Raf Iot
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Raf Iot
a few questions thrown into the midst here:
1. what kind of fitness standard is required for IOT, in particular are there any Tabs with heavy weights or long runs in boots? Anything in general that will kill my knee's that have already been nearly killed by the Army!
2. how often can an o. cdt. expect to get a bit of time off, if at all?
I am married and 6 months away without
is quite unthinkable hehe.
3. as a transferee from the Army, will I lose pay (I am currently on slightly more than an officer cadet and would like to keep it that way.)?
thanks gals and guys in advance, if there are any NCO army guys who have transferred to RAF and completed IOT reading this, a PM would be nice to exchange some thoughts and experiences (no not them thoughts, hehe!)
1. what kind of fitness standard is required for IOT, in particular are there any Tabs with heavy weights or long runs in boots? Anything in general that will kill my knee's that have already been nearly killed by the Army!
2. how often can an o. cdt. expect to get a bit of time off, if at all?
I am married and 6 months away without
is quite unthinkable hehe.3. as a transferee from the Army, will I lose pay (I am currently on slightly more than an officer cadet and would like to keep it that way.)?
thanks gals and guys in advance, if there are any NCO army guys who have transferred to RAF and completed IOT reading this, a PM would be nice to exchange some thoughts and experiences (no not them thoughts, hehe!)
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1. as high as you can, no, probably not
2. plan for none, hope for some, take what you're given
3. yes...probably, but they'll only make you aware of this after paying you at a higher rate for six to twelve months.
2. plan for none, hope for some, take what you're given
3. yes...probably, but they'll only make you aware of this after paying you at a higher rate for six to twelve months.
ANS
1. Level 10.6 on the bleep test has been rumoured as the standard.
2. IOT is 24weeks. in 3 blocks I believe, so every 8 weeks one would expect a break!?
3. The RAF NCA Liason team has promised that any one transfering will not be financially dis-advantaged at all by coming across to blue. I hope so.
4. I wonder if they will let you carry over your LSSA balance as after all it all comes from the same MoD pot.
5. Do it pronto as the Army only needs people for their first 6-8 years. After that they become too expensive for them and they'd rather get rid of you.
6. Seen in press that Army has over recruited and therfore wishes to get rid of people who have signed off, early. Nice hey?
7. Blue gives you a job till 55 . Army scraps you @ 40. Open the blue floodgates I say!!!!
1. Level 10.6 on the bleep test has been rumoured as the standard.
2. IOT is 24weeks. in 3 blocks I believe, so every 8 weeks one would expect a break!?
3. The RAF NCA Liason team has promised that any one transfering will not be financially dis-advantaged at all by coming across to blue. I hope so.
4. I wonder if they will let you carry over your LSSA balance as after all it all comes from the same MoD pot.
5. Do it pronto as the Army only needs people for their first 6-8 years. After that they become too expensive for them and they'd rather get rid of you.
6. Seen in press that Army has over recruited and therfore wishes to get rid of people who have signed off, early. Nice hey?
7. Blue gives you a job till 55 . Army scraps you @ 40. Open the blue floodgates I say!!!!
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thanks guys, keep them coming, the more opinions I get, the better I'll feel.
1. Happy about the 10.6, but I'm more interested to know if there are any Tabs (forced marches with weight) and anything else that would b r my knees.
2.lets hope once every 8 weeks is enough then.
3.lets hope there not luring me into there blue hole and THEN telling me I'll lose wages.
4.They bloody better do, I'm on middle rate!!
5 and 6. Not in my trade, unfortunately.
7.It seems a better deal, right.
1. Happy about the 10.6, but I'm more interested to know if there are any Tabs (forced marches with weight) and anything else that would b
r my knees.2.lets hope once every 8 weeks is enough then.
3.lets hope there not luring me into there blue hole and THEN telling me I'll lose wages.
4.They bloody better do, I'm on middle rate!!
5 and 6. Not in my trade, unfortunately.
7.It seems a better deal, right.
Tuts
1. Officers in HMs Royal Air Force don't carry big weights on long tabs. That's what the men are for! Seriously however, I seem to remember that you're only allowed to run for 10 mins each 30 in boots. Just remember that it only works in peacetime!
2. Almost every weekend! The first couple of weeks you're confined to barracks and there are another 3-4 weekends taken out of the whole course but that's it.
3. Don't quote me but I don't think they're allowed to pay you less. Certainly I think all the old branch commission guys (when we had them) got paid on their existing pay scales.
Just remember that no matter what they tell you, it's not REAL!!! Have fun
1. Officers in HMs Royal Air Force don't carry big weights on long tabs. That's what the men are for! Seriously however, I seem to remember that you're only allowed to run for 10 mins each 30 in boots. Just remember that it only works in peacetime!
2. Almost every weekend! The first couple of weeks you're confined to barracks and there are another 3-4 weekends taken out of the whole course but that's it.
3. Don't quote me but I don't think they're allowed to pay you less. Certainly I think all the old branch commission guys (when we had them) got paid on their existing pay scales.
Just remember that no matter what they tell you, it's not REAL!!! Have fun
I did IOT over 20 years ago, so can't comment on the physical side, I think H & S has bitten so no route marchs in boots any more. One suggestion I can offer though. We used to work most saturday mornings till 12, then had the rest of the weekend off. Given this didn't allow time to travel far some guys used to get their girlfriend/wife to come up and stay in a local hotel, one in leadenham was a favourite, then spend saturday and sunday night there together!
1. Those lovely heath and safety people don't allow you to run in boots when carrying weights but you can "fast walk" which just about equates to the same thing. At the end of week 4 there's the basic fitness test (BFT) which involves your flight of 8 people carrying a stretcher with weights and 2 pinepoles around the Knocker course with a time limit that equates to a "fast walk". Nobody failed it when I went through but it's not a pleasant experience.
If you really do have a medical condition then you can go to the med centre and get a "biff chit" that will get you out of having to do the test if it will cause lasting damage to your knees. The RAF yould rather have you fit to comlete the rest of the course than have you spending weeks and weeks on MASH flight recovering.
2. Time off! what do you think this is!
You'll get any holidays that the RAF as a whole get e.g. Christmas stand-down but that's only because the staff are on leave. Don't expect every weekend off either, you'll have community work to do and some compulsory sports matches to go and support. I managed to get a Friday off to go to my brother's wedding while I was at IOT and that was a real struggle to get.
3. When people from the RAF ranks go to IOT they continue to get the same pay as they did before until the pay they would receive as an officer catches up with it and then they go onto the officer pay scale. I can't see why transferring from the Army would be any different, best to go speak to someone in P2 or whatever they call themselves this week but I would expect you to stay at the same pay.
Enjoy the time at Cranditz and remember, it's just a game, play by their rules and get out asap!
If you really do have a medical condition then you can go to the med centre and get a "biff chit" that will get you out of having to do the test if it will cause lasting damage to your knees. The RAF yould rather have you fit to comlete the rest of the course than have you spending weeks and weeks on MASH flight recovering.
2. Time off! what do you think this is!
You'll get any holidays that the RAF as a whole get e.g. Christmas stand-down but that's only because the staff are on leave. Don't expect every weekend off either, you'll have community work to do and some compulsory sports matches to go and support. I managed to get a Friday off to go to my brother's wedding while I was at IOT and that was a real struggle to get.3. When people from the RAF ranks go to IOT they continue to get the same pay as they did before until the pay they would receive as an officer catches up with it and then they go onto the officer pay scale. I can't see why transferring from the Army would be any different, best to go speak to someone in P2 or whatever they call themselves this week but I would expect you to stay at the same pay.
Enjoy the time at Cranditz and remember, it's just a game, play by their rules and get out asap!
Dear me, Cranwell seems very ungentlemanly these days...
Life as a Graduate Entrant was infinitely more civilised - we even had one chap who outranked his Flt Cdr! We never wore white hatbands and even cabbage kit was only drawn for about 3 exercises in the Yorkshire Dales, the Cheviots and the Brecon beacons. Apart from the odd little 'your task is to get this barrel over that log with these ropes' adventure playground activities, that is. Mandatory sport was only committed a few times per week, although there was some running around and splashing about in the pool. One chap wound up a PTI Sturmbahncorporal by stating, "Old chap, I'm sorry, I don't 'swim', I 'bathe'...."
'Tabs', 'running in boots'? What manner of behaviour is that for impressionable young student Officers?
Rumour had it back in the late 60s that a group of Graduate Entrants down at that place in Bedfordshire where Supplementary List oiks were trained actually threatened to go on strike unless the RAF was prepared to treat them less as grunts and more as student officers.
Ah well. Times change. The very best of luck, have fun if you can - and don't forget that you are not just an individual, the schoolkids off the street will really value the help you can give them with all things military and making them work with you as part of your team.
But you'll probably find that you'll have to bite your lip now and again......
Life as a Graduate Entrant was infinitely more civilised - we even had one chap who outranked his Flt Cdr! We never wore white hatbands and even cabbage kit was only drawn for about 3 exercises in the Yorkshire Dales, the Cheviots and the Brecon beacons. Apart from the odd little 'your task is to get this barrel over that log with these ropes' adventure playground activities, that is. Mandatory sport was only committed a few times per week, although there was some running around and splashing about in the pool. One chap wound up a PTI Sturmbahncorporal by stating, "Old chap, I'm sorry, I don't 'swim', I 'bathe'...."
'Tabs', 'running in boots'? What manner of behaviour is that for impressionable young student Officers?
Rumour had it back in the late 60s that a group of Graduate Entrants down at that place in Bedfordshire where Supplementary List oiks were trained actually threatened to go on strike unless the RAF was prepared to treat them less as grunts and more as student officers.
Ah well. Times change. The very best of luck, have fun if you can - and don't forget that you are not just an individual, the schoolkids off the street will really value the help you can give them with all things military and making them work with you as part of your team.
But you'll probably find that you'll have to bite your lip now and again......
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I'd like to add a couple of questions here myself.
I was told that there was one or two weeks of leave for the IOT course, but that when they were taken was for the group to decide as a whole, since there'd be no point one chap b*ggering off for the week while the rest carried on learning without him. Anyone know anything more about this? Perhaps someone who's there or has been recently?
Second of all, the Operational Studies reading list included Perspectives on Air Power: Air Power in its Wider Context edited by Stuart Peach and published by TSO in '98; however, this book is out of print, and I can't seem to track down any copies new or used. Does anyone have any idea where there may be some remaining stock, or has anyone finished with a copy they'd like to sell?
Thanks for any help on either of these queries.
I was told that there was one or two weeks of leave for the IOT course, but that when they were taken was for the group to decide as a whole, since there'd be no point one chap b*ggering off for the week while the rest carried on learning without him. Anyone know anything more about this? Perhaps someone who's there or has been recently?
Second of all, the Operational Studies reading list included Perspectives on Air Power: Air Power in its Wider Context edited by Stuart Peach and published by TSO in '98; however, this book is out of print, and I can't seem to track down any copies new or used. Does anyone have any idea where there may be some remaining stock, or has anyone finished with a copy they'd like to sell?
Thanks for any help on either of these queries.
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During the first 4 weeks in basic, you are confined to cell block 80 and cranditz. Then after basic, unless you get a restriction you are free for the weekend.
If your course goees through the end of july or the xmas period, you get 2 weeks off. IOT basically closes for those 2 periods of 2 weeks. As you get further into the course, you get more privaledges and less restrictions and therefore more free weekends.
If your course goees through the end of july or the xmas period, you get 2 weeks off. IOT basically closes for those 2 periods of 2 weeks. As you get further into the course, you get more privaledges and less restrictions and therefore more free weekends.
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hey thanks guys!
This has helped enormously as I now have a rough outline of the above in my head.
Further to those questions then, how hard is the academic side of IOT and has anybody got any advice on what to read up on beforehand?
Obviously going from grunt to RAF is going to be a shock
(dig hole!..........uh, yes sir!). But hopefully as I had to pass extra academical tests to gain entry to IOT, they obviously think I have the capability. I just would like a heads up on what to expect. I just want to turn up prepared both physically and mentally. Thanks guys.
This has helped enormously as I now have a rough outline of the above in my head.
Further to those questions then, how hard is the academic side of IOT and has anybody got any advice on what to read up on beforehand?
Obviously going from grunt to RAF is going to be a shock
(dig hole!..........uh, yes sir!). But hopefully as I had to pass extra academical tests to gain entry to IOT, they obviously think I have the capability. I just would like a heads up on what to expect. I just want to turn up prepared both physically and mentally. Thanks guys.
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Tuts,
I really wouldn't worry about it too much - have a look at the fail rate and make up your own mind!
It is (well was, I did the 'old' style IOT), however, a right royal pain in the posterior. I thought it was much more of a 'how much do you really want to be in the RAF' test than an Officer Training course.
I wish you all the best - bring a waterproof sense of humour.
MT
I really wouldn't worry about it too much - have a look at the fail rate and make up your own mind!
It is (well was, I did the 'old' style IOT), however, a right royal pain in the posterior. I thought it was much more of a 'how much do you really want to be in the RAF' test than an Officer Training course.
I wish you all the best - bring a waterproof sense of humour.
MT
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Hahaahahaha. Sorry - lovely image of a democratic Cranditz there. If you are 'lucky' your 6 month internment will be on a course over the Christmas or Summer Stand Down - then you get your couple of weeks.
I say 'lucky' as I was not on such a course. Mine was the Feb intake. We worked every Bank Holiday and got %ugg3red about, but we were there for the minimum time without distraction or extra eating/drinking holidays. I think that is the better option and I hit lucky.
'They' can't make you run and all the exercises CAN be completed in the time at walking pace. If you decide not to walk, your call. How much load you carry is often down to your individual size. As a big bloke I can't really be part of a stretcher carrying team, so always got to carry the heavy packs/objects, and sometimes smaller colleagues!
It is only 6 pay cheques.
Hahaahahaha. Sorry - lovely image of a democratic Cranditz there. If you are 'lucky' your 6 month internment will be on a course over the Christmas or Summer Stand Down - then you get your couple of weeks.
I say 'lucky' as I was not on such a course. Mine was the Feb intake. We worked every Bank Holiday and got %ugg3red about, but we were there for the minimum time without distraction or extra eating/drinking holidays. I think that is the better option and I hit lucky.
'They' can't make you run and all the exercises CAN be completed in the time at walking pace. If you decide not to walk, your call. How much load you carry is often down to your individual size. As a big bloke I can't really be part of a stretcher carrying team, so always got to carry the heavy packs/objects, and sometimes smaller colleagues!
It is only 6 pay cheques.
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thanks for all the replies guys, but is there anyone who has done it more recently out there. I obviously would like the most up to date info, and I'm sure not that much has changed since a lot of you did it, but it puts my mind at rest, see! Please reply guys with the year that you completed yours so I get a rough overview, thanks!
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Further to my earlier post regarding the unavailability of Stuart Peach's "Perspectives on Air Power", I have since learnt that this text has been superceded by "Air Power 21: Challenges for the New Century" edited by Peter W. Gray.
Hope this will be of some use to any other IOTers confused by the Peach text on their reading lists.
Hope this will be of some use to any other IOTers confused by the Peach text on their reading lists.
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Went through in 2000/2001. Apparently the physical side has got a bit harded since then, but as it was at a very low level to start off with I can't see that being much of a challenge for someone from the army. We also had all but two weekends off (including Basic Phase remarkably!)
The academic phase isn't very. Defence writing seems to be all about the width of margins rather than actually being able to put a sentence together and is very much monkey see, monkey do. As for the Air Power exams I'd ignore the reading list given (unless things have changed a lot) as though all the infomation is in the books listed, they seem to want you to reproduce things exactly the way they teach them. ( the cheat sheets, or black list if its still being passed round which they say not to use is actually very good.) One way to get ahead of the game though is write the Bandar Essay in advance. (2000 words on a defence subject, don't worry about defence writing for this as the typing pool will type it up for you once you get there.)
The only bit with forced marches as such would have been Field Leadership Camp, but sadly we had this cancelled due to foot and mouth, and thus I was forced to take a hellish weeks leave
The academic phase isn't very. Defence writing seems to be all about the width of margins rather than actually being able to put a sentence together and is very much monkey see, monkey do. As for the Air Power exams I'd ignore the reading list given (unless things have changed a lot) as though all the infomation is in the books listed, they seem to want you to reproduce things exactly the way they teach them. ( the cheat sheets, or black list if its still being passed round which they say not to use is actually very good.) One way to get ahead of the game though is write the Bandar Essay in advance. (2000 words on a defence subject, don't worry about defence writing for this as the typing pool will type it up for you once you get there.)
The only bit with forced marches as such would have been Field Leadership Camp, but sadly we had this cancelled due to foot and mouth, and thus I was forced to take a hellish weeks leave
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They can't force you to run IN BOOTS. H&S thing - you wear trainers to run, and boots are going to damage you.
As I said earlier, all the exercises you do wearing combats were designed and could be completed at walking pace. If the cadet wished to run, then that is their decision.
With CIB (Cadet Induced Bull***t), f@nnying about & generally not having your poo in one place, you need to run, or not finish the exercise. Your call.
As I said earlier, all the exercises you do wearing combats were designed and could be completed at walking pace. If the cadet wished to run, then that is their decision.
With CIB (Cadet Induced Bull***t), f@nnying about & generally not having your poo in one place, you need to run, or not finish the exercise. Your call.