RAF Scampton closing before it opens?
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RAF Scampton closing before it opens?
ladies & gents,
a recent rumour from a 'rather senior' source has indicated that due to unforseen (& foreseen) financial implications RAF/CRC Scampton may be closing although the CRC is not even operational yet and wouldn't be until early 2006. The rumour gets more interesting when it is implied that we may in fact be going to RAF Leeming instead along with TCW.
Anyone else heard anything more on this?
a recent rumour from a 'rather senior' source has indicated that due to unforseen (& foreseen) financial implications RAF/CRC Scampton may be closing although the CRC is not even operational yet and wouldn't be until early 2006. The rumour gets more interesting when it is implied that we may in fact be going to RAF Leeming instead along with TCW.
Anyone else heard anything more on this?
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Trolling, trolling, trolling.....
If you're really where your profile implies you'll have plenty of contacts, including STH, who have either briefed you in one of the many meetings held recently or will be willing to over the phone. You therefore don't need to be asking silly questions like this here.
If you are journo scum - nice try but not good enough.
If you are journo scum - nice try but not good enough.
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no this is something everyone has heard out in theatre which was in fact briefed on mass to our lads during a question & answer session with a senior officer.. as for being from northumberland.. people can live in northumberland without working there.
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CRC Scampton WILL be standing up on schedule. That is a given.
The financial problems concern the fact that de-asbestosing the buildings and reparing the infrastructure is likely to cost more than was initially estimated. As a consequence a new feasibility study has been mounted with a view to comparing the cost of moving the ASSUs to alternative units with irreducible spare capacity (such as Leeming post-F3), and the cost of moving them to Scampton. NO decision has yet been made, and as a consequence units continue to plan for a move to Scampton.
The financial problems concern the fact that de-asbestosing the buildings and reparing the infrastructure is likely to cost more than was initially estimated. As a consequence a new feasibility study has been mounted with a view to comparing the cost of moving the ASSUs to alternative units with irreducible spare capacity (such as Leeming post-F3), and the cost of moving them to Scampton. NO decision has yet been made, and as a consequence units continue to plan for a move to Scampton.
'Irreducible Spare Capacity'. You should be banned for using such crap meaningless managerspeak on this forum.
This rumour is just that, a rumour. Its about the 20th I've heard this year. As we speak, nothing has changed and it is not good to keep spreading these types of rumours when people are in the process of moving/worrying about schools etc. Much more fun to talk about the mating habits of female FCs.
This rumour is just that, a rumour. Its about the 20th I've heard this year. As we speak, nothing has changed and it is not good to keep spreading these types of rumours when people are in the process of moving/worrying about schools etc. Much more fun to talk about the mating habits of female FCs.
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The mating habits of female FCs should probably find a separate thread... if at all!
Irreducible spare capacity is pretty plain English in my opinion. It means, "unused (spare) capacity that cannot be disposed of (irreducible)". I believe in being concise. Those who've seen my posts before will know I don't respond well to management speak or PC bolleaux.
The information I have provided above was given to me and 150 others at a briefing last month. No decision has been made, but someone had the sense to look at the costings and propose a feasibility study.
To add my personal slant, I don't really think that setting up RAF Scampton as a "hub" is really 100% necessary. The CRC will stand up because it is already built and ready to go. The rest of the stn needs to be repaired, repainted, and reorganised. Buildings need vast quantities of asbestos to be stripped out. The sewers, as I understand it, are in poor repair. The stn needs to be set up for modern computer ops. English Heritage are (wrongly) poking their noses in and not allowing this country's military to go about its business efficiently. The roads need improving. The electrical and water supplies will probably need to be improved and backed up. SHQ's upper floor is uninhabitable, as are many of the accommodation blocks, which need to be brought up to modern standards. The messing facilities will need to be improved and expanded drastically; at the moment the Combined Mess can't cater for the personnel already stationed at Scampton, hence the imminent spillover to RAF Kirton-in-Lyndesy. The Sgts' Mess is boarded up and will cost God knows how much to run up again. The Officers' Mess alone is likely to cost millions to stand up again.
I would like RAF Scampton to stand up as a MOB, honestly. I'm all for the RAF expanding; I think we need to! But for God's sake, look at this logically. When the F3 fleet is withdrawn, Leeming - an operational station - loses its main role. Why not use its irreducible spare capacity (or "previously operationally capable facilities with no current role") to accommodate the ASSUs? Not all cost-cutting is hostile, some of it can actually save us the expense of spending millions when it isn't necessary.
Which is all desperately unfortunate for families, and I think we can all appreciate what a hard time people are having at the moment. It's a pain, but I'm sure things will settle down when the decision is made. I hope so, at any rate.
Irreducible spare capacity is pretty plain English in my opinion. It means, "unused (spare) capacity that cannot be disposed of (irreducible)". I believe in being concise. Those who've seen my posts before will know I don't respond well to management speak or PC bolleaux.
The information I have provided above was given to me and 150 others at a briefing last month. No decision has been made, but someone had the sense to look at the costings and propose a feasibility study.
To add my personal slant, I don't really think that setting up RAF Scampton as a "hub" is really 100% necessary. The CRC will stand up because it is already built and ready to go. The rest of the stn needs to be repaired, repainted, and reorganised. Buildings need vast quantities of asbestos to be stripped out. The sewers, as I understand it, are in poor repair. The stn needs to be set up for modern computer ops. English Heritage are (wrongly) poking their noses in and not allowing this country's military to go about its business efficiently. The roads need improving. The electrical and water supplies will probably need to be improved and backed up. SHQ's upper floor is uninhabitable, as are many of the accommodation blocks, which need to be brought up to modern standards. The messing facilities will need to be improved and expanded drastically; at the moment the Combined Mess can't cater for the personnel already stationed at Scampton, hence the imminent spillover to RAF Kirton-in-Lyndesy. The Sgts' Mess is boarded up and will cost God knows how much to run up again. The Officers' Mess alone is likely to cost millions to stand up again.
I would like RAF Scampton to stand up as a MOB, honestly. I'm all for the RAF expanding; I think we need to! But for God's sake, look at this logically. When the F3 fleet is withdrawn, Leeming - an operational station - loses its main role. Why not use its irreducible spare capacity (or "previously operationally capable facilities with no current role") to accommodate the ASSUs? Not all cost-cutting is hostile, some of it can actually save us the expense of spending millions when it isn't necessary.
Which is all desperately unfortunate for families, and I think we can all appreciate what a hard time people are having at the moment. It's a pain, but I'm sure things will settle down when the decision is made. I hope so, at any rate.
Last edited by tablet_eraser; 15th Nov 2005 at 23:05.
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Seems to me that if the station had been on "Care and Maintenance" in the first place, the imminent need to replace every life support system on the camp wouldn't be there. Let the place go, and yes, everything needs renewing.
Time and time again, the MOD makes such an arse of these things. Being an ex-squaddie with the benefit of RAF exposure, I would have to say that the MOD have been short sighted over the years, except in RAFG. Bruggen and Gutersloh now Army barracks. Good. Runways still there if needed. Hangars make great garages.
But in UK, we are apparently about to close Coltishall and St Mawgan, while reopening Scampton. Why?
Even if the radar heads etc are on the East coast, at 300,000,000 metres per second, it doesn't take very long to get a radar picture in Cornwall. Or Akrotiri for that matter.
Why must we take these ideal military establishments, and dispose of them?
Little Rissington Business Park my arse. It's an airfield in the Cotwolds. Like Kemble. Like South Cerney. Like Hullavington. Theyre all national assets, but how many of them are we using properly, while retaining ****holes like Blandford Camp and Bulford.
Grrr. Just glad I don't pay my tax there any more. GWB can squander it, but at least they have the Base Realignment and Closure Commission to look at things half sensibly.
Rant over. Sorry for you all.
Time and time again, the MOD makes such an arse of these things. Being an ex-squaddie with the benefit of RAF exposure, I would have to say that the MOD have been short sighted over the years, except in RAFG. Bruggen and Gutersloh now Army barracks. Good. Runways still there if needed. Hangars make great garages.
But in UK, we are apparently about to close Coltishall and St Mawgan, while reopening Scampton. Why?
Even if the radar heads etc are on the East coast, at 300,000,000 metres per second, it doesn't take very long to get a radar picture in Cornwall. Or Akrotiri for that matter.
Why must we take these ideal military establishments, and dispose of them?
Little Rissington Business Park my arse. It's an airfield in the Cotwolds. Like Kemble. Like South Cerney. Like Hullavington. Theyre all national assets, but how many of them are we using properly, while retaining ****holes like Blandford Camp and Bulford.
Grrr. Just glad I don't pay my tax there any more. GWB can squander it, but at least they have the Base Realignment and Closure Commission to look at things half sensibly.
Rant over. Sorry for you all.
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Tablet,
You are entirely correct in your summing up of the current situation, but surely the question should be
How the f*^% have the RAF managed to balls up the situation (at Scampton) so badly?
There have been so many studies into the future requirements for the RAF, it has cost the MOD ŁM's, but unfortunately these individual studies have not been coordinated, so one study recommends one thing, and someone else recommends entirely the opposite. It is only just now that these opposing recommendations are coming to light.
Yes the CRC will open on time early next year, but the rest of Scampton looks unlikely to happen, and last I heard, Leeming was looking a favorite.
Don't put any money on it though, because one thing is for sure, the RAF will not be spending any money more than necessary, the cheapest option is, unfortunately, the best, as far as they are concerned.
You are entirely correct in your summing up of the current situation, but surely the question should be
How the f*^% have the RAF managed to balls up the situation (at Scampton) so badly?
There have been so many studies into the future requirements for the RAF, it has cost the MOD ŁM's, but unfortunately these individual studies have not been coordinated, so one study recommends one thing, and someone else recommends entirely the opposite. It is only just now that these opposing recommendations are coming to light.
Yes the CRC will open on time early next year, but the rest of Scampton looks unlikely to happen, and last I heard, Leeming was looking a favorite.
Don't put any money on it though, because one thing is for sure, the RAF will not be spending any money more than necessary, the cheapest option is, unfortunately, the best, as far as they are concerned.
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Quote; "the RAF will not be spending any money more than necessary, the cheapest option is, unfortunately, the best, as far as they are concerned."
FINNINGLEY:
Millions on new nav school, new MT, even a new church, and what?
Close it.
The RAF will rebuild Scampton and then close it anyway. Leeming will rot, because to maintain, re-role the station is far too logical for this mans air force.
PS
Dont know where that hyperlink came from!!!!!!!!!
FINNINGLEY:
Millions on new nav school, new MT, even a new church, and what?
Close it.
The RAF will rebuild Scampton and then close it anyway. Leeming will rot, because to maintain, re-role the station is far too logical for this mans air force.
PS
Dont know where that hyperlink came from!!!!!!!!!
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
No, no, no, no! You don´t understand how it works. They´ll refurbish the Messes, accommodation and SHQ; lay new drains; renew the roads; put in a new water supply.
Then, they´ll close the place and move everyone to Leeming. It´s tradition...
Then, they´ll close the place and move everyone to Leeming. It´s tradition...
Rest assured that build and bust is not just an RAF custom(?). Look at Portland. On the other hand please, please don't look at all the new builds at Yeovilton and Culdrose!!
6Z3 - OK then, 'nasty little habit' rather than custom or tradition!
If it really would cost a fortune to refurbish Sunny Scampton (and what an arse decision it was to put the place on so-called care and maintenance and let it rot so badly), then why not indeed KEEP COLTISHALL OPEN.
It even has an illustrious history in the radar defence of the UK as well as being the last RAF aerodrome left which was operational in the Battle of Britain.
Or is it just that the MoD beancounters are salivating in frenzy at the thought of the money they think they could get for the place if they flogged it off to some Naarfaalk house builder?
If it really would cost a fortune to refurbish Sunny Scampton (and what an arse decision it was to put the place on so-called care and maintenance and let it rot so badly), then why not indeed KEEP COLTISHALL OPEN.
It even has an illustrious history in the radar defence of the UK as well as being the last RAF aerodrome left which was operational in the Battle of Britain.
Or is it just that the MoD beancounters are salivating in frenzy at the thought of the money they think they could get for the place if they flogged it off to some Naarfaalk house builder?
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It even has an illustrious history in the radar defence of the UK as well as being the last RAF aerdrome left which was operational in the Battle of Britain.
Order of battle:
oops!
You're right, of course, I should have said 'fighter aerodrome'!
Ruislip International is indeed still open; I guess it's too close to London to be of interest to Ryanair though.....
You're right, of course, I should have said 'fighter aerodrome'!
Ruislip International is indeed still open; I guess it's too close to London to be of interest to Ryanair though.....
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last 'operational' RAF station then, as London (Northolt) is just a Civil Airport with uniformed staff.
How about re-opening Neat if you want to save CS?
Edited to say; beaten by BEags - oh the shame!
How about re-opening Neat if you want to save CS?
Edited to say; beaten by BEags - oh the shame!
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Gutersloh went the same way...
Spend millions on a new gym, new dispersal area/MT sect at 230Sqn, various other bits and hey presto, close it !!
Well hand it to the Army, similar thing....
Fact now is the locals are complaining about the lack of the RAF in Gutersloh, why ?? because there is now more flying from the airfield than there was when the RAF were there.....!!!
Surprised Waddo is still open with all the new builds over the years....
I hope the bean counters keep up such a good job, because at least my job will be safe, delivering all the new building supplies to places i was posted too !!!
Spend millions on a new gym, new dispersal area/MT sect at 230Sqn, various other bits and hey presto, close it !!
Well hand it to the Army, similar thing....
Fact now is the locals are complaining about the lack of the RAF in Gutersloh, why ?? because there is now more flying from the airfield than there was when the RAF were there.....!!!
Surprised Waddo is still open with all the new builds over the years....
I hope the bean counters keep up such a good job, because at least my job will be safe, delivering all the new building supplies to places i was posted too !!!
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last 'operational' RAF station then, as London (Northolt) is just a Civil Airport with uniformed staff.
You're right, of course, I should have said 'fighter aerodrome'!
Now whether you class Harriers and Jags as 'fighters' is conjecture I suppose
Getting back to the original argument.
I agree the CRC will stand up and everything else will go to the four winds. What about the School of Fighter Control? Still scheduled to move by 2010. The whole thing is, IMHO, a farce. We have, for the first time in decades, got a more or less purpose built environment at Boulmer which is STILL being finished off and we are closing it to go back into 2nd world war accom. Its crass, sends the wrong message and is causing a great deal of irritation around the houses.
This has been an ill thought out venture from the start. Costs are prohibitve at the moment and the end state will be far removed from the original intention.
Keep Boulmer as the 24 hour CRC, keep the SFC and leave Scampton as the fallback/day working outfit.
The other really annoying aspect is that we are having to pull people back off posts to man both CRCs. This means losing (possibly) some NATO and Joint type posts which, in this day and age, is a step backward. The FC Branch has evolved extremely well over the last 5 years and our Lords and Masters need to be very careful about wrong footing that continued progress.
AMEN!!
Tablet: At least you did not say 'Over-arching'. Plain English??? BAHH!!
I agree the CRC will stand up and everything else will go to the four winds. What about the School of Fighter Control? Still scheduled to move by 2010. The whole thing is, IMHO, a farce. We have, for the first time in decades, got a more or less purpose built environment at Boulmer which is STILL being finished off and we are closing it to go back into 2nd world war accom. Its crass, sends the wrong message and is causing a great deal of irritation around the houses.
This has been an ill thought out venture from the start. Costs are prohibitve at the moment and the end state will be far removed from the original intention.
Keep Boulmer as the 24 hour CRC, keep the SFC and leave Scampton as the fallback/day working outfit.
The other really annoying aspect is that we are having to pull people back off posts to man both CRCs. This means losing (possibly) some NATO and Joint type posts which, in this day and age, is a step backward. The FC Branch has evolved extremely well over the last 5 years and our Lords and Masters need to be very careful about wrong footing that continued progress.
AMEN!!
Tablet: At least you did not say 'Over-arching'. Plain English??? BAHH!!