Actuals are coming!
Actuals are coming!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
if we are going on to actuals (hadnt heard so) then i can gaurantee that overall the bill to the service will come out much higher than what is currently paid in rates. if we are treated like children then we will start acting like children! (i exclude vc10 guys from this as they are already well versed in acting like children, even when on rates
)
)
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Up North
Posts: 801
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This moves Service personnel into line with civil servants in one respect.
Also, the ridiculous situation where you were supposed to only get the CHBS rate for a hotel stay that was more expensive shuld be redressed (although I tried to make sure that everyone out of pocket was reimbursed).
Will the Services move to the self-certification system (whilst keeping receipts in case of audit) employed by the civil service? Can Armed Forces personnel be trusted?
Also, the ridiculous situation where you were supposed to only get the CHBS rate for a hotel stay that was more expensive shuld be redressed (although I tried to make sure that everyone out of pocket was reimbursed).
Will the Services move to the self-certification system (whilst keeping receipts in case of audit) employed by the civil service? Can Armed Forces personnel be trusted?
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
juliet,
I take great exception to the VC10 comment in your last post! So much so that I'm gonna tell my dad on you. And my dad is much bigger than your dad. And anyway, you're dead after school.....
Actuals, eh? When will the bean counters ever learn that hungry and devious Ascoteers will always find a way round their attempts at curtailing our fun.
Where did this info come from? Haven't heard anything at our place (although I have been skiving off to avoid the AOC's inspection today)
I take great exception to the VC10 comment in your last post! So much so that I'm gonna tell my dad on you. And my dad is much bigger than your dad. And anyway, you're dead after school.....
Actuals, eh? When will the bean counters ever learn that hungry and devious Ascoteers will always find a way round their attempts at curtailing our fun.
Where did this info come from? Haven't heard anything at our place (although I have been skiving off to avoid the AOC's inspection today)
Champagne anyone...?
Ah…….happy days 
Who could forget the good old actuals in Kuwait? I remember getting a stand up bollocking from the then OC Accts when I was a young co-pilot as my imprest paperwork showed that a couple of crew members had taken their lunch by the pool – the meals showed up on the bill as “Poolside”. I tried to explain that three people had had burgers by the pool at a cost of about $10 each. Now almost blue in the face, OC Accts “advised” me that meals ARE to be taken in the hotel restaurant buffet and nowhere else.
Not wishing to cause any further losses to HMG I duly arranged for every crewmember to take lunch in the hotel restaurant, every day, next time I was there. Fabulously, the lunchtime buffet worked out at about $45 a head. All 6 of us trooped in for lunch every day in the restaurant. This meant a daily bill of between $250 and $300. For 4 days.
Accountancy in action……. $40 a day by the pool or $300 a day in the restaurant?
Accts Flt were much happier with the second bill……
Who could forget the good old actuals in Kuwait? I remember getting a stand up bollocking from the then OC Accts when I was a young co-pilot as my imprest paperwork showed that a couple of crew members had taken their lunch by the pool – the meals showed up on the bill as “Poolside”. I tried to explain that three people had had burgers by the pool at a cost of about $10 each. Now almost blue in the face, OC Accts “advised” me that meals ARE to be taken in the hotel restaurant buffet and nowhere else. Not wishing to cause any further losses to HMG I duly arranged for every crewmember to take lunch in the hotel restaurant, every day, next time I was there. Fabulously, the lunchtime buffet worked out at about $45 a head. All 6 of us trooped in for lunch every day in the restaurant. This meant a daily bill of between $250 and $300. For 4 days.
Accountancy in action……. $40 a day by the pool or $300 a day in the restaurant?
Accts Flt were much happier with the second bill……
Leaving aside the puerile sniping that will undoubtedly follow the post from juliet, the concept of reimbursment for justifiable out of pocket expenses doesn't seem that unreasonable to me as mere civilian filth.....
Until you consider the practicalities. Specifically who would pay the cost of the 'actual' expense - and when. And who would justify it?
Nowadays if I travel somewhere, the company pays for me to drive to the airport, park, fly to wherever, stay overnight and the same coming back. Plus any meals I might pay for. Easy enough, just send them the breakdown every month. OK - fine for one person and a company which trusts you and isn't spending taxpayers' money directly.
But to settle a Service bill with every single item fully receipted and identified.....what joy for the FSI holder. Perhaps juliet's auxiliary crew station will soon house an Air Adminer with laptop to account for every actual penny spent?
"OK - who didn't have rice...?"
Until you consider the practicalities. Specifically who would pay the cost of the 'actual' expense - and when. And who would justify it?
Nowadays if I travel somewhere, the company pays for me to drive to the airport, park, fly to wherever, stay overnight and the same coming back. Plus any meals I might pay for. Easy enough, just send them the breakdown every month. OK - fine for one person and a company which trusts you and isn't spending taxpayers' money directly.
But to settle a Service bill with every single item fully receipted and identified.....what joy for the FSI holder. Perhaps juliet's auxiliary crew station will soon house an Air Adminer with laptop to account for every actual penny spent?
"OK - who didn't have rice...?"
Yes, Him
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: West Sussex, UK
Posts: 2,689
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A bean counter at a large firm I once worked for demanded receipts for every little thing.
Pratt was quite happy with receipts he could not possibly read, written in Thai, Russian, Zulu etc. Kept all his beans in a line I suppose.
Pratt was quite happy with receipts he could not possibly read, written in Thai, Russian, Zulu etc. Kept all his beans in a line I suppose.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Up North
Posts: 801
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A bean counter at a large firm I once worked for demanded receipts for every little thing.
Pratt was quite happy with receipts he could not possibly read, written in Thai, Russian, Zulu etc. Kept all his beans in a line I suppose.
Pratt was quite happy with receipts he could not possibly read, written in Thai, Russian, Zulu etc. Kept all his beans in a line I suppose.
Trouble was, that his countersigning officer (RAF) knew Norwegian...1771 was resubmitted without receipt!
The system the civil service use seems to work for them and they are larger than the Armed Forces! Could I see our lords and masters simply transferring the system across without introducing various hoops to jump through? Not really....
Rumour has it that the 'foreign receipt' trick worked quite well for a while. Until someone brought back a recipt in Russian thinking "That'll fox the blighters"....
Until The Blunt Ones found someone who understood Russian - and who then asked them about all the wine and vodka on the bill!
Until The Blunt Ones found someone who understood Russian - and who then asked them about all the wine and vodka on the bill!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
jeez, touched a nerve did i? back to my box then from where i will keep quiet and promise not to snipe ever again, puerile or not any advice on in flight catering and imprests from the vc10 champs would still be appreciated though
any advice on in flight catering and imprests from the vc10 champs would still be appreciated though
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Much-Binding-in-the-Marsh
Posts: 460
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting spread of views. On the whole actuals will cost the budget more as people will not generally impose any self discipline on their spending habits if it is all to be reimbursed so long as it meets the 'eligibility' criteria. That is why it was dropped last time around.
I work in a mixed Service + Civilian organisation where we often travel together. The civvies want receipts for all meals (and can claim up to half a bottle of wine with dinner) and claim back total expenditure afterwards. My claims go to Uxbridge who scrutinise like mad, even though I'm the budget holder, and then pay up without a murmur. My RN colleague sends his to HMS Nelson (I think) who scrutinise like mad, argue the toss, scrutinise again and then write to me to check that I'm happy even though I countersigned in the first place. My army officers are only in the Service as a hobby and for something to do between managing the family estate and adventurous training so don't bother claiming!
I work in a mixed Service + Civilian organisation where we often travel together. The civvies want receipts for all meals (and can claim up to half a bottle of wine with dinner) and claim back total expenditure afterwards. My claims go to Uxbridge who scrutinise like mad, even though I'm the budget holder, and then pay up without a murmur. My RN colleague sends his to HMS Nelson (I think) who scrutinise like mad, argue the toss, scrutinise again and then write to me to check that I'm happy even though I countersigned in the first place. My army officers are only in the Service as a hobby and for something to do between managing the family estate and adventurous training so don't bother claiming!
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: France 46
Age: 77
Posts: 1,743
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Beagle,
You will remember the days of travelling to Italy before the Euro; and justifying the expenditure you incurred unwittingly (in a currency where even children were millionaires) and nobody had any change.
It got so bad under one OC Accounts that OC "XX" Sqn did the next trip to Rome and returned his Imprest to the Plt Off Accountant together with a large bag of boiled sweets; patiently explaining that "the orange ones are 20 lira; the green ones are 30 lira, the red ones are 50 lira" etc.
Then there was trying to explain that you really needed US Dollars and UK Pounds to go to Moscow; they didn't want roubles - they had enough of their own.
We once took an OC Accounts as imprest holder on a training flight - never, ever, again. It took months to sort out the paperwork!!!
You will remember the days of travelling to Italy before the Euro; and justifying the expenditure you incurred unwittingly (in a currency where even children were millionaires) and nobody had any change.
It got so bad under one OC Accounts that OC "XX" Sqn did the next trip to Rome and returned his Imprest to the Plt Off Accountant together with a large bag of boiled sweets; patiently explaining that "the orange ones are 20 lira; the green ones are 30 lira, the red ones are 50 lira" etc.
Then there was trying to explain that you really needed US Dollars and UK Pounds to go to Moscow; they didn't want roubles - they had enough of their own.
We once took an OC Accounts as imprest holder on a training flight - never, ever, again. It took months to sort out the paperwork!!!
There was once a fierce Air Vice Corporal Cashwraf at the covert Oxonian Aerodrome, who wouldn't process our FSI returns from night stops in Palermo.....
"Who sanctioned these hire cars - they're not cheap?"
"They were provided by the Handling Agent!"
"Who appointed that Handling Agent. The fees are very expensive"
"Group did. And It's the only one at Punta Raisi"
"Why couldn't you just book your oqn hire cars?"
"Because it's Sicily - and that's the way things happen! You don't use his hire cars, the fuel for the aircraft doesn't arrive..."
"I need a name and address of the Manager to give to Command Accounts"
"OK, it's Mr Don Corleone, La Cosa Nostra, Palermo!"
Never did know what she did, but the FSIs were processed the next day!
And now it's over to some ex-Victor mate to recoun the tale of the Money Monster and the coat hangars at Ellsworth during Prairie Vortex......
"Who sanctioned these hire cars - they're not cheap?"
"They were provided by the Handling Agent!"
"Who appointed that Handling Agent. The fees are very expensive"
"Group did. And It's the only one at Punta Raisi"
"Why couldn't you just book your oqn hire cars?"
"Because it's Sicily - and that's the way things happen! You don't use his hire cars, the fuel for the aircraft doesn't arrive..."
"I need a name and address of the Manager to give to Command Accounts"
"OK, it's Mr Don Corleone, La Cosa Nostra, Palermo!"
Never did know what she did, but the FSIs were processed the next day!
And now it's over to some ex-Victor mate to recoun the tale of the Money Monster and the coat hangars at Ellsworth during Prairie Vortex......
'Bribe' is a bit obvious, I once had to include a 'Customs handling fee' on a FSI at Dakar which SEngO had paid to the police to encourage them to recover a u/s Conway fuel flow regulator which had been stolen by the locals - they just wanted the wooden crate it was in and had dumped it in a ditch!
That's the same Money Monster, by the way!
That's the same Money Monster, by the way!
Guest
Posts: n/a
One place where the civil servants hold an advantage is the ability to get an advance. Back of a fag packet sums should get you some where near (then cut it to, say, 80% to be sure) then bung in an advance. When you are spending Gordons lucre the subsequent claim is processed in double quick time!
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: uk
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Bags of actuals
Once sent on a 3 week det and made to go on actuals for the whole period. I put a large box in the det ops room for all the crews to donate their receipts. At the end of 3 weeks I presented the chief clerk with 2 dustbin bags full of receipts and asked for my money! After returning to my office I had a call from OC Accts to ask if I would mind having rates instead!
I of course accepted her offer. Following year the subject of actuals was not even raised !
I of course accepted her offer. Following year the subject of actuals was not even raised !
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Actuals
Our MOD agency (guess which one!) went over to actuals about 7 years ago I think. T&S cost have risen considerably and the bean counters are happier now that they have a paper trail to follow. The problem is that staff are generally unwilling to undertake detachments to cover for sickness, leave etc at other stations, so surprise, surprise....a detached duty allowance has been introduced as an incentive to detach somewhere. Stupid!! Why not just ditch the actuals and go back to a rate. Save a LOT of time and money.
CM
CM