Some good points, but unfortunately with the last comment you have just come across as a tosser.

How sad that you feel the need to brag about it. Do you have the obligatory "penis extension" vehicle to go with that sad little ego too?

Before this degenerates, ask yourself this one question. If I did have 5 million dollars in the bank, do you really think i'd still be going to work at 3am numerous times a month. It was a joke!. :ugh:

This is Emirates we're talking about here, not some friggin investment bank.

Well, i've got over 20 million dollars in the bank and I still go to work at 3am. I have to.................they're 'Zim dollars'! :uhoh:

Harry

I heard a good one this morning at work :)

Watch this space in the coming couple of months, Emirates are in for a bit of a shock.

A large number of resignations are going to hit the fleet managers deck all at once!!!:ok:

If true, and I have no reason to believe other wise this will screw Emirates right up for a short time, they've had this one coming, hope it's true.

No more info, we'll just have to wait and see.

Maybe, Bin, because pprune ME is is a good place for people to unload their angst so they can then continue soldiering on more readily after "discovering" the latest good news from management? It's either that or complain to the union...

You come here knowing you'll find a rant or two, then go off at the writer when you do. What's with that???

A tosser? I love it!

I would fly at EK just to acquire a new inventory of derogatory insults. Mine are somewhat stale after years of use. "Knob" was another I picked up recently. It's been a good week.

So, about the interviews. Have they begun?

Mr. Ahole, most of the insults we experience are by way of "adjustments" to our Ts and Cs. That and the EK crew rest facilities.

Ahem. Pork?

I was genuine in my admiration of the OTHER posts and their creativity. I feel for the pilots at EK and hope conditions improve for them.

What are you doing to improve your lot? Whining on pprune?

And "Ahole"? You must have better than that.

Gents and ladies,
A question for you: do you think mass resignations or dissent will have any impact on organisations such as EK, EY, ETC?
No, there will always be someone to fill the space you leave. None of these organisations will fail...your departure(s) will mean nothing.

"Men do not fear justice, but they hate the lack of it", a quote by Aristotle, some years ago.

Rings true of the recent EK management style and the main reason, I suspect, of the supposed exodus to greener pastures.

This may be a naive question, but surely EK will eventually reach the point where it is more cost-effective to allow crews to be based in their home countries? With multiple daily flights to/from London, US points, Australia, etc from where many Emirates crews are expatriate Dubai residents, it surely would be efficient to operate those services using crews based at the other end of the route. The saving from not having to fund residential, education and transport costs would surely outweigh any inefficiency arising from having a number of smaller bases worldwide than one central base?

You could also build a marathon crew hotel at DXB to host crews whilst down-route there instead of paying a small fortune for overseas crew hotac.

I know of at least two pilots who have left EK in the last 12 months who told HR that they would be happy to stay if they could be given a roster that would allow them to get home for a week every month - something far short of basing. (I was one of them.:):):):):))

Answer? "We'll pass it on." Translation: Too hard-la.

Just as they did with the decision to accept female expat pilots, they'll do it eventually, but (as with the female pilots), only when they're dragged screaming into accepting it because they simply have to. But when it comes, it won't be to save money, for the cost savings argument doesn't hold water, as the vast majority of the costs of having crews based in DXB aren't really costs at all - they're really just money being passed from one pocket of someone's dish dash to another.

Well said...
One of the oldest airlines in the middle east (SaudiArabian) has had resignations enmass before, and it made...no difference, whatsoever.

Except...more overtime for those that remained.:}

Well said. Its a sad reality but true, mass resignations never hurt the employer only a blip on the radar especially with so many lining up to join.

Guys, wake up and smell the roses. No one is leaving in the numbers that have been claimed on this forum. I have seen numbers as high as 120 thrown around and all this was to take effect in December. There are only 5 resignation in December.

A lot of B S on this forum. That is fine as long as the moaners keep the bitching confined to this forum and not onto the flight deck.

Crewing: 60 pilots short December, no flex left.

1000 hrs rejected by GCAA, more pilots needed.

More aircraft coming, more pilots leaving... no BS, ask Korean.

SD: The proof will be parked around the airport very soon and they won't be statics for the air-show.

Likely about 60 pilots have departed this year, which is quite high considering the present climate of job availability. Regardless of the reasons why people are leaving, it would be foolish for EK not to address the issue, especially considering they budgeted for 20 pilot resignations this year.

I personally know a few more who are going to leave in the coming months and that trend will continue. If jobs open up around the world, then it is predictable that resignations will dramatically increase.

This is not good news for EK and it is not good for the remaining pilots at EK. Recruitment will be slow to react, we will be required to work even more (if that is possible) and thanks to the foolish management style of Emirates Airline, the remaining pilots will suffer the consequences.

Predictions for 2010?
-further alterations to the ever changing upgrade policy (negative for the vast majority of F/O's)
-more pleas from management to 'recommend' pilots for recruitment
-a change to 'hiring' requirements, such as total hours, type etc
-further rostering manipulations (this is a BIG ONE)
-a rapid increase in valid sickness rates and fatigue issues
-scraping the bottom of the barrel in an attempt to satisfy recruitment needs
-management pilots being required to actually fly pairings (bad news for those who have to sit next to them in the cockpit)
-more pathetic attempts from management to appear like they are concerned for our well-being (TCAS is already doing this occasionally during grd school sessions)
-less availability of contractual Leave allotment... already happening
-upgrades occuring 'out of seniority'... already happening
-the dreaded DEC policy put back into full force

I have a suspicion next year is going to get ugly at EK. Hope i'm wrong.

Enough guys are leaving during " the downturn" where there are relatively few jobs out there. Just wait for the market to swing. EK will learn the very definition of the word "atonement".

Won't chnange a thing, look at QR, it was struggling for pilots, but didn't change a thing in their way of treating its workforce... Why would EK do so ?

QR pays better than EK.

Etihad pays better than EK and now Air Arabia pays better than EK.

92 hour cap makes a huge difference.:*

Is it true, as I have been told, that Air Arabia Captains earn about 60K dhs a month? (whereas an EK Captain earns about 40K dhs a month)
Just curious if that is true.

Granted, they don't have company accomodation like EK, although we all know what that means nowadays with the criminal increase in DEWA charges and Emirates complete disregard for our contract regarding those charges.

add the 14000 a month for accommodation on top of the 40K and voila. Same same and no risk of rent fluctuations for the AA captain

When you compare apples to apples you will find that some AA guys get paid more IE the guys that fly more at night 150% the hourly rate. but that means nighttime turns whick seems to be a big spot of bother with the EK guys claiming fatigue while you dont seem to hear that from AA , they choose to do them because they sre worth more. EK guys cant go back now and say"well if they paid me for the nighttime turns that would be different" they have made their own bed on that one

Trying to compare the short haul only roster of AA with the EK roster is just silly.

Having flown 100+hr months doing IT short haul you simply cannot compare the EK ULR/Long/turnaround combination for accumulative fatigue and general total knackeredessness.

AA do not have to cope with 12hr time zone changes have 2 days off then go the other way.

On a personal plus side at least the rosters are coming out earlier, a bit.

I do know that there are at present 200+ applications from EK pilots in at Korean, however the attrition rate at the sim is not good ......possibly thanks to our "don't hand fly culture".

I would like to believe that the lost T+Cs will be returned but I am too old and don't believe in Santa anymore:cool:.

Happy dayz

T & C Vs Safety
 

Honestly at the moment what I look at is not getting back the old contract but getting more attention to safety.
Our rosters in EK, at list for the Bus Guys, are out of any safety logic.
Having 11 hours duty during the middle of the night for a 2 pilot turnaround to india and back is absolutely UNSAFE!!!!!!
Specially if that happens quite often during the month. We got a very interesting article about sleep deprivation from one of our flight ops manager but I think we were the only one that did read it!!!!!
The check in for duty is just 1 hour before departure instead of at least 1 hour and 30 mins, plus we also have extensions like the annex 1 to fit with even longer duty periods!!!!!!
I honestly star being quite worried about........
Flare

I agree with you Flare, our rostering is atrocious. Last month I did the maximum night duties in a given week, plus I did 2 variations (max 4 are allowed, which is insane) and then they inserted a DOH midnight turn in the middle of my days off. To top it all off, I only got ONE layover and that was a ULR. Magically I did 80 hours flying plus 2 Reserve Days. !!!! THAT !!!!E! (7 days off in total too)

By the end of the month, I didn't know what was up and what was down, let alone what day of the week it was.

On one return sector at 11am after a delayed departure (yet apparently within limits before discretion.... India turn) neither the F/O or me was talking sense during the descent. Sadly, I missed altitude calls as PF and he missed repeated R/T calls and then barely answered with a semblance of SOP's. It was a disaster waiting to happen, but fortunately another good weather day in DXB and not too much traffic.

I can understand the Triple7 dudes not understanding how things could be so bad on the BUS, but it is true.

Finally decided to fire off the CV. Happy with my lot in life, but oh so sad to finally realize something bad is going to happen soon at EK...... and it might involve ME !!! You just don't know anymore!

I feel so fortunate working for Emirates Airline! Just wish my life expectancy was not reducing so fast.

dude i hear you man, on duty from 1st -7th dec. 1european layover followed by 3turnarounds(2 of them to india).best of all ,1of those days i've got a mct turn at 2am followed by india turnaround on the same day at 2300..and this is the 6th consecutive day on duty already....but ...i only here to work:ugh:cheers

"1 European layover"..................... Bloody luxury mate, I haven't seen Europe for 5 months!!!

Unless of course you count the IST or ATH turnrounds!!:yuk:

europe? where is europe, 2 flights there this year, 10 month ago

I wanted to live a long happy life> that is incompatible with Emirates and I left.
No more Dubai !!!!e, no more wake up at 1 am no more India no more idiots, no more !
****uk Emirates!! Nevere felt better in my life!!!

Hi sheikmyarse...
 

...welcome to the club :ok:
and now off to the beach...:cool:

Emirates best job ever....

what a joke!!

3X7 isn't always the nirvana you might think. I've got 3 night turns in 5 days, neatly separated by rest days to really screw my sleep pattern :{

However, I'm aware the 'Bus isn't brilliant, which all comes down to belt tightening and not enough people. Rostered into overtime, which won't happen 'cos it'll cost, so I'm interested to see what will happen :rolleyes:

They will take flights off you, give you available days (never days off) which they will turn into standbys. You will then get called out for short flights which take you right up to, but never beyond, the overtime threshold. :ugh:

Hey guys,
I have to say that after 18 months of not working for EK I have a much better understanding of how close to the dangerous level I was with EK.
I now fly my 900 hours a year plus another 250 dead head hours. Hard work, yes! But at Kal we do get adequate rest, even with a compressed schedule. The Captain always has a first class seat reserved on long sectors, even if there is a cockpit crew rest facility. ULH flights get min 48 hour lay over. Plus your 11 blocked days off in a row each month helps get over it.
I have not had any micro sleep episodes since I have been here, in EK it was often a daily occurrence.
I am not saying that Korean is a better airline as a career option, just emphasizing and agreeing that EK has a huge problem with fatigue.
The really scary thing is that until you hit the fatigue wall and f_ck something up you may just think that micro sleeps and feeling like a bag of !!!! continually is normal. It is not! and it does not have to be that way.
Good luck and be careful guys.

"The Captain always has a first class seat reserved on long sectors, even if there is a cockpit crew rest facility."

So the captain gets a good sleep while his two tired F/Os are struggleing to stay awake because of their bad crew bunk.
Sounds much safer to me.

Safe flying everyone

Who said the crew bunk was "bad"? :rolleyes:

Gee would that be a bit of a chip on the shoulder mate. Chill......and try to get some more sleep!
3 man crew, all can use the first class seat.
4 man crew, Captain first class, and F/Os have a reserved business class seat as well as a bunk. Extra crew do not have to be on the flight deck for all take offs and landings.
I am not saying that KAL is safer than EK, only that I am no where near as fatigued with KAL as I was with EK. Despite flying the same or more hours and more ULH sectors.