Emirates Airlines Joining
 

Hello,

I just wanted anyone's opinion and/or feedback on whether one should make the move to Emirates airlines since I have been recruited successfully ? In particular I would love the opinion of guys already in EK !

I am currently PIC On A320 with 2000 hours PIC on type and almost 5000 hours total time. After having completed the EK selection process I am being selected for the A330 fleet. I am also aware the fleet could change by the time one actually joins, so no idea whether it will be A380, B777 or A330/340. Of course the entire package in the form of tax free salary, company accommodation, education allowances and so on are attractive. I have also considered the move to Dubai and am comfortable with adjusting with the lifestyle as it is similar to where I come from.

The toughest decision for me yet has been to consider leaving my command and I'm not sure what is the command upgrade scene in EK going forward.

Is the move wise ?

Cheers

Far more serious, and unforgivable, is that you have posted in the wrong section...

Read the ME section re upgrades.

More to the point, Emirates Airlines are joining what?
Basic five yr old sentence construction at fault perhaps?

:(

You have "almost" 5000 TT, and 2000 A320 command??!! :ooh::ooh:

They sure do things differently in India ...

And Englishe Level 6 too no doubt.........

By all means please come join the 330 fleet…everyone knows it is by far the best fleet to be on. Interesting layovers and many turn trips available. In fact, the 330 fleet has the most trips to India. So should you be lonesome for home…you'll get to go there A LOT!

What if you Have plenty of Boeing time and no Airbus time but want the A380. Seems like a reasonable thing doesn't it.

FD7
This is obviously a very important decision for you and you should consider all of the potential implications before making a decision.

Regarding quality of life on the 330. It's not great at the moment with limited layovers and lots of night turnaround flights. As you said, things can change but planning for the worst case helps in managing expectations. It is possible that you could be stuck on the 330 until the end which is supposed to be around 2017. Then you'll probably be sent to to the A380 fleet, which is a great place to be. However, at the moment you need 2500 on type to be eligible for a 380 command. We are talking potentially many years before you get back to the left seat based on the path outlined.

EK isn't a terrible company to work for. It's gotten a lot worse recently and probably will decline further in the future. But there are definitely worse places to work out there. The bottom line is that your decision to stay or join EK is a personal one and nobody can make that decision for you. If you're happy where you are and your airline is stable with good career prospects then perhaps you should stay. If the opposite is true and you don't mind dealing with some of the possibilities I've mentioned above, then by all means come.

Good luck in your choice whichever way it goes. Just make sure that your decision is made with your eyes wide open so that the regrets will be minimized down the road.

Always ask yourself the question.."where will that put me in 10 years"...

Yardman's comments are spot on.

Great thread, one question followed by 6 trolls spewing abuse then a decent answer. Here is the skinny on EK.

The package appears attractive from outside but Dubai is a very expensive city to live in. I joined a long time ago. At that time the allowances covered the costs of life reasonably well, since then they have all deteriorated. Working conditions have been changed and every time productivity has been increased it has not resulted in any improved remuneration. The changes are always hidden using subterfuge rather than manning up and telling the pilot group directly. Presently we are already over a month past the pay review date with no news.

Dubai though is a bigger factor, Ironbutt is spot on, don't just consider the career, consider the whole picture. Most expats feel a pull towards their family when they 'have' to leave the sandpit. From then on it can be a tedious place to live with your heart and loved ones elsewhere and insufficient options available to escape.

Bottom line: Conditions have never improved, command times have never got shorter but you will get a nice new pilot's bag on joining.

As mentioned above, EK is still one of the better deals around when you consider all factors.

Just on operational "gotcha", especially on the 330 and 777 fleets. If you are unlucky enough to lose 2 engines in flight, do not be fooled into thinking that your APU is already running: that high-pitched whine you are still hearing is your cockpit colleague still going on about his last pay review.... :hmm:

Since you've already attended the selection process and have been assigned a course, it is a bit late for this thread.


It seems you've already made up your mind.


Coming from India, you will feel right at home in Dubai, although the costs of living are significantly higher and increasing rapidly. The company's admin structure, policies, bureaucracy and user interface are also very typical of the region and will be a frustration to only those coming from the West.


The A330 fleet is used mostly on Middle East turnarounds during the day, and India and Pakistan turnarounds during the night. Expect to fly around 600-700 hours a year, although with only 7-8 days off a month.


I would estimate that you could see the left seat again around the middle to late part of next decade.


Good luck with your decision.

with 5000hrs TT you will be one of the most inexperienced FO's in the company. 5000 just about gets you a PPL in EK. Expect 6 to 7 years to command and don't expect it to be on a 330 or 340.

FlightDirector7

Firstly you will not be very inexperienced in EK with your total hours. Our recruitment minima (as you know) are a lot lower than 5K total, so I would take that with a pinch of salt.

If you are on your own with no family then it could be worth it but to give up a 320 command and move the family over for a RHS 330 is (in my view at least) not worth it - all things considered. Especially if the company doesn't address the cost of living in Dubai and reward us accordingly. Bear in mind that you will be stuck on a F/Os salary for a good few years.

Don't move just for the sake of getting widebody time as the 330 will be doing flying that will probably be similar to what you are doing at the moment.

** Edited to say that based on the latest pay review that was just announced... the signs for the future don't look good. **

And so do they in many other places such as europe...I and many more were one of them:E

Never give up your command once you have it. I would suggest staying where you are for another 5 years or so, then gambling that EK are offering DEC positions again.

Joining Emirates right now is possibly one of the dumbest moves that you could make.

You have guys who have been here for years warning you about the situation here. You have announcements BY THE COMPANY YOU WANT TO WORK FOR that display their desperation to get people to remain here....ie increasing the bond to $45000/5 years.

Enjoy your command in India....there is nothing like going to work and flying with your favorite captain every day.

Now that is funny.

FD7
 

Yardman sums it best.:ok:It is a personal decision and all the best with that. Do not base your decision to move solely on the view of some of our "professional" pilot colleagues here.

Some pilots have moved to the ME from first world nations where having labour unions or minimum wage rules and complete freedom of expression are not given a second thought to. They made the decision to move purely on the widebody/time to command and the attractive brochure and interview process. When things haven't gone the way it was planned and the fizz dissipates from the fizzy babblech, frustration and angst seeps in.

You have lived in India and survived:) , got your command on the 320 possibly with a low cost carrier and 33 years old. Talk to relatives/friends who live there about life in Dubai and things your wife and kid(s)? needs like jobs,school, housing etc. Remember , it's their country so be prepared to follow their rules , making the move from India is much less a culture shock for you and your family than say someone from US/AUS/Europe .

If command comes again in 10 years as some have said , you will be 43 with a total time of 11000 hours and good narrow body and widebody experience , is that really that bad? EK isn't perfect but please show me a perfect airline to work for in India , I'm readying up my CV:E.
It's your decision to make that won't come very often and all the best:ok:

On a lighter note, here's an awesome video on our passengers haha

Masalama.

There are plenty of better options in the world and even in the Middle East now. Think long and hard before you commit to Emirates.
10 years to command, runaway inflation and management that laughs at how stupid and gullible it's pilots are. These are just some of the items you will have to put up with at EK. All of this just to fly a Widebody? Yes there are plenty of better options for you.

If the location of the original poster didn't say India, they would have got a much better response.

Highlights something I've seen for a while on these forums and in the region - plenty of narrow minded expats in EK and the Middle East. Reaping the rewards of the region but holding deep rooted animosity towards anyone not of their own kind. Such people are an embarrassment to our profession.

Makes you reconsider the meaning of 'educated'.

"Reaping the Rewards".

I believe I have heard that phrase used before.

Lol.


Jayto.

Gutter maybe you are the one with the issue. If the guy can pass the selection process here, which he did, then he is on a level playing field with the rest of us no matter where he is from.

He asked about joining EK. We gave our honest opinions. It's not a secret that people are upset with the downward slide of T&C here at EK. If anything, we are showing the original poster the utmost respect by trying to give him honest information that will help him make HIS ultimate decision.

Ahhhhhhh! That video was awesome! Laughter is always the best cure.


Here's another that will give possible new joiners a glimpse at what to expect on the roads in "the pit"!!!




:}

SuckitUp

:D Hilarious...good stuff!

Time to command is important - regardless of age.
 

If we all came to the Gulf with the aim of staying here till we retire then there wouldn't be any rush for the LHS. However the minority of us probably foresee themselves staying here until they retire and because of that, time to command is very much relevant, no matter how old you are.

When looking at this in the cold light of day, a command means more money and with that means being able to reach your financial goals sooner. This is of far more importance as an expat and especially so if you plan to move back home as soon as the kitty reaches a certain level.

Don't have a dig at the youngsters that may express an element of displeasure at having to wait a lot longer for a command. Maybe it is their aim to be mortgage free back at home by the time they are 40 (for example) and an extended spell in the RHS will make this harder to achieve.

Why not give it a try?
 

Flight Director,


First off, congratulations on passing the EK interview process. It is a very challenging one, and your hard work paid off. In light of this important decision, I will try to shed a different light on your predicament.


I worked at EK for three years and enjoyed it. You will find most people you fly with to be very pleasant and easy going. Training has gotten a lot better. Most of my experience has been quiet enjoyable. The training department recently put an effort in hiring good guys and getting rid of some of the bad apples. Most instructors are there because they enjoy teaching and it shows. The destinations are fun and I would expect you to transition over to the 380 relatively soon, so don't sweat the 330.


Some of the negatives are mentioned in this thread. In all fairness they are relatively accurate.


So, why join Emirates? It all depends on what you are trying to accomplish. I personally enjoyed it because EK was a means to an end. Large national carriers, like the one I am currently employed at, are extremely competitive to get into. I had plenty of experience flying domestic routes but needed that edge in order to be truly marketable. EK gave me that. Great lucrative flying jobs are few and far between. Just getting invited for an interview for some of them is like trying to catch a fly with chopsticks.


You have all the PIC turbine time you need. Your resume is already solid. Now all you have to do is pad it with some international flying experience in heavies. Do this for couple years, and next thing you know you’ll be ahead of the pack. Good for you for taking the initiative to give EK a try. If you are judicious, you will see that in the end, joining was probably the best thing for your career.


As I did, stay there for a little while and enjoy it for what it is. Then when you have enough experience, doors will open up for you, and the hand you’ll be dealt will be much nicer. By rising above the negativity, being smart, and capitalizing on all the great things Emirates has to offer, you will see that you will enjoy your time in Dubai. You can look at it like an extended paid vacation. You might even miss it a bit after you leave. I know I do.

eldee5

Don't need to give the airline, unless you want to, but are you now with a US operator? Hope all is working out for you. Would be interested to hear how you compare present with what you've left.

Harry

Just guessing here, but a US major... ...work rules, MINIMUM days off, not MAXIMUM, no available days, once off reserve never on reserve again, seniority...

A little less $$ to start with but cheaper living in the states VS massive inflation in UAE...

Still guessing, but it must be NIGHT AND DAY from EK.

Congrats Eldee, I hope to be junior to you one day.

Harry, I'm with the big D, based in ATL for now. For once in a very long time, I feel at peace ;-)

Eldee you made the right choice hands down. You will not look back at all.
There is no comparison between the US and EK. The biggest difference is the tremendous weight of stress and fatigue lifted off your shoulders, weight you didn't even know you were carrying around until you leave the sand.
Enjoy the Big D. That is probably the best US operator to fly for right now. The hardest part of your job will be getting use to all the contract terms and work rules but you won't be doing much working as in flying. Congrats! Hopefully many more Yanks will be joining you and leaving Emirates.

eldee5
 

If I can be as careful as I possibly can with this one and without judging but only trying to understand; Yes, there are no arguments about EK Vs US legacy, cultural shocks, bueller, bueller........, in a wider context is it a relief gained (personally) or an opportunity lost of extending that legacy to EK and indeed the Gulf region in a long run?
There is credible argument on another thread where folks still struggle with say ASR's for an example (harry the cod is working minds and flat out on this). It's also unarguable that aviation is advanced in the US through history than the Gulf region. This region would do with more professionals like yourself who can flexibly discern between good and bad through say confidential reports et la.
If satisfaction is born from consistently serving others well and in a long run, is it a relief or an opportunity lost that it had to be the bigD at this point in your career?

Was that supposed to be in english?

vfenext

It's a mixture of both, accept my apologies, but I'm satisfied that eldee5 and others will have the ability to understand the principle and the margins, and I had to be very careful (another way to skin a cat!)

So does all this talk about the US carriers mean that any US pilot that stays at EK is stupid to do so? Let's put it this way, the US legacy carries are not the only game in town. If you are hell bent on returning home that's great but don't try to sell your decision on other people, just do it for yourself. BTW , how many EK Capt's returning to the US compared to FOs? You might be shocked at the numbers, meaning not as many as you think.

Ps you have to realize it makes no difference at all to me and if all US pilots went back to the states I probably wouldn't notice, sorry.

Sorry Kirungi, I am with VfeNext......I have no idea what you are trying to say in your post.

His/her posts read like a google translate. I think it might be someones wife who's trying to join in.

"So does all this talk about the US carriers mean that any US pilot that stays at EK is stupid to do so?"

Fatbus, this is absolutely not what I was trying to say. I was only answering the post. There is unequivocally nothing wrong with working at Emirates, should one choose to do so. It's all about choice. EK has a special place in my heart, it really does.

I, for my part, left EK and joined the big D specifically because of the retirement schedule and the seniority structure of the airline. 40% of their pilots will be gone in 10 years. Being in my mid 30s, it was a logical choice. It was not necessarily an easy one. But then again, home is where you heart is.

I would have most certainly found happiness continuing working and living in Dubai. But coming back to the States, and getting hired on at a legacy was the right thing to do for me. Other people have different priorities, and that's totally cool.