Service Pay - Comment by Boris Johnson
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As endplay suggested way back, she may well be part of the MAC (Multi-Activity Contract) - in other words a civilian, working not as part of the Civil Service, but for a civilian company (eg Serco, McAlpine, ESS etc). She may have nothing to do with the Civil Service at all, let alone the RAF.
These days I'm pretty a-political. I don't trust any of them. However, I don't recall the Conservatives making too much noise about our pay when they were in power. Oh and please remind me who it was who sold off all the FQs for peanuts to the Japanese and agreed to keep releasing them at a rate of 10% per year for sale to the public? Some Conservative MP called Portillo, wasn't it? Labour are no better mind. Forcing us to close bases all over the place - how much is being paid out for SSFA in the High Wycombe area at the moment? When I was there, the going rate was about £1800 a month for a Sqn Ldr/Flt Lt. Must ... calm ... down. Must ... take ... medication.
These days I'm pretty a-political. I don't trust any of them. However, I don't recall the Conservatives making too much noise about our pay when they were in power. Oh and please remind me who it was who sold off all the FQs for peanuts to the Japanese and agreed to keep releasing them at a rate of 10% per year for sale to the public? Some Conservative MP called Portillo, wasn't it? Labour are no better mind. Forcing us to close bases all over the place - how much is being paid out for SSFA in the High Wycombe area at the moment? When I was there, the going rate was about £1800 a month for a Sqn Ldr/Flt Lt. Must ... calm ... down. Must ... take ... medication.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
ORAC you sound like a mealy mouthed politician talking round the facts without admitting anything - not
Why don't you stand for parliament next time?
Why don't you stand for parliament next time?
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I'd be really interested to hear from someone on this forum who is a current serving member of the armed forces that feels that they are underpaid in someway.
And even more so when you factor in the enormous additional benefits?
S_H
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Hi yes here me me me me
Propulsion/Airframe technician, 9.5 years experience on 25k a year. Ive had a job offer for nearly double that doing very much the same as I am now. Without getting mortared, doing gate guard and endless deployments.
What do you think I should do ??
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Do one!
Enginesuck
I fully understand your predicament, to be honest my fine fellow Sootie, if your not in the "pension trap" (as I am) vote with your feet Pal, as you know there are already a multitude of PVR's at ISK going through at the moment. I'll even give you a reference!!
Sooties honour
DS
I fully understand your predicament, to be honest my fine fellow Sootie, if your not in the "pension trap" (as I am) vote with your feet Pal, as you know there are already a multitude of PVR's at ISK going through at the moment. I'll even give you a reference!!
Sooties honour
DS
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The Civil Service will help people to move house if they are forced to move by the Civil Service. A friend of mine left Valley for Northolt and she was told if she could sell her house and buy a new one then the Civil Service would make up the losses or even buy the house in Valley.
Beats moving into a substandard quarter.
Beats moving into a substandard quarter.
Taking an example of 2 similar properties currently on the market, both the nearest of that type found to the particular RAF Stations. If said person sells a 3-bed mid-terraced house in Holyhead for £114,950 and buys a similar 3-bed mid-terraced house in Greenford for £284,950, will the Civil Service (for which read 'our taxes') pay the difference of £170,000?
MadMark!!!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Oddly enough the October issue of Paperclips illustrates the benefits associated with a move. Not only that you you will recall that Tone has just addressed the same issue designating armed forces and critical public service officials as entitled to various assistances.
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No. See below.
Certainly.
1. Armed Forces Pension - widely acknowledged to be the best available to anyone in the UK. Worth about 10% of your monthly wage, as we don't pay any contributions (standfast those in receipt of specialist pay who can make AVCs). Index linked and not based on a fund - so you cannot lose it.
2. Free medical and dental. Worth, depending on your age, somewhere between £40 and £100 a month.
3. Free travel to get you home as well as enormous discount on rail and coach travel for your whole family.
4. Interest free loans to put a deposit on a home.
5. Massively discounted, maintained family quarters.
6. Tax free bonuses for retention and now for Op Tours (ok I can see that not everyone will be delighted about claiming the latter).
7. Annual pay rises in line with inflation (I wonder how many private sector organisations do this? Just about none...).
8. Generous relocation packages.
9. Boarding School Allowance (just ask anyone who gets it how much this is worth - its loads).
10. Enormous help, on company time, to get qualifications above and beyond degree level.
11. Free use of gym and pool for the majority of people - worth anywhere between £40 and £100 a month.
12. Annual pay review board which takes into account factors of service life and almost always recommends a raise.
If thats the case, I'd leave and take the job offer! You were a volunteer right?
People are only worth what someone is prepared to pay them and it sounds like the RAF are undervaluing you. On the surface, seems a simple decision to me. Or you could get yourself promoted I suppose, if that's a possibility for you.
Thought of some more:
13. Enormous opportunity to carry out PAID adventurous training, around the world, entirely at your employer's expense.
14. Continuous pay, even when sick.
15. 30 days paid leave per year + 6 bank holidays. In civvy street, you're lucky to get 20.
16. PLUS post operational tour leave which is granted after you have effectively done what you are trained for.
17. The most generous resettlement opportunities I have ever heard of.
18. Time in your working week to enable you to keep physically fit.
I could go on....
1. Armed Forces Pension - widely acknowledged to be the best available to anyone in the UK. Worth about 10% of your monthly wage, as we don't pay any contributions (standfast those in receipt of specialist pay who can make AVCs). Index linked and not based on a fund - so you cannot lose it.
2. Free medical and dental. Worth, depending on your age, somewhere between £40 and £100 a month.
3. Free travel to get you home as well as enormous discount on rail and coach travel for your whole family.
4. Interest free loans to put a deposit on a home.
5. Massively discounted, maintained family quarters.
6. Tax free bonuses for retention and now for Op Tours (ok I can see that not everyone will be delighted about claiming the latter).
7. Annual pay rises in line with inflation (I wonder how many private sector organisations do this? Just about none...).
8. Generous relocation packages.
9. Boarding School Allowance (just ask anyone who gets it how much this is worth - its loads).
10. Enormous help, on company time, to get qualifications above and beyond degree level.
11. Free use of gym and pool for the majority of people - worth anywhere between £40 and £100 a month.
12. Annual pay review board which takes into account factors of service life and almost always recommends a raise.
Hi yes here me me me me
Propulsion/Airframe technician, 9.5 years experience on 25k a year. Ive had a job offer for nearly double that doing very much the same as I am now. Without getting mortared, doing gate guard and endless deployments.
What do you think I should do ??
Propulsion/Airframe technician, 9.5 years experience on 25k a year. Ive had a job offer for nearly double that doing very much the same as I am now. Without getting mortared, doing gate guard and endless deployments.
What do you think I should do ??
People are only worth what someone is prepared to pay them and it sounds like the RAF are undervaluing you. On the surface, seems a simple decision to me. Or you could get yourself promoted I suppose, if that's a possibility for you.
Thought of some more:
13. Enormous opportunity to carry out PAID adventurous training, around the world, entirely at your employer's expense.
14. Continuous pay, even when sick.
15. 30 days paid leave per year + 6 bank holidays. In civvy street, you're lucky to get 20.
16. PLUS post operational tour leave which is granted after you have effectively done what you are trained for.
17. The most generous resettlement opportunities I have ever heard of.
18. Time in your working week to enable you to keep physically fit.
I could go on....
Last edited by Wannabe1974; 28th Oct 2006 at 15:07.
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1. Armed Forces Pension
Free medical
enormous discount on rail and coach travel for your whole family.
Massively discounted,maintained family quarters.
Tax free bonuses for retention
IMHO the forces are being hugely let down by current government policy. Yes we are overworked, under resourced, under paid and taken advantage of.
If I wasn't so close to pension (that I have worked and paid for!) I would emigrate tomorrow.
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Seriously though, I know we work bloody hard for the money (well, most people), but the fact remains that people stay in the services because they do not believe that they can get a better deal outside. As I said before, pay is very seldom a factor for people who opt to go outside.
Engine Suck
Sounds like a good offer.
What is the contract length? 6 months? a year? Bet it is no longer than 2. Does the contract include time off for study? Will they find/provide subsidised accom for you? Will your rent include all repairs, albeit slow and not top calss workmanship? Will they find a dentist for you or pay the monthly fee for a private one? What about sick pay? Will they contribute towards school fees if you want to send your kids to private school?
The grass always seems greener. I have just (literally) come back from visiting a friend in Muscat who works for a civvy company. His current contract (2 years) ends in Dec. He has been in 'negotiations' about a renewal, still no decision. They have said, so far, that if they renew they will be removing the comany car and looking to reduce his wages as the 'job review', carried out without his knowledge or input, has downgraded the post. They have also said they want to look at contract renewal every 6 months and not 2 years, as was the initial offer. So, he is overseas with 3 kids and may have to move back to the UK before Xmas. If he stays he will be forced to accept a much reduced offer, and one that can be binned/reduced further every 6 months.
He too left the RAF because he was fed up, crap pay, crap leadership etc. He now realises that there was a lot of good stuff as well and his initial decision was a bit hasty.
I wish you well, genuinely, but be VERY careful about accepting offers before dismissing what you already have.
As for Boris. Yet another outstanding example of a politician using half truths, smoke, mirrors and blatant ignorance to make a dodgy point.
What is the contract length? 6 months? a year? Bet it is no longer than 2. Does the contract include time off for study? Will they find/provide subsidised accom for you? Will your rent include all repairs, albeit slow and not top calss workmanship? Will they find a dentist for you or pay the monthly fee for a private one? What about sick pay? Will they contribute towards school fees if you want to send your kids to private school?
The grass always seems greener. I have just (literally) come back from visiting a friend in Muscat who works for a civvy company. His current contract (2 years) ends in Dec. He has been in 'negotiations' about a renewal, still no decision. They have said, so far, that if they renew they will be removing the comany car and looking to reduce his wages as the 'job review', carried out without his knowledge or input, has downgraded the post. They have also said they want to look at contract renewal every 6 months and not 2 years, as was the initial offer. So, he is overseas with 3 kids and may have to move back to the UK before Xmas. If he stays he will be forced to accept a much reduced offer, and one that can be binned/reduced further every 6 months.
He too left the RAF because he was fed up, crap pay, crap leadership etc. He now realises that there was a lot of good stuff as well and his initial decision was a bit hasty.
I wish you well, genuinely, but be VERY careful about accepting offers before dismissing what you already have.
As for Boris. Yet another outstanding example of a politician using half truths, smoke, mirrors and blatant ignorance to make a dodgy point.
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I am not leaving, and I never intended to, My original post was intended to highlight the temptation which is grabbing a lot of good guys at the moment. I love my Job but with a Wife and a kid on the way I need the security... I just think that certain trades need their expertise recognised. Im getting paid the same as a cook at the end of the day....
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I am not leaving, and I never intended to, My original post was intended to highlight the temptation which is grabbing a lot of good guys at the moment. I love my Job but with a Wife and a kid on the way I need the security... I just think that certain trades need their expertise recognised. Im getting paid the same as a cook at the end of the day....
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How can this woman be labelled as Poor? She earns £12500 PA for goodness sake. She runs a car, holds down 2 jobs, pays her taxes, has her bins emptied regularly etc etc....how is that poverty?
One technical definition of poverty (one of many, and not neccessarily mine!) is being in the bottom 10% of wage earners for that location/country/region etc.
If you use this definition it is impossible to eliminate poverty, and even if everyone in UK earned £1 million+ there would still be people 'living in poverty'!
If you use this definition it is impossible to eliminate poverty, and even if everyone in UK earned £1 million+ there would still be people 'living in poverty'!
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Ahem
Wannabe,
I know freedom of speech exists and all that but would you mind not putting "we" in your posts as if you are a member of HM Forces please
Having just spent time with chaps returning from Afghanistan and Iraq with limbs missing and shrapnel still embedded in their bodies, it is fairly clear that they are extremely grateful for their Railcard. Especially after it went up to £12
"I forgot the biggest benefit of them all! Security. Can't think of many firms that offer you decades of guaranteed employment."
Guaranteed employment? Top tip. 11 November is coming up. Why not take a wander along to a Church on the Sunday? Take a seat. Listen to the service. Have a jolly old read of the names engraved on the war memorial.
Then get down on your knees and give thanks and stay there
I know freedom of speech exists and all that but would you mind not putting "we" in your posts as if you are a member of HM Forces please
Having just spent time with chaps returning from Afghanistan and Iraq with limbs missing and shrapnel still embedded in their bodies, it is fairly clear that they are extremely grateful for their Railcard. Especially after it went up to £12
"I forgot the biggest benefit of them all! Security. Can't think of many firms that offer you decades of guaranteed employment."
Guaranteed employment? Top tip. 11 November is coming up. Why not take a wander along to a Church on the Sunday? Take a seat. Listen to the service. Have a jolly old read of the names engraved on the war memorial.
Then get down on your knees and give thanks and stay there
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Wannabe,
I know freedom of speech exists and all that but would you mind not putting "we" in your posts as if you are a member of HM Forces please
Having just spent time with chaps returning from Afghanistan and Iraq with limbs missing and shrapnel still embedded in their bodies, it is fairly clear that they are extremely grateful for their Railcard. Especially after it went up to £12
"I forgot the biggest benefit of them all! Security. Can't think of many firms that offer you decades of guaranteed employment."
Guaranteed employment? Top tip. 11 November is coming up. Why not take a wander along to a Church on the Sunday? Take a seat. Listen to the service. Have a jolly old read of the names engraved on the war memorial.
Then get down on your knees and give thanks and stay there
I know freedom of speech exists and all that but would you mind not putting "we" in your posts as if you are a member of HM Forces please
Having just spent time with chaps returning from Afghanistan and Iraq with limbs missing and shrapnel still embedded in their bodies, it is fairly clear that they are extremely grateful for their Railcard. Especially after it went up to £12
"I forgot the biggest benefit of them all! Security. Can't think of many firms that offer you decades of guaranteed employment."
Guaranteed employment? Top tip. 11 November is coming up. Why not take a wander along to a Church on the Sunday? Take a seat. Listen to the service. Have a jolly old read of the names engraved on the war memorial.
Then get down on your knees and give thanks and stay there
Is your solution to pay everyone a million quid on the basis that they might get shot? You have to accept that everyone in the armed forces, chooses that career. And like any other career, someone, somewhere, has to come up with a package of benefits. OURS (if indeed you are a fulltime member of HMAF, which somehow I doubt) is pretty good when added up.
I don't think this patronising drivel is adding anything to a debate on pay and conditions. Try the Daily Mail.
