Any room on Albert?
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Any room on Albert?
Having been kindly asked by the powers that be to consider flying something a little less fast and pointy than I am at present, I've heard word on the grapevine that the Herc fleet is looking for some fresh young navigator types for the K. Anyone got anything further.... or indeed suggestions of alternate posts?
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Have you considered the E-3D. I think flight deck naving is a trifle dull so why not go mission crew and have a long-term future. Lots of vacancies and FJ experience is always welcome.
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R&R
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The Nimrod fleet providing we still have one.
Best job for a Nav in the RAF.
If you have the ability, Captaincy is within reach. If you are now ex-FJ you must have become used to Pilots referring to "my navigator" In maritime you can refer to "my pilots".
Of course, in maritime we have a better breed of Pilots so there is none of that, instead everything is for the benefit of "The Crew"
Best job for a Nav in the RAF.
If you have the ability, Captaincy is within reach. If you are now ex-FJ you must have become used to Pilots referring to "my navigator" In maritime you can refer to "my pilots".
Of course, in maritime we have a better breed of Pilots so there is none of that, instead everything is for the benefit of "The Crew"
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The K fleet is very much in need of more navigators. If only to lower the average age down below 50
The future for the Klassic is very bright at the moment and we seam to be getting funding for new bits of kit all the time.
The K is an excellent aircraft. Yes she is getting on a bit but still has the ability to do scary/fun stuff. If you thought flying around Scotland low level in a FJ was fun come and try it in Albert. On the crew side it really is a CREW aircraft especially in the low level environment. If you want some first hand experience come down for a few days and see what we do and talk to the other Navs on LXX or 47.
All selling mistakes are caused through w@nker dancing
The future for the Klassic is very bright at the moment and we seam to be getting funding for new bits of kit all the time.
The K is an excellent aircraft. Yes she is getting on a bit but still has the ability to do scary/fun stuff. If you thought flying around Scotland low level in a FJ was fun come and try it in Albert. On the crew side it really is a CREW aircraft especially in the low level environment. If you want some first hand experience come down for a few days and see what we do and talk to the other Navs on LXX or 47.
All selling mistakes are caused through w@nker dancing
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I would also concur with TAC Queen on the future of the K. The Navs job has become increasingly more complex with all sorts of Gucci kit on board.
In fact, I would reckon that the K has more of a future than the J unless some serious money is spent on it and a radical rethink of crew composition occurs.
(Steps back and waits for the Flak)
In fact, I would reckon that the K has more of a future than the J unless some serious money is spent on it and a radical rethink of crew composition occurs.
(Steps back and waits for the Flak)
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'I would reckon that the K has more of a future than the J unless some serious money is spent on it and a radical rethink of crew composition occurs'
Radical rethink of crew composition? I know... lets bring a navigator on board, it will give the loadie a break from making the tea. What 'Radical' rethink did you have in mind?
And don't get me started on the money thing....
Radical rethink of crew composition? I know... lets bring a navigator on board, it will give the loadie a break from making the tea. What 'Radical' rethink did you have in mind?
And don't get me started on the money thing....
Champagne anyone...?
Dunno.... he's probably right. A radical rethink on flightdeck crewing is required on the J and it really is long overdue.
I've been pushing this for some time but it just falls on deaf ears. We really do need some people to start thinking outside the norm and look at the job we're trying to do!
The sooner we get rid of the second pilot on the flightdeck the better. One pilot, one ALM. The extra space on the flight deck would allow the microwave to be repositioned so that I wouldn't have to get out of my seat to use it. I reckon we could also get a shiny chrome pole with associated dancers up there too.
As for the spending serious money on it, this too is correct. I for one would like Cat IIIB autoland, autobrake and, if possible, autotaxy. This would mean I could stay asleep right up until we were on blocks rather than the ever tedious waking at 400ft I have to live with at the moment. Also I'd like to have Sidewinder. And AMRAAM. No particular reason, just reckon it would look good.
Still, keep up the good work chaps. If our masters in the IPT ever see sense then perhaps we will get that disco ball for the flightdeck and the red velvet sound proofing for the freight bay that we're all crying out for....but until that day we'll just have to muddle on through.
I've been pushing this for some time but it just falls on deaf ears. We really do need some people to start thinking outside the norm and look at the job we're trying to do!
The sooner we get rid of the second pilot on the flightdeck the better. One pilot, one ALM. The extra space on the flight deck would allow the microwave to be repositioned so that I wouldn't have to get out of my seat to use it. I reckon we could also get a shiny chrome pole with associated dancers up there too.
As for the spending serious money on it, this too is correct. I for one would like Cat IIIB autoland, autobrake and, if possible, autotaxy. This would mean I could stay asleep right up until we were on blocks rather than the ever tedious waking at 400ft I have to live with at the moment. Also I'd like to have Sidewinder. And AMRAAM. No particular reason, just reckon it would look good.
Still, keep up the good work chaps. If our masters in the IPT ever see sense then perhaps we will get that disco ball for the flightdeck and the red velvet sound proofing for the freight bay that we're all crying out for....but until that day we'll just have to muddle on through.
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With reference to the new kit for the K
I would like it put on public record that we are not I repeat NOT
Getting a stena chair lift for the nav to help the old chap up those tricky crew and flight deck stairs. (It was poo pooed)
Although we have got a TV’s on a couple of frames for the old man to watch and so keep him from talking about his days on Lancaster’s.
Also the rumour that the digital intercom is so that the nav can plug his hearing aid right into the aircraft is utter rubbish. He needs an adaptor.
Also we have solved the bending problems by positioning his wheel chair, live in nurse and spare colostomy bags on the ramp. Also fabreeze is good for getting rid of the smell of wee.
Run for cover, well amble as I have undone the nuts on the wheels of his wheel chair.
All spelling mistakes are caused by w@nker dancing
I would like it put on public record that we are not I repeat NOT
Getting a stena chair lift for the nav to help the old chap up those tricky crew and flight deck stairs. (It was poo pooed)
Although we have got a TV’s on a couple of frames for the old man to watch and so keep him from talking about his days on Lancaster’s.
Also the rumour that the digital intercom is so that the nav can plug his hearing aid right into the aircraft is utter rubbish. He needs an adaptor.
Also we have solved the bending problems by positioning his wheel chair, live in nurse and spare colostomy bags on the ramp. Also fabreeze is good for getting rid of the smell of wee.
Run for cover, well amble as I have undone the nuts on the wheels of his wheel chair.
All spelling mistakes are caused by w@nker dancing
Arbie
In the past few years that I have been reading pprune there have been many C-130 J vs K slanging matches. A fairly constant theme on these seems to have been a "slagging off" of navs on the K models, especially by loadies on the J. This has appeared to me to be much more than mere banter, "smelling of wee", etc. I realise simply reproducing this phrase does not accurately reflect the venom of the comments that were made, but believe me they were often harsh!
If you do go to the C-130 fleet I believe your abilities and contribution will not be held in high regard by those you work with. Lets see how many of the Herc fleet, non-navs that is, dsiagree with me and leap to the defence of their navigators!!
Edited for P.S
P.S Stan Bydike
With a handle like that, curious as to where you got your C-130 oulook from?
In the past few years that I have been reading pprune there have been many C-130 J vs K slanging matches. A fairly constant theme on these seems to have been a "slagging off" of navs on the K models, especially by loadies on the J. This has appeared to me to be much more than mere banter, "smelling of wee", etc. I realise simply reproducing this phrase does not accurately reflect the venom of the comments that were made, but believe me they were often harsh!
If you do go to the C-130 fleet I believe your abilities and contribution will not be held in high regard by those you work with. Lets see how many of the Herc fleet, non-navs that is, dsiagree with me and leap to the defence of their navigators!!
Edited for P.S
P.S Stan Bydike
With a handle like that, curious as to where you got your C-130 oulook from?
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BIGGUS
The Navs on the K are held in high regard as are all the trades that contribute to the crew and that does not stop at the 5 with brevets but includes others as well and my previous comments were only in fun.
If you come and fly on the Klassic you will find that the level of banter is very high. On a recent detachment we had graduated to Day 14 banter before we had departed the UK FIR.
I for one would not wish to fly on any other platform. (Not wishing to start a who's better war just my personal feelings)
It’s a big green party machine with a TV and Nintendo noise maker.
I apologise if I caused offence I thought we going back to the good old days of PP were it was a laugh.
I hang my head in shame.
All spelling mistakes were caused by w@nker dancing.
The Navs on the K are held in high regard as are all the trades that contribute to the crew and that does not stop at the 5 with brevets but includes others as well and my previous comments were only in fun.
If you come and fly on the Klassic you will find that the level of banter is very high. On a recent detachment we had graduated to Day 14 banter before we had departed the UK FIR.
I for one would not wish to fly on any other platform. (Not wishing to start a who's better war just my personal feelings)
It’s a big green party machine with a TV and Nintendo noise maker.
I apologise if I caused offence I thought we going back to the good old days of PP were it was a laugh.
I hang my head in shame.
All spelling mistakes were caused by w@nker dancing.
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It wasn't my intention for it all to end in tears! But hey, may as well fan the flames a little more - from those of you with the relevant experience, what are the major advantages/disadvantages of the Herc (down route time vs time at home etc), bearing in mind I'm a (relatively) young singlie...?
Thanks to all for your previous comments.....
Arbie
Thanks to all for your previous comments.....
Arbie
TAC Queen
I was not implying that you had made any uncomplimentary comments about navs, I was merely refering to much that I remember having read on Herc threads over previous years. I can only recall one specific person who gave navs a hard time, although there were others. It would probably be unfair to mention the one person I can remember, but what the hell, .... it was ABIW! But as I said he wasn't the only one, just the only one I can remember!
I was not implying that you had made any uncomplimentary comments about navs, I was merely refering to much that I remember having read on Herc threads over previous years. I can only recall one specific person who gave navs a hard time, although there were others. It would probably be unfair to mention the one person I can remember, but what the hell, .... it was ABIW! But as I said he wasn't the only one, just the only one I can remember!
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Arbie
As we talk the mighty K is hard at work. Not only on current operations but also on exercises and regular route's.
Time on route compared to time at home is a moveable feast really. Talking from a personal point. I'm just about to go on my second detachment this year.
If you don’t mind a bit of hard work then come on down we could do with the help.
We are reducing the crew aircraft ratio. I could go into depth about this but I don’t think I will on a public forum (sensible caption).
As for the J, K thing. A lot of it is just harsh banter unfortunately some take it too far/ mean it.
To sum up I have never worked so hard in my life. But also I have never had so much fun and loved a job as I do my present employment. (No I am not a recruiter). But then again I only make the tea.
All spelling mistakes are caused through w@nker dancing
As we talk the mighty K is hard at work. Not only on current operations but also on exercises and regular route's.
Time on route compared to time at home is a moveable feast really. Talking from a personal point. I'm just about to go on my second detachment this year.
If you don’t mind a bit of hard work then come on down we could do with the help.
We are reducing the crew aircraft ratio. I could go into depth about this but I don’t think I will on a public forum (sensible caption).
As for the J, K thing. A lot of it is just harsh banter unfortunately some take it too far/ mean it.
To sum up I have never worked so hard in my life. But also I have never had so much fun and loved a job as I do my present employment. (No I am not a recruiter). But then again I only make the tea.
All spelling mistakes are caused through w@nker dancing
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I must admit I was expecting a bit of banter after my previous comment. However, the post by "juliet" didn't even include a smilie 
On a more serious note the K fleet has and is developing a significant capability as yet unmatched by the J. The J has a significant lead in terms of the flight deck avionics but as yet doesn't have the mission capability of the K in my opinion.
To give that capability would require an extra crew member to manage the kit.
I don't really care if its a Nav, Engineer, Loadie or even another Pilot. I just don't think the present crew complement would suffice in managing what would be bolt-on kit rather than fully integrated systems with implications on time and cost to realise.
PS Biggus I have time in the Mighty Hunter, K and J amongst others.
Arbie, To reiterate the advice by TAC Queen. Get yourself to Lyneham, Waddington and Kinloss. Have a look around, you can tell a lot over a casual beer with crews and get a trip in the respective aircraft types.
On a more serious note the K fleet has and is developing a significant capability as yet unmatched by the J. The J has a significant lead in terms of the flight deck avionics but as yet doesn't have the mission capability of the K in my opinion.
To give that capability would require an extra crew member to manage the kit.
I don't really care if its a Nav, Engineer, Loadie or even another Pilot. I just don't think the present crew complement would suffice in managing what would be bolt-on kit rather than fully integrated systems with implications on time and cost to realise.
PS Biggus I have time in the Mighty Hunter, K and J amongst others.
Arbie, To reiterate the advice by TAC Queen. Get yourself to Lyneham, Waddington and Kinloss. Have a look around, you can tell a lot over a casual beer with crews and get a trip in the respective aircraft types.
Arbie
If you really want the K - and methinks you will, then there is definitely a future on the fleet for you. However, going the 'AT' route as a Nav (pardon me, WSO) means that you also risk VC-10s etc...
...and without wishing to show disrespect to our other fine AT ac, it is definitely worth the risk!
If you really want the K - and methinks you will, then there is definitely a future on the fleet for you. However, going the 'AT' route as a Nav (pardon me, WSO) means that you also risk VC-10s etc...
...and without wishing to show disrespect to our other fine AT ac, it is definitely worth the risk!
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Cheers guys Lots of good info, and some rather interesting points raised. Much appreciated - sounds like the 'risk' is worth taking!
Arbie
Lots of good info, and some rather interesting points raised. Much appreciated - sounds like the 'risk' is worth taking!Arbie
4 years ago I would have said "Don't dick about with C130s - get over to 101 and go tanking in a '10K - you'll be sold!"
But I certainly wouldn't say that nowadays.......
But I certainly wouldn't say that nowadays.......
Last edited by BEagle; 9th Mar 2004 at 04:04.
