?
Reckon Joe Public would get in on those qualifications?
Guess he must have interviewed pretty well at the local Windsor AFCO.
Reckon Joe Public would get in on those qualifications?
Guess he must have interviewed pretty well at the local Windsor AFCO.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
I totally agree that Harry should serve wherever his troops are.
I'm all for the days of royalty leading the men into battle,
"Cry God for Harry, England and Saint George!"
However and it's a big one, with $625,000 on his head, I'm sure there will be people hell bent on getting to him and never mind anyone in the vicinity!
All well and good him wanting to go and do his job, but for everyone else, like us armchair generals saying he joined up and should go and do his job like every other squaddie, think of his comrades.
I think I would be really peeved if I knew a member of my family had been killed because of no other aim of the enemy than to get the Prince.
If he was to stay in London and perhaps show some moral human courage and compassion, in a role such as families officer, (without of course nights out for the duration of the tour and 'trying to kop off with the lonely ones at home') supporting those left at home and showing a compasionate side. He will still be fighting with his troops, protecting their families against the ravishes of time, lonely time and knowing that your family member is at risk, while those who decided to go to war rest peacefully in their beds at home with their families with them
I admire his commitment and loyalty, but for the protection of his comrades I think not this time.
I'm all for the days of royalty leading the men into battle,
"Cry God for Harry, England and Saint George!"
However and it's a big one, with $625,000 on his head, I'm sure there will be people hell bent on getting to him and never mind anyone in the vicinity!
All well and good him wanting to go and do his job, but for everyone else, like us armchair generals saying he joined up and should go and do his job like every other squaddie, think of his comrades.
I think I would be really peeved if I knew a member of my family had been killed because of no other aim of the enemy than to get the Prince.
If he was to stay in London and perhaps show some moral human courage and compassion, in a role such as families officer, (without of course nights out for the duration of the tour and 'trying to kop off with the lonely ones at home') supporting those left at home and showing a compasionate side. He will still be fighting with his troops, protecting their families against the ravishes of time, lonely time and knowing that your family member is at risk, while those who decided to go to war rest peacefully in their beds at home with their families with them
I admire his commitment and loyalty, but for the protection of his comrades I think not this time.