Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
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Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Next week I have to go and collect some valuable items for my Boss from another RAF base as I do not trust the RAF supply system not to break the items.
However, I inquired what hoops I had to jump through to get the Official Duty Rate (ODR) since I assumed my task was DUTY !!
Apparently all ODR claims on my station have to be approved by OC ADMIN who apparently has only ever approved 1 previous ODR claim in his entire career (Proud Statement ?).
The Hoops
1. My vehicle must be appropriately insured.
2. In the future my vehicle could be used in lieu of service transport
(What a rule invented by someone just to stop people bothering to claim what is rightfully theirs!!)
Now I’m sure MP’s and Civil Servants do not have so many handbrakes when they are claiming duty mileage.
Why is it that Admin are always standing in the way?
Add this to why people are hacked off.
RANT OFF
WTN
However, I inquired what hoops I had to jump through to get the Official Duty Rate (ODR) since I assumed my task was DUTY !!
Apparently all ODR claims on my station have to be approved by OC ADMIN who apparently has only ever approved 1 previous ODR claim in his entire career (Proud Statement ?).
The Hoops
1. My vehicle must be appropriately insured.
2. In the future my vehicle could be used in lieu of service transport
(What a rule invented by someone just to stop people bothering to claim what is rightfully theirs!!)
Now I’m sure MP’s and Civil Servants do not have so many handbrakes when they are claiming duty mileage.
Why is it that Admin are always standing in the way?
Add this to why people are hacked off.
RANT OFF
WTN
Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Isn't a 'Well Travelled Nav' an oxymoron?
What do you get if you cross a nav with an Air Traffic Controller?
A bad letdown at the wrong airfield!
What do you get if you cross a nav with an Air Traffic Controller?
A bad letdown at the wrong airfield!
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
As to why I don't ask for MT, I live out and the base I am travelling to is in the opposite direct by some distance from my home plate.
WTN
WTN
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
I think I'm getting dragged off the point. The point is, if I choose to use my own vehicle then I should get the rates I am entitled to!!
WTN
WTN
Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Nope, I don't think so.
I always thought that ODR was only when you were forced to use your own vehicle, as a 'thanks for bailing us out of a tight situation' from the MOD?
Just because its 'easier' for you to use your own car is not a valid reason to get the taxpayer to pay you extra IMHO.
Besides, using your own motor for something other than home to place of work business travel is probably not covered with as much coverage on you insurance policy as you might think.
Get an MT vehicle or a rental car where the insurance is covered.
Tarnished
I always thought that ODR was only when you were forced to use your own vehicle, as a 'thanks for bailing us out of a tight situation' from the MOD?
Just because its 'easier' for you to use your own car is not a valid reason to get the taxpayer to pay you extra IMHO.
Besides, using your own motor for something other than home to place of work business travel is probably not covered with as much coverage on you insurance policy as you might think.
Get an MT vehicle or a rental car where the insurance is covered.
Tarnished
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Ah yes, the old 'Insurance' get out. Social Domestic and Pleasure normally covers travel to and from place of work but presumably not for the sort of journey you are planning. However, in practice, this is very difficult to establish. I asked my current insurance to explain what exactly was covered (I sometimes use my own vehicle for UK dets as it allows me far more freedom to get around the local area). The chap I spoke to explained that the way they looked at it was that if you chose to take your own vehicle it was covered. However, if you were 'required' to take your vehicle then it was not. I presume that ODR is claimable for the second type of journey, but have to say I have always thought there was too much 'interpretation' by the bosses for my liking.
Back to the rates, as at 1 Aug 05 the rate for MPs was 40p per mile for the first 10,000 miles (per year) and 25p per mile thereafter. This is the same as the ODR. The current PTR is 26.2 p per mile. The favourite trick at my last 2 units (don't know about my current one) was to allow 'costs within rail'. This allows you to take your own car (with the added benefits derived for you AND the Service) but only claim the PTR up to the rail fair.
I am sorry to admit that faced with such petty mindedness in the past I have refused to drive MT just to prove the point.
I accept it's public money and shouldn't be wasted, but I think sometimes we forget the value of our people's good will.
Back to the rates, as at 1 Aug 05 the rate for MPs was 40p per mile for the first 10,000 miles (per year) and 25p per mile thereafter. This is the same as the ODR. The current PTR is 26.2 p per mile. The favourite trick at my last 2 units (don't know about my current one) was to allow 'costs within rail'. This allows you to take your own car (with the added benefits derived for you AND the Service) but only claim the PTR up to the rail fair.
I am sorry to admit that faced with such petty mindedness in the past I have refused to drive MT just to prove the point.
I accept it's public money and shouldn't be wasted, but I think sometimes we forget the value of our people's good will.
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
WTN
Even if you don't get the golden wheels rate, you can reclaim the difference between what the government pays you on F1771 mileage (not leave travel) and the Inland Revenue rate through your tax return. It works simply (IR 125 form refers IIRC). The Inland Revenue allows 40p/mile as legitimate expense, up to 6000 (I think) miles per year and 25p/mile thereafter and you can claim the tax relief back on the difference. By way of example, if you do 1000 miles and are paid 23p/mile you will be paid £230 by the RAF; however, the goverment allows you £400 (40p/mile). You wil therefore get tax relief 40% of the portion that the RAF didn't pay you (£68 @ 40% tax if my brain is working) as a tax credit or repayment. Your employer is obligated in law to provide you with a statement of allowances/taxable benefits paid throughout the year and you should discuss that with OC Admin and make sure you get it. It should include details of the total number of F1771 miles you completed and the rate you were paid. He/she can't dodge the requirement - it's the law ! When I was parented by Uxbridge, they automatically sent out the forms at the end of the year.
PM me if you need any more.
Regards
BT
Even if you don't get the golden wheels rate, you can reclaim the difference between what the government pays you on F1771 mileage (not leave travel) and the Inland Revenue rate through your tax return. It works simply (IR 125 form refers IIRC). The Inland Revenue allows 40p/mile as legitimate expense, up to 6000 (I think) miles per year and 25p/mile thereafter and you can claim the tax relief back on the difference. By way of example, if you do 1000 miles and are paid 23p/mile you will be paid £230 by the RAF; however, the goverment allows you £400 (40p/mile). You wil therefore get tax relief 40% of the portion that the RAF didn't pay you (£68 @ 40% tax if my brain is working) as a tax credit or repayment. Your employer is obligated in law to provide you with a statement of allowances/taxable benefits paid throughout the year and you should discuss that with OC Admin and make sure you get it. It should include details of the total number of F1771 miles you completed and the rate you were paid. He/she can't dodge the requirement - it's the law ! When I was parented by Uxbridge, they automatically sent out the forms at the end of the year.
PM me if you need any more.
Regards
BT
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Originally Posted by oldbeefer
Isn't a 'Well Travelled Nav' an oxymoron?
What do you get if you cross a nav with an Air Traffic Controller?
A bad letdown at the wrong airfield!
What do you get if you cross a nav with an Air Traffic Controller?
A bad letdown at the wrong airfield!
What do you get if you cross a pilot with a cock?
Another cock.
Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Beggar that 'use MT' thing! Unless, that is, MT is better these days than it used to be...
I once had to go from Brize to FRL at Wimborne. Told I had to use MT and was given a bright yellow Chevette estate with a collapsed drivers seat which wouldn't do more than 50 mph flat out. To cap it all, the radio had been removed 'to avoid driver distraction'....
Then there was a trip to Northwood. Allocated vehicle was an aged Mini - with no rear view mirror. "It's on order....". Asked for another, "You'll have to fill it up, sir". An hour after leaving home to collect the wretched Mini, I was driving past it again 2 fields away on the A40...
Fought like a tiger against having to use MT ever since. But when I had to go to Farnborough for a JTIDS session, when I submitted my claim (for the lower rate - Official Rate was out of the question), the beggars had knocked off 7 miles (I think) each way as my 'personal contribution'..
"But I don't claim home to duty - it isn't worth it for 8.5 miles"
"It's the rule, sir"
"Now look - I live east of Brize. The Farnborough side of Brize. I went nowhere near Brize today!"
"It's the rule, sir"
"But what if I'd said I'd driven to Brize, then retraced my steps, driven back past my house and continued to Farnborough, then the same thing coming back?"
"Ah - that would be different, sir. We'd have paid the whole journey as it wouldn't have involved home to duty"
"But that's daft!"
"It's the rule, sir"
"So, if I'd lied you would have paid me for 17 miles more than I actually drove, but by being honest you'll pay me for 14 miles less than I actually drove?"
"It's the rule, sir"
Nowadays, as mere civilian filth, if I use my car for business, I just bill them for €0.30 per km (about £0.32 per mile) at the end of the month. No proof needed, it's all based on trust and being treated as a grown up.
I once had to go from Brize to FRL at Wimborne. Told I had to use MT and was given a bright yellow Chevette estate with a collapsed drivers seat which wouldn't do more than 50 mph flat out. To cap it all, the radio had been removed 'to avoid driver distraction'....
Then there was a trip to Northwood. Allocated vehicle was an aged Mini - with no rear view mirror. "It's on order....". Asked for another, "You'll have to fill it up, sir". An hour after leaving home to collect the wretched Mini, I was driving past it again 2 fields away on the A40...
Fought like a tiger against having to use MT ever since. But when I had to go to Farnborough for a JTIDS session, when I submitted my claim (for the lower rate - Official Rate was out of the question), the beggars had knocked off 7 miles (I think) each way as my 'personal contribution'..
"But I don't claim home to duty - it isn't worth it for 8.5 miles"
"It's the rule, sir"
"Now look - I live east of Brize. The Farnborough side of Brize. I went nowhere near Brize today!"
"It's the rule, sir"
"But what if I'd said I'd driven to Brize, then retraced my steps, driven back past my house and continued to Farnborough, then the same thing coming back?"
"Ah - that would be different, sir. We'd have paid the whole journey as it wouldn't have involved home to duty"
"But that's daft!"
"It's the rule, sir"
"So, if I'd lied you would have paid me for 17 miles more than I actually drove, but by being honest you'll pay me for 14 miles less than I actually drove?"
"It's the rule, sir"
Nowadays, as mere civilian filth, if I use my car for business, I just bill them for €0.30 per km (about £0.32 per mile) at the end of the month. No proof needed, it's all based on trust and being treated as a grown up.
Last edited by BEagle; 10th Jan 2006 at 21:58.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Once had to go to another unit and no MT. Best offer was MT to Elgin and then get Buchan to pick up from Aberdeen. Buchan said f*** *ff, why should we travel twice the distance.
So, no rail, no MT and NO Fing Wheels to sign 1651. Senior bod on sqn was a flt lt (and my skipper).
I agreed to use my own car, golden miles and all, and get post-trip authorisation. I threatened to redress everyone if I didn't get paid.
Now I just claim the money and the computer pays me the same day. There is somat to be said for being one of the rule writers now.
So, no rail, no MT and NO Fing Wheels to sign 1651. Senior bod on sqn was a flt lt (and my skipper).
I agreed to use my own car, golden miles and all, and get post-trip authorisation. I threatened to redress everyone if I didn't get paid.
Now I just claim the money and the computer pays me the same day. There is somat to be said for being one of the rule writers now.
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
'thanks for bailing us out of a tight situation' from the MOD?
1. MOD would never admit to being in a tight situation, and
2. MOD would never thank those who bailed them out....ever.
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
Speaking from a Dark Blue point of view,do not use your car. You are not insured. More importantly neither will the things be that you are going to get.Use service transport. I always do if fetching expensive stuff I will have to sign for. However if you do go ahead, take an oppo with you so you do not have to leave car and contents unattended fof any reason.
Avoid imitations
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
As far as I recall, if you use your car to carry any Service equipment not normally on personal issue to you, or drive on military business to a place other than your normal place of duty, you MUST by law be insured for business use.
And watch out for the "airside" disclaimer trump card your insurer will pull if at all possible. Had an argument about that one a few years ago when my insurance company told me I had been uninsured for the past four months when driving to work and parking.
And watch out for the "airside" disclaimer trump card your insurer will pull if at all possible. Had an argument about that one a few years ago when my insurance company told me I had been uninsured for the past four months when driving to work and parking.
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Re: Why Do The Admin Branch Stand In Our Way?
So.....let me get this straight.....you're bitching because you want to use your own car, and you want the RAF to give you money to do so, for personal convenience. Your start and finish location for things such as duty journeys is your duty station, not your front door.
Suggest you try the pragmatic approach and give your MT WO a call and pop over for 5 min, explain the situation and see if someone with about 30 yrs experience of MT and regulations can't find a good answer.
Note to above: Best tried in a non-confrontational style
Suggest you try the pragmatic approach and give your MT WO a call and pop over for 5 min, explain the situation and see if someone with about 30 yrs experience of MT and regulations can't find a good answer.
Note to above: Best tried in a non-confrontational style