IOT 211 Cancelled
Have heard from a very reliable source that it's a manning decision. We've got too many pilots floating around, holds building up, so it's a very sensible, non-knee jerk reaction to make sure we're set up well for the future.
Aaargh....
Aaargh....
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My, my, my! We are all very suspicious on this thread!
As I understand it, the RAF is undertaking more than just a review of IOT and is preparing the way to better educate all its officers (not just us aircrew) from about 2005 onwards. The work ongoing involves both a review of IOT (the Officer Cadet Training Review) and a review of Air Warfare Training (aka the Air Warfare Strategy).
The AWT bit will mean that, from about mid-2005, ALL officers graduating from IOT will undertake 2 weeks training in general air warfare with the AWC at Cranwell before moving on to their speciliast training whether it be flying, controlling, supplying, engineering or scribbling etc (even the medics etc will be included). Later in life they will receive more AWT updates before, when selected for promotion to wg cdr, undertaking a much more intensive 4 week course in air warfare back at AWC Cranwell. See the last Air Sec's bulletin if you don't believe me.
The IOTC is being revamped to make the education more appropriate and less of the "leadership by numbers" as has been the case since about 1918. Cadets will be given more responsibility (a bit like it was back at Sleaford Tech under the Flt Cadet system that died out with the Graduate Entry scheme in the 70s) in the third term. Hopefully, they will then be better trained, more aware and ready to actually join the Service.
I don't know about you guys and, I guess, there will always be a cynical view but this seems like a vast improvement to me.
Having worked at IOT in the late 90s, I know that it is very difficult to stop the sausage machine. So I suspect that the only way of implementing the package is to take an unnatural (for IOT) break and cancel a course.
To those who think that all pilot training is going to cease for about 2 years, I suggest you look at the latest IBN that indicates that the FJ IPS will be reduced to about 45 from about 60 (memory fade - can't remember exact figures!) over the next couple of years. There is no reduction in the requirement for rotary and multi pilots, however.
Finally, to those who think from their 1980s experience that IOT is easy and wasters were allowed to graduate. The biggest staff moral booster came to me in 1997 when the new Wg Cdr Cdts arrived and successfully suspended 6 cadets at his first attempt and that was after FLC (ie half-way through) - he continued with equal success until he left in 2000.
As I understand it, the RAF is undertaking more than just a review of IOT and is preparing the way to better educate all its officers (not just us aircrew) from about 2005 onwards. The work ongoing involves both a review of IOT (the Officer Cadet Training Review) and a review of Air Warfare Training (aka the Air Warfare Strategy).
The AWT bit will mean that, from about mid-2005, ALL officers graduating from IOT will undertake 2 weeks training in general air warfare with the AWC at Cranwell before moving on to their speciliast training whether it be flying, controlling, supplying, engineering or scribbling etc (even the medics etc will be included). Later in life they will receive more AWT updates before, when selected for promotion to wg cdr, undertaking a much more intensive 4 week course in air warfare back at AWC Cranwell. See the last Air Sec's bulletin if you don't believe me.
The IOTC is being revamped to make the education more appropriate and less of the "leadership by numbers" as has been the case since about 1918. Cadets will be given more responsibility (a bit like it was back at Sleaford Tech under the Flt Cadet system that died out with the Graduate Entry scheme in the 70s) in the third term. Hopefully, they will then be better trained, more aware and ready to actually join the Service.
I don't know about you guys and, I guess, there will always be a cynical view but this seems like a vast improvement to me.
Having worked at IOT in the late 90s, I know that it is very difficult to stop the sausage machine. So I suspect that the only way of implementing the package is to take an unnatural (for IOT) break and cancel a course.
To those who think that all pilot training is going to cease for about 2 years, I suggest you look at the latest IBN that indicates that the FJ IPS will be reduced to about 45 from about 60 (memory fade - can't remember exact figures!) over the next couple of years. There is no reduction in the requirement for rotary and multi pilots, however.
Finally, to those who think from their 1980s experience that IOT is easy and wasters were allowed to graduate. The biggest staff moral booster came to me in 1997 when the new Wg Cdr Cdts arrived and successfully suspended 6 cadets at his first attempt and that was after FLC (ie half-way through) - he continued with equal success until he left in 2000.
Apologies for any apparent cynicism 
A friend currently holding with a UAS informs me that their boss had a brief claiming it was a manning decision, and sat down all his studes last week to talk about it. I tried to argue the case with him that it was probably just to change the syllabus, but he assures me they've been told its a conscious decision to help out the training system.
Anyone hear the same? Sounds ridiculous, but if UAS bosses have been formally briefed on it...?
A friend currently holding with a UAS informs me that their boss had a brief claiming it was a manning decision, and sat down all his studes last week to talk about it. I tried to argue the case with him that it was probably just to change the syllabus, but he assures me they've been told its a conscious decision to help out the training system.
Anyone hear the same? Sounds ridiculous, but if UAS bosses have been formally briefed on it...?
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The course hasnt been cancelled its been "postponed". Typical use of words! Anyway it will still be run by the Sqn that was to run the Aug course just two months later. The reason behind this is due to only having 45 people assigned to the course. The small numbers is due to the cutting of Pilot recruiting. (From 180 to 100 each year, they have not actually stopped recruiting just slashed numbers.) The new course will also be brought in, hopefully, for 211 Cse. The new Syllabus was designed to be a much better representation of RAF Officer life and what we have to do post IOT. There will be less field leadership, yes that means less pinepole tripods, and more practicle leadership and alot more on welfare and management of subordinates.
Ooh good! Much more touchy feely tree hugging cr@p and less leadership of a fighting force. That should fit in nicely with the current Government's defence policy.
Or am I being cynical.
Or am I being cynical.
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flying Garfield see my comments above re 'practicle' use of English!!!
However, I digress. The AWC is definitely an improvement. All branches should have this firmly under their belts from day one. Yes, I know it is taught in OCC, ISS, Basic Staff Course et al (do they still have those?) but a formal course and follow-ons from IOT is a step forward.
Now, having accepted that all branches need to be up to speed on the wider ramifications of Air Warfare, perhaps we will have less bitching and moaning from the non-scribbly branches when they have to do Service Writing, Orderly Room procedure etc etc etc. Or is it the case that anything not directly related to flying isn't worth the candle?
Could someone please send me some vegetable oil so that I can fry the chips on my shoulder?!!
Yours,
ex scribbly now turned pilot
However, I digress. The AWC is definitely an improvement. All branches should have this firmly under their belts from day one. Yes, I know it is taught in OCC, ISS, Basic Staff Course et al (do they still have those?) but a formal course and follow-ons from IOT is a step forward.
Now, having accepted that all branches need to be up to speed on the wider ramifications of Air Warfare, perhaps we will have less bitching and moaning from the non-scribbly branches when they have to do Service Writing, Orderly Room procedure etc etc etc. Or is it the case that anything not directly related to flying isn't worth the candle?
Could someone please send me some vegetable oil so that I can fry the chips on my shoulder?!!
Yours,
ex scribbly now turned pilot
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A longer course eh ......
Just how long does it take to teach them to say: "I know my rights"
- how about cancelling courses to get the recruitment on track?!?
Sorry, am I being too cynical?
Just how long does it take to teach them to say: "I know my rights"
- how about cancelling courses to get the recruitment on track?!?
Sorry, am I being too cynical?
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rej
It doesn't take any time to teach them how to say "I know my rights" - they get taught that at school (and little else by all accounts!)
Have to agree with Whipping Boys SATCO though. Slightly different jobs but obviously the same problems!
It doesn't take any time to teach them how to say "I know my rights" - they get taught that at school (and little else by all accounts!)
Have to agree with Whipping Boys SATCO though. Slightly different jobs but obviously the same problems!
Thread Starter
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Ah, Mr Dave, long time no hear.
How accurate is your source on this one old bean?
I would also like to point out that I have the right to accuse old rej of supplying low quality banter.
How accurate is your source on this one old bean?
I would also like to point out that I have the right to accuse old rej of supplying low quality banter.
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IOT, the future's bright
After graduating Uni, and finishing UAS in June a coupla years ago, I awaited my IOT date set for late Summer that year...as I had an assurance of Grad Direct Entry GD(P). I waited and waited, got letter after letter informing me that I had been shifted to the next IOT, with no explanation, and of course no compensation. Bursary? Didn't get one of the three on offer, but even if I would have, £1000 is a joke!
After essentially "holding", working as a cashier in a shop for months on peanuts, I was finally given late notice to go on Feb IOT. Would this have happened 20 - 30 years ago? I'd be interested to find out.
Not the way to treat future Officers/Aircrew.
As for a 9 month IOT? Not necessary if you screen applicants at OASC properly for the right attributes. Tightening up screening won't happen because the recruitment crisis would deepen. So they take a number of less suitable applicants and push them through. The RAF doesn't have an adequate supply of high calibre candidates... but to discuss why would warrant another thread!
An old QFI of mine spoke of attending IOT for 12 weeks in the early 60s.
On the bright side, I hear new accommodation is on the cards for BIM, and No. 1 mess is to be scrapped, when they get the budget for it. Cadets on 4556 IOT have got much to look forward to..........
After essentially "holding", working as a cashier in a shop for months on peanuts, I was finally given late notice to go on Feb IOT. Would this have happened 20 - 30 years ago? I'd be interested to find out.
Not the way to treat future Officers/Aircrew.
As for a 9 month IOT? Not necessary if you screen applicants at OASC properly for the right attributes. Tightening up screening won't happen because the recruitment crisis would deepen. So they take a number of less suitable applicants and push them through. The RAF doesn't have an adequate supply of high calibre candidates... but to discuss why would warrant another thread!
An old QFI of mine spoke of attending IOT for 12 weeks in the early 60s.
On the bright side, I hear new accommodation is on the cards for BIM, and No. 1 mess is to be scrapped, when they get the budget for it. Cadets on 4556 IOT have got much to look forward to..........
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This is just trying to get as much gen as I can but if 9 months isn't needed, how comes the officer courses at RMAS and BRNC virtually a year each??
What I've been told from Honnington is that they were looking at extending IOT because the field element was lacking, which I assume that DIOT feel is neccessary due to the amount of deployments that are happening now.
Any thoughts?
What I've been told from Honnington is that they were looking at extending IOT because the field element was lacking, which I assume that DIOT feel is neccessary due to the amount of deployments that are happening now.
Any thoughts?
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Field Element Lacking?
Don't believe all you hear from Honington - the Regt are currently ranked amongst the world's best empire builders and are experts at exploiting the smallest opportunity....
On the other hand, maybe we don't get enough field training - after all, with CCS, IDT, IRT, Emergency pre-deployment IRT and weapons drills, additional live firing, Respirator and certificate checks on deployment, on processing at the airhead, on arrival in theatre each and every time you deploy, they can't cover everything can they?
SBG
On the other hand, maybe we don't get enough field training - after all, with CCS, IDT, IRT, Emergency pre-deployment IRT and weapons drills, additional live firing, Respirator and certificate checks on deployment, on processing at the airhead, on arrival in theatre each and every time you deploy, they can't cover everything can they?
SBG
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Time Bandit. I am welling up here. You are such a brave little trooper and have suffered SUCH adversity to get through the hallowed gates of Sleaford Tech. I can only thank my gods that I have not seen this level of adversity in my time.
As for taking people on with the 'right attributes' - sure - plenty of people out there with a grounding in leadership theory (and practice), weapon handling, Service Writing, NBC and other such military practices. Or do you just mean pilot? "PPL? Right this way, Sir. Wings over there, flying suit, Flt Lt rank, hat at jaunty angle, labrador. Check. Fit to go, Sir." Ha hahahaha.
As for taking people on with the 'right attributes' - sure - plenty of people out there with a grounding in leadership theory (and practice), weapon handling, Service Writing, NBC and other such military practices. Or do you just mean pilot? "PPL? Right this way, Sir. Wings over there, flying suit, Flt Lt rank, hat at jaunty angle, labrador. Check. Fit to go, Sir." Ha hahahaha.
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Well, Hinecap,
The mess I was involved in is nothing compared to the mincing many guys are subject to, whilst getting into Cranditz. Many have to wait more than the 8 months I did, being moved from one IOT to the next.
However I assume you would think it's not too bad if you weren't paid for the next 8 months (£14,000 for a P/O), lost that seniority, and got posted to a supermarket to work as a cashier before recommencing duties. Do you work in DIOT admin by any chance?
Because it's all rosy with the setup at OASC/IOT.
The mess I was involved in is nothing compared to the mincing many guys are subject to, whilst getting into Cranditz. Many have to wait more than the 8 months I did, being moved from one IOT to the next.
However I assume you would think it's not too bad if you weren't paid for the next 8 months (£14,000 for a P/O), lost that seniority, and got posted to a supermarket to work as a cashier before recommencing duties. Do you work in DIOT admin by any chance?
Because it's all rosy with the setup at OASC/IOT.
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Unpaid "holding"
Just wondered how many UAS mates (uc/bursar) with a view to joining 211 are miffed about having to rock on down to the job center and explain to some ex-doll recipient how, although they've been selected to become an officer in the RAF, are fully EFT trained and have been sponsored since the age of 16, need some wack job in a warehouse/back office TFN.
I've heard mixed views of what is available for us in interim but are the RAF seriously going to abandon their keenest and most prominent UAS studes TFN while continuing to pay, fly, feed.... people who can barely drag their sorry a**es to town nights and the odd camp?
GF
P.S. I'm not bitter or anything!
I've heard mixed views of what is available for us in interim but are the RAF seriously going to abandon their keenest and most prominent UAS studes TFN while continuing to pay, fly, feed.... people who can barely drag their sorry a**es to town nights and the odd camp?
GF
P.S. I'm not bitter or anything!
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I guess I can't really compare. Three and a half years to get into the RAF (Options For Change - a really bad time to join). "Come back in the next financial year - no more posts" was a fave line. That was getting through OASC 1st time too. Oh - DE, so was going to be skint when I got in anyway. APO is an honour, not a rank.
Laugh about it. It only gets worse!
Laugh about it. It only gets worse!