Turkish Airlines
Join Date: Oct 2009
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Sorry but my experience is different. Two times a month i have four off days in a row. That is enough for me to travel to my own country. Turkish people are very friendly and have much respect for us foreign pilots. But i know from other people that THY and other Turkish companies are different then SXS. But I can say I am very happy. If you are willing to relocate it is a good company to work for.
Join Date: Oct 2009
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I am not working for THY but SXS. My experience is different I love this country. Maybe the difference is I am single and don't have to worry about kids and education.
But it is still your choice to relocate, and they don't force you to sign the contract. I think you are a little bit disrespectful with you post to the country and its culture. It is a different way of living don't compare it to your own life. And if you want only that life stay where you are. Every country and culture has it own problems. Don't try to change it, it doesn't work but try to adopt to it. But as I said, I don't have experience with THY
But it is still your choice to relocate, and they don't force you to sign the contract. I think you are a little bit disrespectful with you post to the country and its culture. It is a different way of living don't compare it to your own life. And if you want only that life stay where you are. Every country and culture has it own problems. Don't try to change it, it doesn't work but try to adopt to it. But as I said, I don't have experience with THY
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Dubai
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Hmmmm:
versus:
Everyone is friendly until they see their own personal meal ticket being threatened. Sounds like a bunch of a*s*holes, regardless of who it is.
Turkish people are very welcoming and friendly
The Airline upper management and senior pilots are xenophobic
Join Date: May 2001
Location: HERE AND THERE
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THYTHY
You got the perfect picture!
Albeit I'm not currently working for THY I understand perfectly what you mean.
Unfortunately the way they regard the expats in general won't change in the near future.
Albeit I'm not currently working for THY I understand perfectly what you mean.
Unfortunately the way they regard the expats in general won't change in the near future.
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Gulf playing Golf
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My conclusion is that the job is only suitable for someone who has come out of retirement and could easily stop tomorrow....or was wise enough to save more than I have..!
For the rest of us that depend on salaries to keep the family running, its not an option. Wish it wasnt so.
For the rest of us that depend on salaries to keep the family running, its not an option. Wish it wasnt so.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Europe
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Well saight
First the company and the suroundings are unique, well saight THYTHY.
The people I flew with where nice and warmhearted humans, they embraced you as you where one of theire own even during the assessment.
Then you have the one who are jealous when you deadhead from or to IST on a A320 or B737 and they think you block them from getting promoted to the"High Fleet Job" (A330/340 B777).
On the other side you have the quarter to quarter thinking people only in the higher level of administration and the ones who deal with the Government agencies about valdidation and visa. Not effective at all. There where cases that type ratet and expirienced pilots need about 10 to 12 months until they finished the conversion course, needless to say that many of them left in the meantime.
Now they see that the past was not any good for THY. Now they try something new, throw a new coin and hope for the best instead of taking the right people into the right key position to get things going. That of course could hurt the Buddy scheme, that would question the status quo for some and there you start to reach the starting point again: Find the corner where you start when you are in a circle !
Just to enlighten you a bit more: No hiring into the A330/340 and B777 fleet, advise from above. Sort out the problem in another way, back to square one.
Discipline requires also sacrifice your own benefit now and then, the way I have seen it is that many try to invent the wheel new. Achieve goals without any concessions who would be beneficial in the long term. Targets are set from quarter to quarter, who cares about a year or even for a decade?
The product that the passenger get in the Cabin is good, the food outstanding.
If you are ready to retire tomorrow like Payscale saight it maybe fit you, if you need to feed a family and pay the bills regularly then beware the step you might do: From slippery ground to iced surface. You could slide out tomorrow again as there will be a new excuse that the services of ExPats is not welcomed anymore and you are faster History then you think.
Enjoy the Blue Mosque, the Grand Basar, the Bospherus Cruise and the Evenings at the Taksin Place as long as you are there if you want to take the chance but be warned and prepared at the same time.
The people I flew with where nice and warmhearted humans, they embraced you as you where one of theire own even during the assessment.
Then you have the one who are jealous when you deadhead from or to IST on a A320 or B737 and they think you block them from getting promoted to the"High Fleet Job" (A330/340 B777).
On the other side you have the quarter to quarter thinking people only in the higher level of administration and the ones who deal with the Government agencies about valdidation and visa. Not effective at all. There where cases that type ratet and expirienced pilots need about 10 to 12 months until they finished the conversion course, needless to say that many of them left in the meantime.
Now they see that the past was not any good for THY. Now they try something new, throw a new coin and hope for the best instead of taking the right people into the right key position to get things going. That of course could hurt the Buddy scheme, that would question the status quo for some and there you start to reach the starting point again: Find the corner where you start when you are in a circle !
Just to enlighten you a bit more: No hiring into the A330/340 and B777 fleet, advise from above. Sort out the problem in another way, back to square one.
Discipline requires also sacrifice your own benefit now and then, the way I have seen it is that many try to invent the wheel new. Achieve goals without any concessions who would be beneficial in the long term. Targets are set from quarter to quarter, who cares about a year or even for a decade?
The product that the passenger get in the Cabin is good, the food outstanding.
If you are ready to retire tomorrow like Payscale saight it maybe fit you, if you need to feed a family and pay the bills regularly then beware the step you might do: From slippery ground to iced surface. You could slide out tomorrow again as there will be a new excuse that the services of ExPats is not welcomed anymore and you are faster History then you think.
Enjoy the Blue Mosque, the Grand Basar, the Bospherus Cruise and the Evenings at the Taksin Place as long as you are there if you want to take the chance but be warned and prepared at the same time.
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Dunedin, NZ
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SunExpress & subsidiaries in Turkey
This is in layman's terms how I can describe SXS; Here are the facts:
1. Anadolu Jet had to close down as Pegasus filed suit about illegal competition practices, therefore giving birth to SunExpress expansion.
2. Last December 2011, several foreigner Captains at THY were unexpectedly called to discover the dream of SXS, which was nothing but a nightmare if U continue reading below. (THY sold Foreigner captain names to SXS without their consent) Both HR at THY & SXS work in tandem.
3. SXS is the creation of the infamous THY COO & Flt Ops Directorate to make foreigner pilots at THY occupy the new vacant slots with a pay cut. (-6700T.L/mo), and fly all domestic Anadolu Jet rosters, about 4 to 5 legs/day.
4. SXS max pay is designed to reduce 25% the domestic operating costs of THY, by hiring personnel who are non-typed, and chaps unemployed for past six months. (preferably Yabanci=non Turks).Cheap labor!
5. Some chaps were attracted to the idea of 50/50% funding THY/LH, but as most Germans did with Pegasus, they also decided to pull out recently from SXS, leaving this relatively new outfit 100% under THY funding, and used as the backyard of THY for domestic flights in replacement of Anadolu Jet.
6. THY is a monopoly in Turkey (Andolu Jet, Bora Jet & SunExpress all owned by THY);
7. Working patterns at SXS same or worse than THY (A320/B737NG) operations and based in places like ADA,ESB,SAW,AYT.
8. Employment agreement one page, conditions of service pretty much similar to those offered in Africa or Central America.
9. No union, no job protection, other that working at will.
One positive note: the Management of SXS is more crystal and transparent than that of THY. They seem to have been bred with LH(Lufthansa) HR policies & practices, they treat people better, they accommodate personal issues more humanely, and most important, they let foreigners participate with their former experience in the making of SoP's and other operational issues. Good luck!
1. Anadolu Jet had to close down as Pegasus filed suit about illegal competition practices, therefore giving birth to SunExpress expansion.
2. Last December 2011, several foreigner Captains at THY were unexpectedly called to discover the dream of SXS, which was nothing but a nightmare if U continue reading below. (THY sold Foreigner captain names to SXS without their consent) Both HR at THY & SXS work in tandem.
3. SXS is the creation of the infamous THY COO & Flt Ops Directorate to make foreigner pilots at THY occupy the new vacant slots with a pay cut. (-6700T.L/mo), and fly all domestic Anadolu Jet rosters, about 4 to 5 legs/day.
4. SXS max pay is designed to reduce 25% the domestic operating costs of THY, by hiring personnel who are non-typed, and chaps unemployed for past six months. (preferably Yabanci=non Turks).Cheap labor!
5. Some chaps were attracted to the idea of 50/50% funding THY/LH, but as most Germans did with Pegasus, they also decided to pull out recently from SXS, leaving this relatively new outfit 100% under THY funding, and used as the backyard of THY for domestic flights in replacement of Anadolu Jet.
6. THY is a monopoly in Turkey (Andolu Jet, Bora Jet & SunExpress all owned by THY);
7. Working patterns at SXS same or worse than THY (A320/B737NG) operations and based in places like ADA,ESB,SAW,AYT.
8. Employment agreement one page, conditions of service pretty much similar to those offered in Africa or Central America.
9. No union, no job protection, other that working at will.
One positive note: the Management of SXS is more crystal and transparent than that of THY. They seem to have been bred with LH(Lufthansa) HR policies & practices, they treat people better, they accommodate personal issues more humanely, and most important, they let foreigners participate with their former experience in the making of SoP's and other operational issues. Good luck!
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Dunedin, NZ
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THY is fairly new to dealing with foreigners, and civilian pilots to say the least. They only started recruiting about three years ago, after the AMS accident where EASA/JAA Netherlands auditing team discovered the pilot group had nothing but ex-military Turkish personnel, the type of individuals proud of bombing their Kurdish brothers towards the Iraqi border; THY was forced to accept Yabanci (Non-Turkish) pilots in order for them not to be banned into European airspace, as the AMS accident was not the first one in this airline.
Proud Turks voted NO at TALPA (Turkish THY Pilot Union) when told about THY management seeking foreigners to fill-in the vacancies for the anticipated expansion. They feared being accused of not complying with ICAO English level 4, and many other deficiencies that they sweep under the rug on the basis of protecting their ego. The result then is obvious, how many Turkish pilots do you know working away from Turkey? How many B777 fleet mangers have you met with (0) zero hours on type?
The schizophrenia mentioned by THYTHY is indeed clinical, but so is the case with other professionals there, such as doctors, lawyers and journalists. It is a cultural problem. They are simply not loved by their neighboring countries, and everyone wonders why?
One very sincere Turk (hard to find one
), told me once: Captain, Turkey is not Europe, we are Middle East, please understand that our names and words in our language originate in this part of the world. The extreme case was vented out when I asked about the definition of a Turk?;
"A Sheep's Skin. A sheep never marauds, a sheep never deceives, a sheep is magnificently dumb and docile. With a sheep-skin on his back, a fox can pass right into the chicken coop."
The victims? All foreigners who dare to be nothing but staples of their own whims.
Despise the free lunch, you are joining a proud society where you maybe arrested for uttering remarks praising the Kurds or even knoding the Armenian genocide, the North-Cyprus occupation, Ergenekon, and other issues offending "Turkishness"
For the record, THY owes a pay increase to all employees members of Hava-Is (HAVA-) over 18 months of backdated pay. Is this the future venue you are seeking for you and family members?
[COLOR="DarkRed"]Professor Fevzi Yılmaz appointed mediator in THY dispute
Tuesday, 10 April 2012
Yesterday, in line with the provisions specified under The Collective Labour Agreement, Strike and Lock-Out Law (No. 2822), the competent authority, appointed Professor Fevzi Yılmaz as the mediator in the presence of both parties.
Legal representatives of Turkish Airlines affix an objection annotation maintaining that a mediator should be appointed by the court. This indicates that THY management aims to postpone the bargaining process and is behaving in bad faith. THY management can even open a court case against the appointment of Mr. Yılmaz as the mediator.
The term of duty of the official mediator shall start on the date on which the notice of the court is delivered to him.
Proud Turks voted NO at TALPA (Turkish THY Pilot Union) when told about THY management seeking foreigners to fill-in the vacancies for the anticipated expansion. They feared being accused of not complying with ICAO English level 4, and many other deficiencies that they sweep under the rug on the basis of protecting their ego. The result then is obvious, how many Turkish pilots do you know working away from Turkey? How many B777 fleet mangers have you met with (0) zero hours on type?
The schizophrenia mentioned by THYTHY is indeed clinical, but so is the case with other professionals there, such as doctors, lawyers and journalists. It is a cultural problem. They are simply not loved by their neighboring countries, and everyone wonders why?
One very sincere Turk (hard to find one
), told me once: Captain, Turkey is not Europe, we are Middle East, please understand that our names and words in our language originate in this part of the world. The extreme case was vented out when I asked about the definition of a Turk?; "A Sheep's Skin. A sheep never marauds, a sheep never deceives, a sheep is magnificently dumb and docile. With a sheep-skin on his back, a fox can pass right into the chicken coop."
The victims? All foreigners who dare to be nothing but staples of their own whims.
Despise the free lunch, you are joining a proud society where you maybe arrested for uttering remarks praising the Kurds or even knoding the Armenian genocide, the North-Cyprus occupation, Ergenekon, and other issues offending "Turkishness"
For the record, THY owes a pay increase to all employees members of Hava-Is (HAVA-) over 18 months of backdated pay. Is this the future venue you are seeking for you and family members?
[COLOR="DarkRed"]Professor Fevzi Yılmaz appointed mediator in THY dispute
Tuesday, 10 April 2012
Yesterday, in line with the provisions specified under The Collective Labour Agreement, Strike and Lock-Out Law (No. 2822), the competent authority, appointed Professor Fevzi Yılmaz as the mediator in the presence of both parties.
Legal representatives of Turkish Airlines affix an objection annotation maintaining that a mediator should be appointed by the court. This indicates that THY management aims to postpone the bargaining process and is behaving in bad faith. THY management can even open a court case against the appointment of Mr. Yılmaz as the mediator.
The term of duty of the official mediator shall start on the date on which the notice of the court is delivered to him.
Join Date: Aug 2011
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Not only that, but why would anyone want to join Turkish when they have dishonoured their current Captains.
We were all told we would get a 3 year contract after the first year, and when the time came we only get renewed for 1 year! That is not what I was promised, and if I knew I would be on a 1 year rolling contract that gives me no job security at all, I would never have joined.
THY seem to think they can do whatever they want with no repercussions at all. Pilots talk on here and I only hope this thread helps someone to make the right decision if they are considering this place.
Day to day the job is pleasant, but the second I get a more secure job I'm out of here in a flash.
We were all told we would get a 3 year contract after the first year, and when the time came we only get renewed for 1 year! That is not what I was promised, and if I knew I would be on a 1 year rolling contract that gives me no job security at all, I would never have joined.
THY seem to think they can do whatever they want with no repercussions at all. Pilots talk on here and I only hope this thread helps someone to make the right decision if they are considering this place.
Day to day the job is pleasant, but the second I get a more secure job I'm out of here in a flash.
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Dunedin, NZ
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English Levels Assessment
Latest result from in-house English level tests revealed Turkish Pilots average about level 2. The press in Turkey gave most corporate multinational business workers an "F", or the equivalent of level 1 perhaps.
This audit did not change the fate of high level managers whom today and in past administrations could simply not communicate with foreign Captains. The same thing with the cause of the accident in AMS back in 2009, which was hidden even to auditing CAA from Netherlands in Turkey. It is vox populi amongst THY pilots & management at the time, that the Turkish Captain of that flight had over 130hrs on the clock in the last 30 calendar days. They still blame Boeing for the faulty RA; It is hard to be humble, and that goes from the top.
This audit did not change the fate of high level managers whom today and in past administrations could simply not communicate with foreign Captains. The same thing with the cause of the accident in AMS back in 2009, which was hidden even to auditing CAA from Netherlands in Turkey. It is vox populi amongst THY pilots & management at the time, that the Turkish Captain of that flight had over 130hrs on the clock in the last 30 calendar days. They still blame Boeing for the faulty RA; It is hard to be humble, and that goes from the top.
