Not Again
 

hptcc,
You seem to have the habit of coming in with a post defending PJ management and attacking some of the posters who bring in facts, then wait for a while until some strong and grounful responses to your posts have gone through their "peak effect" on the readers, then come back with the same scenario with different words and phrases. I have noticed that a number of posters responded to your posts strongly and have rendered you speechless and defenceless. All, including you are invited to revisit the previous pages in this thread to find this out.
Any how, I agree with S.F.L.Y's response and add to it a reminder to the readers that violating the safety of flight in so many ways and incidents is far from being "slight mistakes". One of so many examples is losing the maintenance history on the aircraft by forcing unauthorized mechanics to perform maintenance works without making any entries in the log books lest auditors discover the lack of authorizations (no licenses and no type rates) upon auditing and/or spot checking the aircraft records. Anyone interested in reading details of such violations can PM me and I will forward to him/her copies of stamped reports (in PDF format) sent to the CEO from maintenance warning him that flight safety was being compromised, with no action taken by the management.
May I also kindly request that in your reponse(s) do not resort to the personal issues. Likewise, insulting other posters is far from being professional. You can defend PJ "super managers" but in a civilized and professional manner. Let's see you respond to this post with abstract facts. Good luck.

Yes Again
 

Oh Ex-terminator, one cannot help but feeling that there is slight resentment from you towards PJ.!!?? It seems totaly clear that you are on a one man mission of 'revenge and wrath' and will do everything you can to tarnish them....

Now, lets look at the facts. In ANY organisation in the world may it be aviation, banking, knitting, running a brothel or WHATEVER - a CEO will employ Directors and/or Managers to FIX a problem and not just highlight them. You say that you have stamped copies of violations you bought to the attention of the CEO, well thats a good start. Question is, what did you do to RECTIFY the problem? There is nothing worse than employing someone who tells you there is a problem. Thats why you were employed, to fix the problem. I can tell my Company Boss's of lots of issues within the company or I can tell them of how I rectified them (also remember, there is a BIG difference in tellling one's boss how to rectify a problem and also in telling one's boss that the problem has been rectified). Question is, what did you do to RECTIFY the issues? I presume you did NOTHING which is why you dont work there no more. I don't really know, I am just trying to get a picture here of what went on.

It also seems that you continually dig up the past. In fact almost every post from you has talked about incidents and/or issues that are long gone. I agree they shouldnt have happened in the first place and no doubt they wont happen again but on the scale of it, you really should be ashamed of yourself wanting to leak PDF information to the public at large - and you call yourself a professional????

Furthermore, seldom am I rendered speechless or defenceless. Why? Because when I talk I know what I am talking about - do you? And I dont mean about what happened in PJ, I mean about Aviation. I think that due to your serious lack of aviation knowledge in the UAE, this is the reason you let standards drop in your area and hence had to result to blame when all the time it was you who was to blame. Also defenceless? Me? I think not! And why, it is because I work with passion and not aggression and thus have no reason to show defence or attack. I have a solid team of people where I work and they respect me as a professional and still joke around with me as if we were school kids. I think you never had this sort of relationship with your staff and they learned to dislike (I was going to use the word 'hate' but I feel you are the sensative type) you.

Anyway my dear friend, I am not one to get into e-mail battles with people but all I can say is that on the grand scheme of things, through the ups and downs, through thick and thin the fact is that PJ are still flying and flying well.

No doubt you or someone will respond with the old "2 years ago...." or "I remember when...." response......

The Vortex lives on......

hptcc, how can you seriously blame the employees for not fixing the issues assigned by the CEO?! Do you know that in our industry the CEO is generally the accountable manager in front of the GCAA? How can a CEO conduct illegal commercial operations without being blamed? What is your CEO experience in aviation? Gulfjet?!?! How many A6 registered aircraft does PJ operates today?

In addition PJ debts are famous all over the area. I think your company should first settle all these little stains before pretending being a clean ops on this forum.

hptcc
 

I have not yawned in front of a pprune post for a looong time...:zzz:

So tell me hptcc, your staff are happy to be "joking around you" when PJ has not paid them for 2 months?

Attitudes, altitudes and adults......
 

Ex-Terminator,

Maybe your approach was not stabilized? There is nothing worse than a non-stabilized approach where all your parameters are way out of synch and very importantly when your attitude just isn't right. You know it's all about attitude in this game...nothing worse than a wrong or bad attitude no matter what altitude you have in a Company. No one else seems to have had this isuue. In fact to the contrary, some have even found Top Management whole heartedly supportive, both verbally and financially. Again I will reiterate to you - In nearly ALL companies whether in the Middle East or wherever, Top Management simply dont have time to attend countless meetings, discuss countless problems which they know exist, argue with Managers/Directors on a solution and/or waste counteless hours listening to someone about the same old problem (not solution). Experience has lead me believe that if one of my employees comes to me with problem and subsequent solution then I simply tell him/her go ahead and DO IT, FIX IT, EXPEDITE and advise them only to come back to me once everything is solved and ready. I also tell them to not waste my time with small talk and pissy little meetings to tell me every step they took. In return, I offer financial assistance when its requested and required. To my good employees I will back them up all the way (when I say good, I mean those who show me results, those who pave the way for growth, those who prove me wrong, those who dont fill my inbox with utter waste, those who dont take credit for other peoples work...I think you know the type I mean Ex-Terminated, sorry Ex-Terminator). To the bad ones, well what can I say (when I say bad I mean those who hide under the radar, those who take credit for other peoples work, those who just rant on and on about the same old stuff day in day out, those who tell me what needs doing and then don't do it...I think you know the type I mean Ex-Terminated, sorry Ex-Terminator).

Anyhow, the show must go on. PJ will carry on flying to new altitudes with the right attitudes and Inshallah 2010 will see a better, more smooth, more professional, more hassle free organisation. I believe that PJ are on the up and up again so beware people.....

Heres to keeping the dream alive!!! :D:ok::D:ok:

I think it's funny that the(or a) pilot thinks he deserves the time and ears of the CEO. If you can't follow a chain of command then you might want to reassess who and where you are in it. Having said that, it's that way in every Company, wether it's a Corporate Jet outfit or Major carrier. :ugh:

hptcc you really make me laugh on that one! Top management should not be concerned by how issues are managed? Top management is FULLY RESPONSIBLE in front of the GCAA and justice, as such, some involvement in the application of regulations and laws should be on their task list.

What if an accident happened to one of your illegal charter flight? No insurance would cover you and pay for the mess, while your top management would be first to pay the price.

By the way, to be responsible of something (ie flight ops) would naturally require some experience and knowledge. What experience of operations does you big boss have? How can he seriously make decisions and take safety responsibilities?

I'm sorry but according to the laws and regulations of this country (which you obviously don't know), your top management is actually fully responsible for all illegal operations it carried out, even if mislead by nasty employees with bad intentions.

Respect..
 

hptcc,
I have to reiterate the need for you to have some respect for readers' time and intelligence. I also request that you respond to their precise and legitimate questions, rather than waste their time making personal accusations. People are interested in facts that would serve the industry as well as those pursuing their careers within it in an honorable manner. If you continue making posts like this on behalf of the Deebs simply because they can not write a single paragraph in Arabic, let alone English, they will drag you down with them.
At the end, time will tell where this "establishment" will end up. Whether it is contributing positively to the industry, or is being a disgrace, will be judged by authorities, financiers, service providers, suppliers, clients and other stakeholders.

Honnestly EX T and SFLY, why are you bothering yourselves with those replies??? The prick is acting just like his pimp, giving lessons to the world when he's eating out of the toilet?

Let the guy speak, he's only discrediting myself and the organization he's bending over for. Anyone with some kind of self esteem wouldn't take such position, let alone people who made their bones in this business. If you see somebody talking a sh!t bath and the guy tells you "you stink!", are you gonna bother replying to him? I know I won't, I'll just laugh, just like I am at this dude's posts:}

Right
 

You are right FC..and I think hptcc posts have been nothing but insults to the intelligence of the readers and posters alike. They simply are not worth responding to.:bored:

Lost Experience!!
 

Hi Ex,
I was able to get access to one of the corporate reports you were on about regarding work performance at PJ. I was reading a para where there is a mention of a "lost experience" instead of gained or accumulated experience?! :confused: How can this be? Would you care to elaborate?
Cheers.

bherald,
I do not know your background or profession, nevertheless here is my response.
In this industry documenting the work in details is of an extreme importance, where any one performing any task on the aircraft has to document it in the log book with authentication, and authorization. This would safeguard the aircraft maintenance history as well the mechanic's track record of tasks he/she will have been performing, and hence the accumulated experience which is needed for licensing, and upgrade purposes. In order to document and stamp the tasks in the log book, a worker has to be qualified (licensed and type rated). This was not the case at PJ. No one could have his/her work documented because of the lack of licensure and/or type rate. The unauthorized and unqualified mechanics spent months and months working on the aircraft , which was a serious violation and never documented such work which was another serious violation. The second was the cause for the "lost experience" as the mechanics could not officially present the tasks to the auditors or authorities or claim that they had experience on this or that type of aircraft. This affected the mechanics morale severely. The problem is still existing with more violations, frustrations and morale deterioration.
I hope this clears your point.

It Makes Sense
 

Ok.. I now understand:ok:
But it is a bit puzzling to see everything spelled out clearly: violations, warnings, advices and recommendations.. if the management cared, why wasn't it listening?!:ugh:

A good mate of mine is currently employed by PJ..... and desperately looking to get out.

Let's just say that 2 months with no salary from PJ makes my mate very pissed off... :ugh:

DDB's have no morality....

"Do they have anything?" That should be your question dawg:eek:

PJ Finance
 

Ex,
As I found the news that you are bringing of interest, I have been talking to various people including current PJ employees. They never stated a single phrase that contradicts what you have been posting. However, you are mostly focusing on the maintenance side, which I prosume is you area of expertise. This was why I meant to check the other areas where I found an interesting piece of information relating to two ex CFO's who left the company because of conflicts with the CEO (Faris Deeb). One of whom left the company after decades of work with the owner in other businesses; and the other discovered something that the sources did not know the details of. It relates to some kind of "dirty deals" with some clients engaged in money laundery and smuggling stuff accross countries. As a result he resigned and was accused by the CEO of having stolen money from the company!
Can you or anyone else elaborate on this?

Prestige Jet Refuse Court Orders for Pay Employees
 

Hey, it quiet about Prestige Jet here. Why?

Maybe because they throw away employees who try to work by GCAA regulations, so nobody left know enough to discuss danger in pprune?

Maybe because Prestige Jet not pay employees now 4 month so everybody fear say something?

Maybe because they move from HQ to Al Bateen because court order to take furniture, equipment, cars for pay employees who win court case?

Maybe because employees afraid of Faris Deeb's "Bull" (this how Faris describe Jose) who flying two aircraft type, one of which has fraudulent sim check, who treaten other employee with destroy their career and violence? This same Jose sent away from Al Jaber for damage to aircraft due bad landing make damage to aircraft?

Maybe because GCAA protect Prestige Jet by refuse let aircraft owners reclaim aircraft by refuse deregistration, not force Prestige Jet to follow regulation, so employees afraid for job & carrier?

Adelante, comrades, we not paid and not receive help from GCAA unless we tell the world about truth in Prestige Jet. I started thread, please add comments.

And Maybe its the worst company over the world :D

they definitely are the worst company at paying their employees what they owe them. Even with UAE court order they ignore it and have not paid pilots that left last summer. If you even consider flying for these cheaters you will not be paid in the end when you leave.

We must make like other oppressed people in Middle East: make protest visible and loud, bring attention owner Sheikh Hamed al Hamed why he permit employees go without pay and company be danger, not legal and many lawsuit from employee, supplier. Also why he refuse order of court for pay employees who win judgment from court and make order for company pay.

Sheikh Hamed know situation but no caring - he refuse receive or hear Prestige Jet employees who go him and ask for speak about problems - so we must elevate story that it gain attention and affect Sheikh Hamed, since he does not care about his own loyal employees. All we want is pay that was promised us for our works but Hamed this billionaire refuse pay employees who responsible for his own safety. How much idiot that?

Sheikh Hamed office in hotel Sheraton Abu Dhabi - angry protesting Prestige Jet employees in lobby and Sheikh Hamed office area obtain his attention. Also attention of newspaper. Also write Sheikh Hamed in Sheraton tell him Faris criminal Jose danger please pay employees.

if this company still exists, it's because they still find people desperate enough to work for them. Sorry folks, if those of you working took it to court and asked for their rights, things would be different. But so far, they still do not pay on time and employees still remain there, I can understand that it is hard to find other opportunities but you cannot bend over buttnaked and expect not to be screwed

Laughing on Employees & GCAA
 

"Sorry folks, if those of you working took it to court and asked for their rights, things would be different."

This even sorrier: number of employee take complaint to Labour Ministry, Labour Ministry do nothing and send them to court, all win judgements against company and receive court order make company pay - and company still no pay, just laugh on employees.

Company think it above law, laugh on employees, on Court of Abu Dhabi and on GCAA, which no enforce regulation on company and even protect company by refuse allow owners of aircraft deregister aircraft and take back aircraft. Company no pay aircraft, employees, suppliers, laugh on all of them and GCAA provide protection on company, not enforce safety and financial requirements.

These people Faris Deeb and Hamed Al Hamed no respect law or people or customers or suppliers or GCAA or Court of Abu Dhabi. Should be scandal - and will be if accident. Then GCAA go down with Prestige Jet, causing trouble to Emirates & Etihad when GCAA cause UAE downgrade to Category 2 and EK & EY growth refused by EU & US. Why GCAA risk such problem own career and for large UAE airlines in order protect Prestige Jet??

Why PJ IS Still Surviving
 

Freddieclemenza,
Those honest professionals who were unfortunate enough to work for PJ will agree that this entity is demonstrating a true picture of the 21st century slavery (as one poster who is an x employee, once put it) with the well known theme of: Over-work, underpay, force to violate and prohibit complaints. Because PJ management is far more advanced than others in the sand pit when it comes to mistreating employees, they go one extra step in parallel. They buy authority figures, just in case some employees manage to reach GCAA, MOL or other authorities. This last step was openly admitted by the management in more than one instant of intimacy with the chosen few. So who do poor employees hope to reach in order to get their rights?
The bottom line is, no matter what you do within the Gulf area, you will never win. They have the power, and influence on all authorities, ministries and courts of "law".
If any action is to be effective, it has to be taken to the international level. That is where the "Arabian system" is powerless. But this needs evidences and proofs. Do not go there empty handed, with just words.
Good Luck.
bherald

Thank you, bherald. Please, can you describe what you will advice us do when say "If any action is to be effective, it has to be taken to the international level."

2 ways at least
 

an EU airport or regulatory authority follows up the foreign aircraft oversight, based on input from persons involved in a flight or two.

or an employeee claims in hiis own EU country, a sum of money owing, and obtains a court lien, to padlock the asset to ensure settlement.

ie has the eurocontrol bill been paid.????

or airport bills outstanding....

all handling companies billsall up to date.

glf

Some Ideas
 

Thanks glf..may I add a reminder here that once an a/c is airborne entering international aerospace, its airworthiness and compliance with international rules and regulations becomes an international concern and responsibility; meaning that regardless of its origin, registration or ownership, any violation can be reported to the relevant authority (e.g. EASA if it is overflying European aerospace, FAA if flying in a North American aerospace, etc). So provided one has a proof of an existing violation, it can easily be taken to the concerned authority that well and truly oversees and ensures regs compliance, unlike GCAA for instance. Moreover, PJ a/c land in airports across the world where airport authorities have the mandate to ensure compliance with the local as well as international rules and regulations. Those are places where one can submit the complaint with a proof. One of the rather simple issues that we had at European airports with PJ flights was with incomplete, missing or outdated certificates and licenses for a/c and crew members. Another more serious issues related to fake log books with false a/c maintenance history and defect rectification, not to mention counterfeit pilot licenses, etc.

Another Aircraft Repossessed
 

Global Express N5UU join other Prestige Jet aircraft now repossess by owner leassor, like Legacy EC-KFQ. So process suggest above happen but benefit Prestige Jet owner who refuse pay aircraft, supplier, employees but still no pay to Prestige Jet employees.

Notice repossessed aircraft non-UAE register - GCAA protect Prestige Jet by refuse allow owner leassors to repossess A6-registered aircraft. GCAA look other way on operation violations and fraud training & maintenance records cause from pressure by Hamed Al Hamed owner Prestige Jet.

Pay with captains cash then go to jail
 

Latest thing from Prestige Jet. No credit for any flights, so pilots carry big amounts of money. Acountants have no way to track all the money because it comes from unknown places. When pilots terminated the acountants cannot equal the money and the pilots is charged with the missing money. Pilots names are sent to police to get money back from pilots when they are coming or leaving country. No one taking money, acountants are bad and another way Prestige Jet makes going to labor ministry to file complaint no possible.
Pilots paying with cash be advised you to be next.

Prestige Jet: Do Your Job, Go to Jail
 

We have seen numerous threads detailing the underhanded methods of the ownership and management of Prestige Jet, but this one is really over the top:

Due to having no credit after failing to pay just about every person and organization it deals with, Prestige Jet sends its flight crews out with tens of thousands of Euros in cash in order to pay for things like fuel, ground handling, hotels, etc. The entire operation is a cash operation, customers paying cash to Prestige Jet, Prestige Jet paying cash to suppliers - an accounting, organizational control, security and money-laundering nightmare.

With this background, a Lineage pilot asks to be paid (the company has not paid employees in several months), gets nowhere and so files a case for his pay. How does Prestige Jet react? While said pilot is out of country, they file a criminal case accusing the pilot of stealing AED 2 million and now he will be arrested if he tries to enter UAE.

Of course, if he really took the money, the airplane would have never been fueled or paid its various landing, handling and other charges, so this claim is rendered prima facie absurd by fact of the pilot having successfully completed all assigned trips, which he could not have done without spending the money on required items such as fuel and ground handling (not to mention what an indictment this is about management control over the cash, if it is to be believed.)

Colleagues, it is bad enough to not be paid, to be paid sporadically and to be ripped off on your way out of the company - but to be accused of criminal acts and sent to jail because you do your job and ask to be paid is absolutely reprehensible. I hope that all in the pilot community will be as shocked and outraged as I am about this new low in UAE working conditions.

Thank you for whatever moral support you can add to this innocent pilot's travails. Please add your comments so that this thread remains on Page 1 of Pprune until the charges are dropped against this pilot, the current employees are paid and the court orders to pay former employees, a number of whom have successfully won judgments which the company simply ignores, are complied with by Prestige Jet. Thank you for your support and participation in keeping this topic and this thread alive.

Well... there ya have it gentlemen...

Do you really want to work for an outfit that makes you launder their money, doesn't pay your salary for months, and then tries to imprison you when you try to move on simply because they don't want to pay your end-of-service benefits...

Most people would find this assertion laughable to the point of ridiculous.... yet with Prestige.... 'laughable and ridiculous' are kind words to describe them...

Why don't pilots take whatever money they are owned and get the hell out? I am not saying "steal all the money" but to take their salaries and leave

PJ
 

Just a few years ago, they were going well,.paying well , putting the crew in good hotels, and everybody seemed happy, but anybody who dealt with them or worked for them, myself included, could see the end on its way. You do not keep lying to everybody, including the folks who are out there trying to be your professional crew, with out paying the price at the end of it all. I feel for the guys who for whatever reason, are still there, and having to put up with was a fairly difficult job to start with.

Good Luck.

Think of your family also
 

We fail to understand the impact having a job like Prestige Jet has to our families. My family has suffered much because Prestige Jet and the Deebs have seen fit to spend my salarie on new cars, new villas and fill the pockets of the Chairman who has much money already. Then they make trouble with police for pilots leaving thier employ. You do the best you can, then they smash you down. I am sure Mr. Deeb, Mr. Yousef have never missed salarie. SH. Hamed please help your people, pay what is owed to now employees and pay what is owed to employees who have money coming to them from before.

Abu Dhabi Ministry of Labour
 

I have personal experience of taking my case, not dissimilar to this bunch, to taking my case to the Ministry of Labour in Abu Dhabi. I found them helpful, protective, and what's more surprisingly efficient at getting my money. PM for info. DON'T PUT UP WITH IT !

P.S Who was the pilot can someone PM me?

Existing Employees
 

Dear All,
With all that has been reported about PJ, its management and ownership, I am sure that there is evidence that this outfit is corrupt; to say the least. Between current and x employees and outsiders, the crucial role would be the responsibility of the current employees whose information about the compay's prcatices are fresh. This is if ,at all, we intend to stand in the face of a corrupt bunch of creatures, and stop them from doing any more harm and damage to people's lives, to the industry, and to the whole world and mankind. Having said this, I have to point out that I am hereby addressing that category within the current employees who have an alive consience; and who are willing to contribute and put efforts towards putting this entity, its owners and managers where they belong. One would ask why would a decent person want to stay at this **** hole? the answer is because he or she will have been conned into joining, and stranded by bonds and other evil tools that PJ has plenty of. I call upon that category to help expose PJ and pass documents as proofs of corruption, violations, safety compromises, etc, to as many intenrational authorities as well as local UAE authorities. This way, the UAE authorities would be at least exposed to the whole world if they do not take an action; whereas international authrities are bound to act eventually.
BH

You Do Your Job, Ask to Be Paid - They Send You to Jail
 

Further the the above comment by freddieclemenza, I had posted a separate comment detailing the situation. Rather than repeating that here, may I draw your attention to the other thread "Prestige Jet: Do Your Job, Go to Jail".

The behavior of Prestige Jet ownership and management becomes more scandalous and reprehensible every day. Please help us keep the spotlight - and the pressure - on this situation by adding a comment to either of these threads if you seem them slipping onto PPRuNe Page 2 - we need to keep both threads on Page 1, in order to garner the maximum readership and effect.

Thank you.

Thankyou
 

Mr Kangarooflyer,
Thank you for your comments.

You are all dead on the money
 

Easy to see who I am. PJ sent me an email on my personal email account just about 1 year ago today. This was because my company email and phone had been silenced that day (without my knowledge). The email stated that I was no longer necessary, vacate my apartment and go home. I filed suit in Labor court, won the judgement, hired lawyers, all of that and Prestige Jet has still not paid my back salary, vacation time not taken and end of service. They simply refuse to pay. If you think you can do better, I suggest you think again. If anyone in management's lips are moving they are lying. They lie to the government, the labor court, the employees, the suppliers, the aircraft companies and anyone else who will listen to the line of BS. Tread lightly my fine feathered friends.:mad::=