EK Commanders Conference
Join Date: Dec 2007
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A "conference"? Somehow I tend to think that their definition of "conferring" is somewhat skewed.
True to form, management have decided to insert the "duty" into the month of May after bidding closed. Either they are such a shambles they didn't dream this up until the last minute and then didn't think to give us notice OR they simply do not give a f**k.
I think the above should be the subject of the first question out of anyone's mouth if it isn't the first explanation and apology out of theirs.
It'll be interesting to see how many drivers are rostered by idiotic and witless crew-scheduling for the "conference" in the morning session after a midnight sign-off or the afternoon session before a midnight sign-on.
Not sure where it's being held but presumably the meeting's at the COC. Apparently it's two hours long which is short enough for them to simply bombard us with financial performance bull**** and other woes but not long enough for all the group to have a go at unloading their concerns. Oh and best of all, they'll get a least 5 dirhams out of everyone for parking!! Jesus Christ are they THAT desperate for cash?????
I do wonder why it's a "commander's" meeting. Maybe it's to empower the Capts to start upholding the standards they never teach anymore in their miniscule training syllabus.
Any management flunkies out there got any inside goss on the reason for the conference? I hope it's not the same as the Pursers who were made to attend financial briefing intended to motivate them with the bad news. On their day off.
True to form, management have decided to insert the "duty" into the month of May after bidding closed. Either they are such a shambles they didn't dream this up until the last minute and then didn't think to give us notice OR they simply do not give a f**k.
I think the above should be the subject of the first question out of anyone's mouth if it isn't the first explanation and apology out of theirs.
It'll be interesting to see how many drivers are rostered by idiotic and witless crew-scheduling for the "conference" in the morning session after a midnight sign-off or the afternoon session before a midnight sign-on.
Not sure where it's being held but presumably the meeting's at the COC. Apparently it's two hours long which is short enough for them to simply bombard us with financial performance bull**** and other woes but not long enough for all the group to have a go at unloading their concerns. Oh and best of all, they'll get a least 5 dirhams out of everyone for parking!! Jesus Christ are they THAT desperate for cash?????
I do wonder why it's a "commander's" meeting. Maybe it's to empower the Capts to start upholding the standards they never teach anymore in their miniscule training syllabus.
Any management flunkies out there got any inside goss on the reason for the conference? I hope it's not the same as the Pursers who were made to attend financial briefing intended to motivate them with the bad news. On their day off.
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My suspicion is, that despite "toodle pip's" frequent imploring of all and sundry to attend the Thursday one-way talk fests so management could hear our concerns, attendance has been low enough to get the message across to management that, on the whole, the pilot group have done a Clark Gable on 'em. (Brett's message to Scarlett in that scene from "Gone With The Wind", for anyone for whom that was a bit cryptic.)
So, in that grand old tradition of "the whippings will continue until morale improves", they've decided to force pilots to attend what seems to be a carbon copy of the Thursday meetings. Why only captains? Could I be right in thinking that the vast majority of attendees at the Thursday meetings were FOs, keen not to ruffle any feathers that might need to remain smooth with selection for upgrade in mind?
If the message to be imparted is so important that the conference is to be made compulsory, two questions immediately come to mind:
(1) Are we to be told something the FOs should not be privy to? The implications, if that's even halfway true, are mind-boggling and more than a little worrying in this day of CRM and Transcockpit Authority Gradients, particularly if it's some instruction regarding watching the FOs more closely.
and
(2) What in the world were they thinking when they came out with the no transport idea? 30 pilots per meeting? Put on a single bus. The downside to that idea (from management's perspective, at least), might be that getting 30 (I can guarantee you) - disaffected captains together in a crowded bus before a compulsory duty they're quite obviously not going to be paid for might result in a little more "bonding" than management might prefer.
From the pilots' perspective, it would be a real novelty - actually seeing a few work colleagues, a near impossibility in the new "keep 'em separated at all costs" COC.
So, in that grand old tradition of "the whippings will continue until morale improves", they've decided to force pilots to attend what seems to be a carbon copy of the Thursday meetings. Why only captains? Could I be right in thinking that the vast majority of attendees at the Thursday meetings were FOs, keen not to ruffle any feathers that might need to remain smooth with selection for upgrade in mind?
If the message to be imparted is so important that the conference is to be made compulsory, two questions immediately come to mind:
(1) Are we to be told something the FOs should not be privy to? The implications, if that's even halfway true, are mind-boggling and more than a little worrying in this day of CRM and Transcockpit Authority Gradients, particularly if it's some instruction regarding watching the FOs more closely.
and
(2) What in the world were they thinking when they came out with the no transport idea? 30 pilots per meeting? Put on a single bus. The downside to that idea (from management's perspective, at least), might be that getting 30 (I can guarantee you) - disaffected captains together in a crowded bus before a compulsory duty they're quite obviously not going to be paid for might result in a little more "bonding" than management might prefer.
From the pilots' perspective, it would be a real novelty - actually seeing a few work colleagues, a near impossibility in the new "keep 'em separated at all costs" COC.
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Now Now cool your heels
"
OK Mullah, I love a good rant as well as the next guy.....But the meeting will be at the Training College Auditorium. Not in the New EGHQ
You don't have to pay there yet.
Not sure where it's being held but presumably the meeting's at the COC. Apparently it's two hours long which is short enough for them to simply bombard us with financial performance bull**** and other woes but not long enough for all the group to have a go at unloading their concerns. Oh and best of all, they'll get a least 5 dirhams out of everyone for parking!! Jesus Christ are they THAT desperate for cash????? "
You don't have to pay there yet.
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One reason for the late notice might be late directives from above to hold such a brainwash. As it transpires, the 407 voice recorder revealed some blunt front line feelings about management that somewhat “surprised his Highness”, apart from the Aussies.
We might get an Abu Gurair briefing.
We might get an Abu Gurair briefing.
Join Date: Sep 2006
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To GMDS.......
If such is the case, it could be a good turn of events from the recent deterioration of our work conditions and life in Dubai. Something eventually must come out to uncover the failings subsurface within the company. Hopefully this event is all it takes before we sink deeper into the quagmire.
I can dream, can't I.........
CO
I can dream, can't I.........
CO
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Capitalising on a bad situation
My feelings are that management are using an undoubtably difficult time to bring in much desired cost cutting measures that once invoked will never be removed when the situation improves. They are capitalising on a bad set of circumstances rather than managing them for the long term.
I have no problem with putting my nose to the grindstone as required but it would appear that some of the latest changes in T&C's are not entirely necessary, badly thought out and reactionary. All with a view to appear to be taking decisive measures and being indispensible.
Most of these measures might look sensible in the short term but are fraught with long term implications.
Take for instance the increase in productivity threshold. Appropriate in regards to long range flights but totally inappropriate if a roster does not contain LR flights. In fact the letter that justifies these actions says exactly that: Prior to the LR flights, the productivity was appropriate but with more LR flights it is not.
How simplistic to simply then raise the threshold across the board! What if the roster contains no LR flights? By their own definition the productivity threshold is not appropriate.
They could have dealt with a number of rostering issues by addressing this correctly but took a short term view by making a sweeping change that looks good on a spreadsheet but is doubtless going to increase the incidences of serious fatigue and associated pilot error.
Is it co-incidence that some very public errors have been made since this rule was introduced? Call it fatigue, destruction of moral, angst at job security or whatever you want but the ASR's will increase and ultimately a serious incident or accident is inevitable.
"Bad things happen in Bear Markets"
There is little recognition for the difficulties employees are facing outside their employment. Dubai is a miserable place at the moment and many pilots are distracted by events around them and affecting them. Couple this with the constant whittling away by the management and psychological impact is huge. Despite our best intentions and professionalism we are all human.
Management would do well to view the situation as a whole, not an opportunity to push personal agendas of cost cutting to curry favour and remain employed.
We need sensible discussion, sensible decisions, and strong hands. Unlike the rest of Dubai, aviation cannot be reduced to the level driving the hardest bargain.
Historically this has often turned out to be too bitter for anyone's taste.
I have no problem with putting my nose to the grindstone as required but it would appear that some of the latest changes in T&C's are not entirely necessary, badly thought out and reactionary. All with a view to appear to be taking decisive measures and being indispensible.
Most of these measures might look sensible in the short term but are fraught with long term implications.
Take for instance the increase in productivity threshold. Appropriate in regards to long range flights but totally inappropriate if a roster does not contain LR flights. In fact the letter that justifies these actions says exactly that: Prior to the LR flights, the productivity was appropriate but with more LR flights it is not.
How simplistic to simply then raise the threshold across the board! What if the roster contains no LR flights? By their own definition the productivity threshold is not appropriate.
They could have dealt with a number of rostering issues by addressing this correctly but took a short term view by making a sweeping change that looks good on a spreadsheet but is doubtless going to increase the incidences of serious fatigue and associated pilot error.
Is it co-incidence that some very public errors have been made since this rule was introduced? Call it fatigue, destruction of moral, angst at job security or whatever you want but the ASR's will increase and ultimately a serious incident or accident is inevitable.
"Bad things happen in Bear Markets"
There is little recognition for the difficulties employees are facing outside their employment. Dubai is a miserable place at the moment and many pilots are distracted by events around them and affecting them. Couple this with the constant whittling away by the management and psychological impact is huge. Despite our best intentions and professionalism we are all human.
Management would do well to view the situation as a whole, not an opportunity to push personal agendas of cost cutting to curry favour and remain employed.
We need sensible discussion, sensible decisions, and strong hands. Unlike the rest of Dubai, aviation cannot be reduced to the level driving the hardest bargain.
Historically this has often turned out to be too bitter for anyone's taste.
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Hi,
they should have put the option to attend the meeting on the CRS bid.
Morale is a threat to flight safety, hopefully it will be addressed and well received by those that decide to attend.
they should have put the option to attend the meeting on the CRS bid.
Morale is a threat to flight safety, hopefully it will be addressed and well received by those that decide to attend.
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GDMS
Wouldn't surprise me indeed.
You know the thing is, we were soo damn close to the biggest disaster in years and all they can come up with in the first place is to push the crews into resignation. Pathetic. I think this tea&biscuits thing is a farce to polish up their image to the outside world.
Gents : don't forget to take your hats and ties.
You know the thing is, we were soo damn close to the biggest disaster in years and all they can come up with in the first place is to push the crews into resignation. Pathetic. I think this tea&biscuits thing is a farce to polish up their image to the outside world.
Gents : don't forget to take your hats and ties.
I seem to remember TCK being frog marched out of the building after the JNB incident. Perhaps TCAS and Ed are being proactive, and trying to get a good price for their cars etc before they too are dissmissed. 
Should we be running a book on this? Who will go and when?
If its yet another paycut, couldnt they just give us another laminated card stating how and when we should bend over?
Don
Should we be running a book on this? Who will go and when?If its yet another paycut, couldnt they just give us another laminated card stating how and when we should bend over?
Don
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Think tactically.
Gather in groups before the meeting.
Lay out your plans.
Write out what the pilot group considers as needing attention.
Decide who will speak for what.
Given you must go to the briefing, turn the inevitable to your advantage.
Good luck.
Gather in groups before the meeting.
Lay out your plans.
Write out what the pilot group considers as needing attention.
Decide who will speak for what.
Given you must go to the briefing, turn the inevitable to your advantage.
Good luck.
Join Date: May 2005
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Turn up, find the sign in sheet, sign, then go for a piss for the rest of the day.
Or,
Just press 2, it's not like someone else has to do your duty
I for one will be calling transport for a car. We only have 1 car and if the boss is working, I sure as sh*t won't be paying for a taxi. The company want us to follow the rules, so they can as well by providing transport, it's part of the package.
Or,
Just press 2, it's not like someone else has to do your duty
I for one will be calling transport for a car. We only have 1 car and if the boss is working, I sure as sh*t won't be paying for a taxi. The company want us to follow the rules, so they can as well by providing transport, it's part of the package.
Last edited by Fart Master; 18th Apr 2009 at 12:44. Reason: Can't Spell
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Does'nt this feel like 2004 all over again? Nearly lost an aeroplane, management floundering around, morale nosediving etc etc. The best we can hope for is Long Range Ed getting a pink slip and then in few years the cycle will repeat itself!
We took a pay cut in 2004 as well. The more things change the more they stay the same. 
Anyone appplying for Eds Job? Aviation/geograhic/man management experience not require.
Don
Anyone appplying for Eds Job? Aviation/geograhic/man management experience not require.
Don
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Looks like the fun and games is starting earlier than May. I've just been rostered to attend a 'MB1' tomorrow morning at short notice whilst on reserve. What to do ?? - Open another bottle of wine !