Dubai Bankrupt?!?!
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aaaaaaaaahhhhhhh........... the Cloak of Reality is settling heavily on the thin vaneer of Dubai's shallow shoulders.
I'm afraid that all I'm hearing is that 'you reap what you sow'.
I'm afraid that all I'm hearing is that 'you reap what you sow'.
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Noflare, SIA makes even more profit every year, but no-one ever seems to question that despite the fact both airlines essentially do the same thing and are about the same size!
Over to you!
Over to you!
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Sky News are in Dubai for the week with some special reports from the UAE.
Their correspondent Tim Marshal has already compared Abu Dhabi to Dubai as Washington is to New York... a bit of a stretch though he does mention Abu Dhabi's bailing out of Dubai as a result of the economic downturn.
Be interesting to see how the week progresses and how impartial they are in their reporting...
Their correspondent Tim Marshal has already compared Abu Dhabi to Dubai as Washington is to New York... a bit of a stretch though he does mention Abu Dhabi's bailing out of Dubai as a result of the economic downturn.
Be interesting to see how the week progresses and how impartial they are in their reporting...
Last edited by Marooned; 24th Nov 2008 at 06:55.
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Noflare (hard landing!!!) EK is audited every year by PWC - I doubt very much that they'll let EK cook the books..
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Auditors nowadays are "controllable" human beings...
. They are not an independent org sent in by shareholders. Who pays the auditing job other than EK itself? Would they go against their pay-masters? Therefore, the numbers are as good as they make them look good 
. Let EK or EY or even other so protected institutions go public in the stock market...
and we'll see their real value.
. They are not an independent org sent in by shareholders. Who pays the auditing job other than EK itself? Would they go against their pay-masters? Therefore, the numbers are as good as they make them look good . Let EK or EY or even other so protected institutions go public in the stock market... and we'll see their real value.
I seem to remember a note somewhere in the "Audited" accounts that state PWC audit the books that EK give them. I can only guess what that means.
And while we are on the subject how does BA manage to make more profit so far this year than EK. ??
And while we are on the subject how does BA manage to make more profit so far this year than EK. ??
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It was only a matter of time....
Alabbar said Dubai's debt obligations currently stand at $80 billion.
Dubai can and will meet all its debt obligations, which currently stand at $80 billion, the chairman of Emaar Properties said on Monday.
Mohamed Ali Alabbar, also a member of Dubai’s Executive Council, said Dubai’s sovereign debt obligations currently stood at $10 billion, while the total debt obligations of state-affiliate companies was $70 billion.
"Let me state categorically the government can and will meet all its obligations going forward," Alabbar said, speaking at a conference in Dubai.
"This city as a part of one strong nation will continue to grow and triumph."
Dubai can and will meet all its debt obligations, which currently stand at $80 billion, the chairman of Emaar Properties said on Monday.
Mohamed Ali Alabbar, also a member of Dubai’s Executive Council, said Dubai’s sovereign debt obligations currently stood at $10 billion, while the total debt obligations of state-affiliate companies was $70 billion.
"Let me state categorically the government can and will meet all its obligations going forward," Alabbar said, speaking at a conference in Dubai.
"This city as a part of one strong nation will continue to grow and triumph."
I'm sorry does somebody have the figures for the Abu Dhabi sovereign fund standings, oh that's right only the biggest in the world
Ho hum....life in the Capital goes on
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The magic phrase in that press release is
Incredibly important "first venture" of a piece of news preparing the public for what will soon become a reality. That phrase, and others like it, will be carefully dropped into the future press releases over the next weeks to remind us all, but particulary Dubai's Emariti population, that it doesn't really matter who owns the family farm, Dubai or Abu Dhabi, as we "are all the same".
Judging by the way many of the local Dubai Emariti population reacted to Shk Mo's selling off Dubai's independent defence force to Abu Dhabi's control in return for the twin towers - how many years ago is that now? - (some really unhappy campers at the time, by it's all water under the bridge now), it's going to be a hard sell that will need to be skilfully sold over the next few months. (And with National Day just a week away, what better time of the year to start?)
I think we all wish we could share the optimism expressed by Oblaasop. However, I think the adage for the moment for any Dubai resident should probably be: "Hope for the best - but be prepared for the worst." If even half of what we're currently hearing turns out to be true, I suspect it's going to get ugly in places.
one strong nation
Judging by the way many of the local Dubai Emariti population reacted to Shk Mo's selling off Dubai's independent defence force to Abu Dhabi's control in return for the twin towers - how many years ago is that now? - (some really unhappy campers at the time, by it's all water under the bridge now), it's going to be a hard sell that will need to be skilfully sold over the next few months. (And with National Day just a week away, what better time of the year to start?)
I think we all wish we could share the optimism expressed by Oblaasop. However, I think the adage for the moment for any Dubai resident should probably be: "Hope for the best - but be prepared for the worst." If even half of what we're currently hearing turns out to be true, I suspect it's going to get ugly in places.
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The biggest property bubble ever seen is about to burst, a nation built on greed/dirty money and a rulers folly is about to feel the credit crunch.
Lets hope the brotherhood come forward and keep it afloat otherwise it will be very messy
Lets hope the brotherhood come forward and keep it afloat otherwise it will be very messy
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Expect some answers by end week or early next....all will be revealed!
Anybody need a road map to the Ministry of Finance in Abu Dhabi...just follow the entourage of world leaders lining up at the Palace gates!!
Anybody need a road map to the Ministry of Finance in Abu Dhabi...just follow the entourage of world leaders lining up at the Palace gates!!
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Not Selling!
Mohamed Ali Alabbar, Chairman of Dubai Financial Advisory Council and Chairman of Emaar Properties, laughed off rumours that Dubai may sell equity stakes in companies such as Emirates, Jumeirah or Nakheel, perhaps to the Government of Abu Dhabi, in order to fund sovereign debt obligations. "I have been receiving calls that Emirates has been sold and I laughed. It is a rumour and is absolutely not true. The government has not sold a thing and we will not be selling, as simple as that," Alabbar told reporters on the sidelines of DIFC Week.
Keep Discovering
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Hubris is the best word to describe it all.
Shelley would be delighted:
For those fortunate enough to have been spared English literature in their youth, the full text may be found here
Shelley would be delighted:
`My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings:
Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair!'
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare,
The lone and level sands stretch far away.
Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair!'
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare,
The lone and level sands stretch far away.
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LMAO
Oh dear, a bunch of pilots debating the most intricate of economic and financial issues that trained and qualified finance people have a hard time rendering.
keep to your pay grade people.http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/...sa_naughty.gif
keep to your pay grade people.http://www.pprune.org/forums/images/...sa_naughty.gif
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blah blah... intricate of economic and financial issues that trained and qualified finance people have a hard time rendering.
In the light of recent events I think we have as much a right to call ourselves financial experts as the born again 'well of course no one could see this one coming' ones claim to be.
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... weell Waldorfin - at least You still haven't learned the lection from the credit crunch - which might still be worsening -...
"Oh dear, a bunch of pilots debating the most intricate of economic and financial issues that trained and qualified finance people have a hard time rendering"
the whole fcuk-up was ONLY caused by that "that trained and qualified finance people" who totally lost it, by selling CDO (Colleteral Damage Obligations) which have been in the end aslmost been more worth than the GDP of the biggist economy in the world . the USA;
so everybody who did trust his own instinct -rather than those shiny IPO brochures, off-plan-sale promises at the MOE etc. everybody who UNDERSTANDS that money in fact does NOT earn money by itsself (it never did!), and DISBELIEVED the the money-hazardeurs and therefore did NOT buy any of their obligations or funds, has been way smarter than that greedy money bunch at wall-street an other "card-house-players" who totally lost it
Morgan Stanley warned his clients already on October 8th of the danger of too many traders and investment banks are merely playing “billionaire’s poker” nowadays - which is way off responsible inevesting & borrowing, as a bank is supposed to do - and / in the end/ caused the most seriuos downturn of the world-economy since the late 20ies - which ist most likely way from over yet!
And - please, don't tell me/ us ANYTHING about thöse "trained and qualified finance people" - 'cause they are exactly the opposite - as it turned out:
merely gamblers, who finally lost their game, don't really understand the effects of their doing - and the taxpayers have to pay the aftermath/ cleanup now, banks closing in dozends - the biggest bank of the world tumbling over theirt lost bets going in Billions of losses - like AIG, Fannie Mae & Citigroup in the US - basically BANKRUPT - livin' broken on US-treasury welfare now!
and if You take the "once so glorious" hedge-fund managers: just look how they've ben beaten hands-down by Porsche in their own game - losing Billions betting against the Volkswagen shares - ending in a short sqeeze,where they have to buy their borrowed shares back to zup to 500% higher prices - those muppets
Porsche breaks the hedge funds | Squeezy money | The Economist
- must be the same, who run our provident funds then
... and if you look at the naive propaganda-style gulf news etc. - you might believe less and less what those muppets are claiming, as the UAE stock-market tell's us a tatal different story: Dubai &the UAE are in a serious downward-spiral - whilst investors are running away and out of cash -drawing money out of the UAE into safer investments for the years to come- hence the fall in prices all over the board now /specially building companies like EMAAR and Nakheel are merely penny-stocks now, as the future outlook for them/ and the UAE/ is more than grim here!
"Oh dear, a bunch of pilots debating the most intricate of economic and financial issues that trained and qualified finance people have a hard time rendering"
the whole fcuk-up was ONLY caused by that "that trained and qualified finance people" who totally lost it, by selling CDO (Colleteral Damage Obligations) which have been in the end aslmost been more worth than the GDP of the biggist economy in the world . the USA;
so everybody who did trust his own instinct -rather than those shiny IPO brochures, off-plan-sale promises at the MOE etc. everybody who UNDERSTANDS that money in fact does NOT earn money by itsself (it never did!), and DISBELIEVED the the money-hazardeurs and therefore did NOT buy any of their obligations or funds, has been way smarter than that greedy money bunch at wall-street an other "card-house-players" who totally lost it
Morgan Stanley warned his clients already on October 8th of the danger of too many traders and investment banks are merely playing “billionaire’s poker” nowadays - which is way off responsible inevesting & borrowing, as a bank is supposed to do - and / in the end/ caused the most seriuos downturn of the world-economy since the late 20ies - which ist most likely way from over yet!
And - please, don't tell me/ us ANYTHING about thöse "trained and qualified finance people" - 'cause they are exactly the opposite - as it turned out:
merely gamblers, who finally lost their game, don't really understand the effects of their doing - and the taxpayers have to pay the aftermath/ cleanup now, banks closing in dozends - the biggest bank of the world tumbling over theirt lost bets going in Billions of losses - like AIG, Fannie Mae & Citigroup in the US - basically BANKRUPT - livin' broken on US-treasury welfare now!
and if You take the "once so glorious" hedge-fund managers: just look how they've ben beaten hands-down by Porsche in their own game - losing Billions betting against the Volkswagen shares - ending in a short sqeeze,where they have to buy their borrowed shares back to zup to 500% higher prices - those muppets
Porsche breaks the hedge funds | Squeezy money | The Economist
- must be the same, who run our provident funds then
... and if you look at the naive propaganda-style gulf news etc. - you might believe less and less what those muppets are claiming, as the UAE stock-market tell's us a tatal different story: Dubai &the UAE are in a serious downward-spiral - whilst investors are running away and out of cash -drawing money out of the UAE into safer investments for the years to come- hence the fall in prices all over the board now /specially building companies like EMAAR and Nakheel are merely penny-stocks now, as the future outlook for them/ and the UAE/ is more than grim here!
Last edited by Cyberbird; 26th Nov 2008 at 06:28.
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You know you've been in the middle east too long when:
You have a chip on your shoulder about whether the emirate you live in is bigger/richer/better than the one next to you.....hey Foxy??
Oops, wrong thread, sorry. Now, lets get back to all the posts by people who think that the company they work for isnt just one of many of the owners that couldnt be bought/sold/traded/re-mortgaged like any other- especially when the wolves are at the door, or accountants who think they are "the smartest people in the room".
You have a chip on your shoulder about whether the emirate you live in is bigger/richer/better than the one next to you.....hey Foxy??
Oops, wrong thread, sorry. Now, lets get back to all the posts by people who think that the company they work for isnt just one of many of the owners that couldnt be bought/sold/traded/re-mortgaged like any other- especially when the wolves are at the door, or accountants who think they are "the smartest people in the room".
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I don't get it. Where is the surpise.
You really believed that this scum city, this ammass of concrete and sand invented by the sick fantasy of a horse breeder and his bad counselor could be a success?
Ridicously built and priced real estate sold in malls, in cockpit and by filipinos whos previous job was bartendering never sound the bell in your head? Buy an apartment we'll give a you a plane?
In 30 to 40 years this place will be back to camels dates and pearls. That could have been a sustanaible solution from the beginning capable of attracting more tourism then nature raping projects and other idiotic ideas. But mixing arab proto semitic greed and oil cash with western briton planet spoling profit mentality ..what a mix!!
When I first come I start recycling.. like an idiot I was going to throw away accurately sorted waste in the recycling center.
Not anymore... dumping sewage on the beaches?
**** you... be the first to be submerged with the plastic bottle made with the black **** you pump out of sand.
Emihad will be based in Jebel Ali airport..that's the reason why the are building it. They knew it since November 2003 when Ethiad started ops.
sieg heil
Manfred
You really believed that this scum city, this ammass of concrete and sand invented by the sick fantasy of a horse breeder and his bad counselor could be a success?
Ridicously built and priced real estate sold in malls, in cockpit and by filipinos whos previous job was bartendering never sound the bell in your head? Buy an apartment we'll give a you a plane?
In 30 to 40 years this place will be back to camels dates and pearls. That could have been a sustanaible solution from the beginning capable of attracting more tourism then nature raping projects and other idiotic ideas. But mixing arab proto semitic greed and oil cash with western briton planet spoling profit mentality ..what a mix!!
When I first come I start recycling.. like an idiot I was going to throw away accurately sorted waste in the recycling center.
Not anymore... dumping sewage on the beaches?
**** you... be the first to be submerged with the plastic bottle made with the black **** you pump out of sand.
Emihad will be based in Jebel Ali airport..that's the reason why the are building it. They knew it since November 2003 when Ethiad started ops.
sieg heil
Manfred
Last edited by Von Richtofen; 26th Nov 2008 at 09:49.