Future Carrier (Including Costs)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Shocking that one could stoop so low.
Our 'Enery, Naveleye, someone you could only aspire to.
Let the debate carry on and the falsehoods continue to be uncovered.
Our 'Enery, Naveleye, someone you could only aspire to.
Let the debate carry on and the falsehoods continue to be uncovered.
Suspicion breeds confidence
Great pic Glad. Thank you. I was a huge fan. I watched his Ali fight in black and white in 69. I could have used his help when I got mugged two weeks ago. He will be missed but not forgotten.
Never did like boxing, although amazingly it was a so-called 'sport' we were obliged to indulge in at my first prep school. Can't see that happening today!
However, 'our 'Enery' was a real gent and an ambassador for his sport. RIP - and yes, Bugner shouldn't have been awarded that victory.
Anyway, back to HM's grey floaty things and I was pleased to read this in today's Daily Torygraph:
Well done, Prince Charles!
Now let's see the other aircraftless carrier properly renamed as well!
However, 'our 'Enery' was a real gent and an ambassador for his sport. RIP - and yes, Bugner shouldn't have been awarded that victory.
Anyway, back to HM's grey floaty things and I was pleased to read this in today's Daily Torygraph:
Prince Charles 'saves Ark Royal’.
By Thomas Harding, Defence Correspondent
The name HMS Ark Royal – one of the most historic in Navy history – will pass to a new aircraft carrier, after an intervention by the Prince of Wales.
The Prince is understood to have privately agreed to allow HMS Prince of Wales, which is under construction, to be renamed Ark Royal, after the former flagship bearing the name was decommissioned.
A senior Navy officer is understood to have approached the Prince, who holds the rank of admiral in the Navy, who made clear that he had no objection to the name change.
A defence source said: “The Prince of Wales has been asked and he is pretty relaxed about it.”
A senior Navy officer said it was virtually unheard of to change the name of a ship that was already being built.
“But this does recognise that the name Ark Royal is iconic. The name conjures up the whole history of these islands and it would represent the future of the Navy and its past,” he said.
Clarence House said no formal approach had been made on the name change
A Ministry of Defence official said no decision had yet been made on naming the ship, which would be the sixth to be called Ark Royal.
By Thomas Harding, Defence Correspondent
The name HMS Ark Royal – one of the most historic in Navy history – will pass to a new aircraft carrier, after an intervention by the Prince of Wales.
The Prince is understood to have privately agreed to allow HMS Prince of Wales, which is under construction, to be renamed Ark Royal, after the former flagship bearing the name was decommissioned.
A senior Navy officer is understood to have approached the Prince, who holds the rank of admiral in the Navy, who made clear that he had no objection to the name change.
A defence source said: “The Prince of Wales has been asked and he is pretty relaxed about it.”
A senior Navy officer said it was virtually unheard of to change the name of a ship that was already being built.
“But this does recognise that the name Ark Royal is iconic. The name conjures up the whole history of these islands and it would represent the future of the Navy and its past,” he said.
Clarence House said no formal approach had been made on the name change
A Ministry of Defence official said no decision had yet been made on naming the ship, which would be the sixth to be called Ark Royal.
Now let's see the other aircraftless carrier properly renamed as well!
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Wiltshire
Age: 82
Posts: 184
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ark Royal etc. ...........
From recent memory of a thread somewhere, the Queen Mary, prewar, requested that the carrier being built and named after her, be named 'Ark Royal' instead, which was done. This I believe would have been the one that was sunk off Gibralter. If correct, then a precedent does exist.
In the meantime - granted that the US NIH syndrome has resulted in the contract and funding being withdrawn for the F35 'lift' engine, does this mean that there maybe a chance of our bean counters looking again at the 'Super Hornet' option. Available at possibly one third of the price, carrier proven design, delivery could be current with the ship.
p.s. I still like the idea of a couple of Warthogs with hooks available for the remodelling of pirates skiffs and motherships, a cheep option, also useful for SUV conversions.
In the meantime - granted that the US NIH syndrome has resulted in the contract and funding being withdrawn for the F35 'lift' engine, does this mean that there maybe a chance of our bean counters looking again at the 'Super Hornet' option. Available at possibly one third of the price, carrier proven design, delivery could be current with the ship.
p.s. I still like the idea of a couple of Warthogs with hooks available for the remodelling of pirates skiffs and motherships, a cheep option, also useful for SUV conversions.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southampton
Age: 54
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Entaxei said:
"From recent memory of a thread somewhere, the Queen Mary, prewar, requested that the carrier being built and named after her, be named 'Ark Royal' instead, which was done. This I believe would have been the one that was sunk off Gibralter. If correct, then a precedent does exist."
Mixing up a couple of tales here, Ark Royal III built in the mid 30s always had that name, but her predecessor, Ark Royal II, a converted collier and now seaplane carrier of WW1 vintage was still in service (and continued until 1950), so when III was ordered II changed her name to HMS Pegasus to free the name for the new ship.
The Queen Mary tale refers to the Liner also built in the 30s and now moored off Long Beach California (and also star of the original Poseidon Adventure). Legend has it the original plan was to name the ship RMS Queen Victoria, after the 'Greatest English Queen' but prior to launch HRH Queen Mary was given a tour of the dockyard and shown the new liner on the slip way. One of the Cunard Managers conducting the tour presented the new ship (unnamed at the time) to HRH, using the phrase 'Greatest English Queen' to hint at the name decided upon, but Queen Mary apparently took this to be a form of flattery and replied along the lines of 'Oh you're naming it after me?' and Cunard was stuck after that!
"From recent memory of a thread somewhere, the Queen Mary, prewar, requested that the carrier being built and named after her, be named 'Ark Royal' instead, which was done. This I believe would have been the one that was sunk off Gibralter. If correct, then a precedent does exist."
Mixing up a couple of tales here, Ark Royal III built in the mid 30s always had that name, but her predecessor, Ark Royal II, a converted collier and now seaplane carrier of WW1 vintage was still in service (and continued until 1950), so when III was ordered II changed her name to HMS Pegasus to free the name for the new ship.
The Queen Mary tale refers to the Liner also built in the 30s and now moored off Long Beach California (and also star of the original Poseidon Adventure). Legend has it the original plan was to name the ship RMS Queen Victoria, after the 'Greatest English Queen' but prior to launch HRH Queen Mary was given a tour of the dockyard and shown the new liner on the slip way. One of the Cunard Managers conducting the tour presented the new ship (unnamed at the time) to HRH, using the phrase 'Greatest English Queen' to hint at the name decided upon, but Queen Mary apparently took this to be a form of flattery and replied along the lines of 'Oh you're naming it after me?' and Cunard was stuck after that!
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Bavaria
Posts: 99
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the meantime - granted that the US NIH syndrome has resulted in the contract and funding being withdrawn for the F35 'lift' engine, does this mean that there maybe a chance of our bean counters looking again at the 'Super Hornet' option. Available at possibly one third of the price, carrier proven design, delivery could be current with the ship.
This kind of thing might be excusable, even commendable, if it would guarantee jobs in the UK, but it's not. There's really nothing to stop BAE placing their piece of the F35 workshare action in the US. (high time they were renationalised if you ask me)
Last edited by Jetex_Jim; 4th May 2011 at 09:43.
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: oxford
Posts: 469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the meantime - granted that the US NIH syndrome has resulted in the contract and funding being withdrawn for the F35 'lift' engine, does this mean that there maybe a chance of our bean counters looking again at the 'Super Hornet' option. Available at possibly one third of the price, carrier proven design, delivery could be current with the ship.
Bubbling rumours that costings for loan/purchase of some frames being discussed in the top corridors of power.
Now wouldn't that be top trumps for the single seat types in the FAA - bless 'em.
Tourist - We would then just have to find you lot some nice helicopters, the FAA will have a secure future, and we can all be friends again - well sort of friends anyway.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A senior Navy officer is understood to have approached the Prince, who holds the rank of admiral in the Navy, who made clear that he had no objection to the name change.
A defence source said: “The Prince of Wales has been asked and he is pretty relaxed about it.”
A defence source said: “The Prince of Wales has been asked and he is pretty relaxed about it.”
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Home
Posts: 3,399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
67Wing
"That's because Charles knows there's cock-all chance of the RN ever having the resources to complete the ships, let alone fly aircraft off them. "
I'll let you in on a little secret.
We don't build our own ships.
Seriously.
The government pays civvys to build them, and then they give them to us.
Thats the way it works.
They might not give them to us, but they will be completed.
The tricky contract ensured that.
"That's because Charles knows there's cock-all chance of the RN ever having the resources to complete the ships, let alone fly aircraft off them. "
I'll let you in on a little secret.
We don't build our own ships.
Seriously.
The government pays civvys to build them, and then they give them to us.
Thats the way it works.
They might not give them to us, but they will be completed.
The tricky contract ensured that.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 1,515
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The government pays civvys to build them, and then they give them to us.
Mind if I rewrite that just a little....
Several governments collect huge wonga from the taxpayer and pass it through a money laundering scheme (AKA BAE) to some very rich dudes. Sort of Robin Hood in reverse (steal from the poor give to the rich, what a bitch). Somewhere along the way a whole sh*tload of people spend a great deal of time converting nice neat piles of steel and aluminium into twisted heaps of scrap steel and aluminium.
Quite what the RAF/RN get out of it I'm not entirely clear.
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Wiltshire
Age: 82
Posts: 184
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Obi Wan Russell
Many thanks for the correct info on the Ark saga, there's nothing quite like having a mixture of historical fact from multiple origins, mixed with a layer of wikipedia style 'facts' and then twisted around reality - whew!! I don't think I could say that twice, let alone think it!!.
Now what about a few hooked Warthogs for specialist anti-pirate operations, to convert/remodel their shipborne and SUV assets, or would that be cruel?
And talking about the 'Ruffle', yes it may be flying off the odd ship, but while its bad enough agreeing to share our potential major navy asset if the Ruffle one breaks down, granted we are allowed to keep it, we cannot agree to also being restrained to buying an EU produced aircraft. Think what that would do to the special relationship that Bliar put together with the US of A and that which we enjoy with the F35, whatever would they think of us, they might never trust us again or offer us new such opportunities.
Now what about a few hooked Warthogs for specialist anti-pirate operations, to convert/remodel their shipborne and SUV assets, or would that be cruel?
And talking about the 'Ruffle', yes it may be flying off the odd ship, but while its bad enough agreeing to share our potential major navy asset if the Ruffle one breaks down, granted we are allowed to keep it, we cannot agree to also being restrained to buying an EU produced aircraft. Think what that would do to the special relationship that Bliar put together with the US of A and that which we enjoy with the F35, whatever would they think of us, they might never trust us again or offer us new such opportunities.
Last edited by Entaxei; 5th May 2011 at 23:02. Reason: Spell - casting
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: In England
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If true, then the renaming proposal for PoW to ARK, would no doubt be welcomed by many....and I'm surprised that said "senior naval officer" could not recall that the outgoing Ark was a rename too. If my memory serves me right, she too was renamed after the public outcry post the demise of The Ark post "Sailor" in 1978....indeed I think she was originally to be called Indominatable..(sp?)
Cheers
Cheers
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Tiger, Blake, and Lion had a few name changes too.
Bellerophon, Tiger and Defence for instance.
Even Ark Royal was renames Pegasus.
It seems as if the policy of name changes might be considered the norm rather than an aberation.
Bellerophon, Tiger and Defence for instance.
Even Ark Royal was renames Pegasus.
It seems as if the policy of name changes might be considered the norm rather than an aberation.