EK - Subtle change to contractual tickets..will you be travelling in Y?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Dubai
EK - Subtle change to contractual tickets..will you be travelling in Y?
What's with this new change in the email STAFF TRAVEL MANUAL UPDATE dated 6 Sept?
It would appear all of a sudden you can be downgraded on a busy flight, despite your contractual entitlement to J (for Captains) and receive no compensation whatsoever. Now that this is in the manual, you're no longer equal to a commercial ticket holder, and will be the first to be bumped back.
This is a big change if my interpretation is correct. Why would staff travel downgrade or offload a commercial pax (and be forced to offer them compensation) when they can just shaft the staff member.
Another amendment; when loads are high, you may not get your boarding pass till the gate/lounge..yet more screwing around, and what's the bet there'll be issues getting into the lounge on your one entitlement for the year.
I can see many, many cases of Captains and families travelling in Y on their ALT when travelling at peak times.
It would appear all of a sudden you can be downgraded on a busy flight, despite your contractual entitlement to J (for Captains) and receive no compensation whatsoever. Now that this is in the manual, you're no longer equal to a commercial ticket holder, and will be the first to be bumped back.
This is a big change if my interpretation is correct. Why would staff travel downgrade or offload a commercial pax (and be forced to offer them compensation) when they can just shaft the staff member.
Another amendment; when loads are high, you may not get your boarding pass till the gate/lounge..yet more screwing around, and what's the bet there'll be issues getting into the lounge on your one entitlement for the year.
I can see many, many cases of Captains and families travelling in Y on their ALT when travelling at peak times.
Joined: Jun 2001
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From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
Don't think so- the circumstances in which you can be downgraded haven't been changed- it's just been clarified that if it happens, that is use of your ALT.
There never was any compensation for downgrade, nor any replacement ALT- this has simply spelled it out.
What DOES suck there (and it's not a change, though I didn't previously know about it) is that it says that if you are entitles to J/F but are on a two class aircraft, you get booked Y and only upgraded if space is available.
I don't understand the logic there...
There never was any compensation for downgrade, nor any replacement ALT- this has simply spelled it out.
What DOES suck there (and it's not a change, though I didn't previously know about it) is that it says that if you are entitles to J/F but are on a two class aircraft, you get booked Y and only upgraded if space is available.
I don't understand the logic there...
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Hades.
Don't forget that your ALT is a firm commercial ticket. The ground staff are required to ask all passengers if they will accept alternative travel before they can ASK you if you are willing to downgrade.
If you opt not to downgrade, they are obliged to offer you hotac etc and alternative travel. It is (or was) in the staff travel manual.
H-D
If you opt not to downgrade, they are obliged to offer you hotac etc and alternative travel. It is (or was) in the staff travel manual.
H-D
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 322
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From: Dubai
Helen have you actually read this amendment?
You say J class is a contractual promise...how about this little gem...
"staff contractually eligible for J/F, travelling on flights where there is no first class, are booked economy with upgrade to business if space available"
How exactly does that abide by the "confirmed J class travel" part of your contract?
This whole amendment is full of holes....and regardless of what people think of their entitlements, raises more questions than answers.
It also quite clearly says, if the flight is full, you may not get your entitled class "until at the gate or the lounge" How does that work in with your contract?
It also says if, after turning up at the gate, they decide you have to travel in Y, then you're stuffed. You get no compensation. I guess at that point you could offload yourself, but how many people are going to do that at the gate?
I think everyone needs to write to JA or similar and have this clarified. My reading of it means there is going to be a lot of problems at check in until this is cleared up
You say J class is a contractual promise...how about this little gem...
"staff contractually eligible for J/F, travelling on flights where there is no first class, are booked economy with upgrade to business if space available"
How exactly does that abide by the "confirmed J class travel" part of your contract?
This whole amendment is full of holes....and regardless of what people think of their entitlements, raises more questions than answers.
It also quite clearly says, if the flight is full, you may not get your entitled class "until at the gate or the lounge" How does that work in with your contract?
It also says if, after turning up at the gate, they decide you have to travel in Y, then you're stuffed. You get no compensation. I guess at that point you could offload yourself, but how many people are going to do that at the gate?
I think everyone needs to write to JA or similar and have this clarified. My reading of it means there is going to be a lot of problems at check in until this is cleared up
Joined: Jul 2000
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From: Dubai - sand land.
I've had a read Kamelchaser - it's not part of the most recent amendments from what I can see. But worth following up on I agree!
Otherwise I'll just have to take my holidays wherever the 3 class flights go!
Otherwise I'll just have to take my holidays wherever the 3 class flights go!
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Hades.
On further investigation:
The paragraphs in the STM relating to the "booking downgrade" do not have the vertical line against them. This appears to indicate that these particular paragraphs are not new and have been there for some time.
Not nice but not new. The question as always is how or whether it is implemented (see White Knights post).
1.1, 1.2 and 1.3 are all, I would suggest, to be expected and not unreasonable.
1.7 simply clarifies the use of the ticket.
Further to my previous post, the question becomes what happens if you decline travel having checked in and/or accepted a Y boarding pass?
IMHO, I think I'd be waiting at check-in if there's a chance I'll not be travelling.
Thoughts?
The paragraphs in the STM relating to the "booking downgrade" do not have the vertical line against them. This appears to indicate that these particular paragraphs are not new and have been there for some time.
Not nice but not new. The question as always is how or whether it is implemented (see White Knights post).
1.1, 1.2 and 1.3 are all, I would suggest, to be expected and not unreasonable.
1.7 simply clarifies the use of the ticket.
Further to my previous post, the question becomes what happens if you decline travel having checked in and/or accepted a Y boarding pass?
IMHO, I think I'd be waiting at check-in if there's a chance I'll not be travelling.
Thoughts?
Joined: Mar 2003
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From: uae
ALT - they have always had the option to downgrade if required . The amendment strictly refers to " if downgraded it still counts as your ALT". My guess is someone ( family member) got down graded and the pilot screened and jumped up and down demanding another ALT.
Joined: Apr 2006
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From: In the seat
So if one is entitled to firm J, upgradeable F, why are you given a firm Y class seat - it should be J!! It's the one ticket used during the year where you should be able to get, that's if you get leave, in accordance with your contract.
It's just another example of the manner in which they change your contractual terms - it's a very very sad reflection on how things have evolved!
It's just another example of the manner in which they change your contractual terms - it's a very very sad reflection on how things have evolved!
