EK 777 Captains to the A380?
Join Date: Jan 2008
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The FCI which locks all 330 guys with less than 2500 hours of 55 tonne time off the 380 is also very clear on the experience needed to come in as a direct entry FO onto the 380. I don't recall the exact times, but it clearly states that you must have a large amount of 330/340 or equivalent widebody experience to join onto the 380. If they choose to ignore this requirement and still abide by the 2500 hours for EK FO's, that would be classic EK. However, in terms of cost, I would imagine its all around cheaper for them to take a guy current on the 330 at EK regardless of 55 tonne time to the 380 and back fill the 330 with new hires than it is to pay the insurance bill for taking somebody brand new with no widebody experience onto the 380 directly. That is just my guess, but rest assured, EK will go the cheapest route. Since the 2500 hours 55 tonne rule is an arbitrary number set by the hire ups, I think it will be the first to go before the requirement for new joiner widebody experience. As for captains, well, I would say that both fleets are equally short, so who knows. Just my 2 cents, which with the fall of the dollar is equivalent to, well, f..kall now days.
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Does the insurance company today actually now get involved to the extent they now dictate the experience level of the incoming pilots to the EK380?
I ask because when concerns on drastically falling pilot experience levels were raised to insurance companies in my last airline.... the answer was "We set the premium levels based on the past record of your airline"
So I thought "At least they have been warned"...sadly they got their accident within two years and people died.
Then the premiums were increased as promised.
I ask because when concerns on drastically falling pilot experience levels were raised to insurance companies in my last airline.... the answer was "We set the premium levels based on the past record of your airline"
So I thought "At least they have been warned"...sadly they got their accident within two years and people died.
Then the premiums were increased as promised.
Join Date: Jan 2007
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I don't believe an airlines' insurance premium moves that much on the experience level of its commanders. I was promoted with 2900 hrs tt along with many others (B737-800). If the ocst was linear then it would be utterly prohibitive to promote until you hit a target set by a person(s) in an office with a computer who thinks they have correctly assessed the risk. Which could be anywhere, and where on earth would they get the data to compute and how would they do it?
Although, maybe they can and do.
Although, maybe they can and do.
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Fatbus,
I did not mention anything about people transferring from the 777 within EK, I was answering a previously asked question about Direct Entry onto the 380...
Now the difference between what EK would like (ie 4 engine Airbus time) and what they will get is another debate...
I did not mention anything about people transferring from the 777 within EK, I was answering a previously asked question about Direct Entry onto the 380...
Now the difference between what EK would like (ie 4 engine Airbus time) and what they will get is another debate...
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white night,
wow, you got me there man. As you can see, I definitely did not proof read
Anyways, the point of my post was that EK will do what works for them. I guess I was just thinking insurance would matter, but as you all pointed out, probably doesn't. In the end, its whatever they want to do and that most certainly revolves around whats cheapest.
wow, you got me there man. As you can see, I definitely did not proof read
Anyways, the point of my post was that EK will do what works for them. I guess I was just thinking insurance would matter, but as you all pointed out, probably doesn't. In the end, its whatever they want to do and that most certainly revolves around whats cheapest.
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Calls are now being made in order of seniority as I was just called by Sally. Date is in near beginning of my Datum and no FBW experience so seems strictly on seniority. First course of 4 is in July with two courses to follow but no dates as yet. Me, I think I'll wait as I'm still holding out false hope for the 748.
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from a management perspective...
You look just like a bunch of kids...
" My plane is bigger then yours..."
" Mine is faster..."
" Maaaamaa,,, I want to fly that plane...."
" Maamma why he is flying that plane and I 'm flying just this..?? Uaaaahhh!!"
Screwing you is so easy..like firing on the Red Cross...
" My plane is bigger then yours..."
" Mine is faster..."
" Maaaamaa,,, I want to fly that plane...."
" Maamma why he is flying that plane and I 'm flying just this..?? Uaaaahhh!!"
Screwing you is so easy..like firing on the Red Cross...
Join Date: Sep 2002
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I think it's outrageous. All this because manpower management couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery if they had to. Every airbus capt should write JA a nice letter on how they feel about this.
T
T
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Twiek, why are you outraged that people who have the appropriate seniorty and service on type are permitted to change to another type as per the company's fleet transfer policey?
I think it should have been offered to these guys earlier!
I think it should have been offered to these guys earlier!
And it should come as no surprise, it was always planned to open it up after aircraft 15.
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Because AB guys are sick'n tired of doing night TRV,AMD,MAA,DOH,MCT etc including turns to ATH,NBO,DAC, CCU, while 777 get the good flights.
Fair enough, 777 pilots do a lot of hours, but on AB fleet does lots of hours with minimum days off and it's starting to piss us off....
I assume that's why.
Fair enough, 777 pilots do a lot of hours, but on AB fleet does lots of hours with minimum days off and it's starting to piss us off....
I assume that's why.
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So presumably the airbus f/o's waiting considerably longer to upgrade than their boeing counterparts can move across to the boeing to backfill the boeing upgrade slots. (This is SARCASM)
I am not saying its right. But at least it is following some previously published guideline. Which is something of a surprise in EK. Should the fact that some junior Bus Capt is doing nite turns prevent a more senior Boeing capt from following a published procedure to fly the 380? It wasn't that many years ago that the bus had the good rosters. It swings and changes.
The command thing is a worry. However bus FOs were being held behind Boeing FOs when ALL the present FOs joined. So nothing has changed there. They joined knowing that other Bus FOs were being shafted command wise, and still thought this was the place to be, so I am sure they don't mind now. Would they? (I see your SARCASM, and raise you fact)
The Don
The command thing is a worry. However bus FOs were being held behind Boeing FOs when ALL the present FOs joined. So nothing has changed there. They joined knowing that other Bus FOs were being shafted command wise, and still thought this was the place to be, so I am sure they don't mind now. Would they? (I see your SARCASM, and raise you fact)
The Don
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I know I know....aircraft 15 etc...
I was hoping to improve my lifestyle in the foreseeable future, couldn't give a toss on which aircraft btw. Now I'll be doing c
airbus rosters for the un-forseeable future...
T
I was hoping to improve my lifestyle in the foreseeable future, couldn't give a toss on which aircraft btw. Now I'll be doing c
airbus rosters for the un-forseeable future...T
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Don,
You are correct that historically when the airbus f/o's joined, ( 5 years ago) who are now eligible for command, the airbus side of things was taking longer. A FACT which we all accepted.
You are incorrect though stating that this policy of 15 a/c and boeing transfer will be accepted was in place. No 380's were on property and as such no policy had been instituted.
Was it unwise of the F/O's joining at the time to think that EK would stick to the "continue your career" on the fleet you joined on. I guess so.
We should expect nothing from EK except the path of least expenditure.
Problem is, nobody knows what the whims of that will be when they join.
c'est la vie!!
Regards
I.H
You are correct that historically when the airbus f/o's joined, ( 5 years ago) who are now eligible for command, the airbus side of things was taking longer. A FACT which we all accepted.
You are incorrect though stating that this policy of 15 a/c and boeing transfer will be accepted was in place. No 380's were on property and as such no policy had been instituted.
Was it unwise of the F/O's joining at the time to think that EK would stick to the "continue your career" on the fleet you joined on. I guess so.
We should expect nothing from EK except the path of least expenditure.
Problem is, nobody knows what the whims of that will be when they join.
c'est la vie!!
Regards
I.H