"Command Interview" bunk
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: Over Graz
Ray, I will venture to say that this "interview syndrome" is another (of many) British legacy to the peoples of this part of the world.
In Emirates, you are always treated as a "trainee," a "candidate," a "student," stuff like that. It doesn't matter if you have been here for twenty years or so.
In essence, those HR (human remains) folks decide your career progress.
Interviews, tests, psychometrics, more tests, and in the end, they screw up and hire or upgrade some weirdo to fly their airplanes
In Emirates, you are always treated as a "trainee," a "candidate," a "student," stuff like that. It doesn't matter if you have been here for twenty years or so.
In essence, those HR (human remains) folks decide your career progress.
Interviews, tests, psychometrics, more tests, and in the end, they screw up and hire or upgrade some weirdo to fly their airplanes
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 180
Likes: 0
From: The Far Side
Why have an interview? From most of the work and a little responsibility, to little apparent work and all the resposibility. Some sort of interview would seem appropriate for the extra responsibility, and wider industry consensus is in agreement.
The big question is: why the grilling of First Officers that you know well, and the tea and dates for DEC of whom you know absolutely nothing??
Because if a DEC screws up we can blame the company that sold us a dud.
You are nothing but a herd of cowards.
Why do you have so little faith in your own checking and training system? The answer to that question is even more frightening.
Is there no-one who will take control of the airline's destiny and just fix it?? Just fix it. Everyone but the great big chief seems to know what to do.
Probably better just to leave while the market is strong. There are professional airlines out there.
For those of you who retain little pride...... please enjoy!
The big question is: why the grilling of First Officers that you know well, and the tea and dates for DEC of whom you know absolutely nothing??
Because if a DEC screws up we can blame the company that sold us a dud.
You are nothing but a herd of cowards.
Why do you have so little faith in your own checking and training system? The answer to that question is even more frightening.
Is there no-one who will take control of the airline's destiny and just fix it?? Just fix it. Everyone but the great big chief seems to know what to do.
Probably better just to leave while the market is strong. There are professional airlines out there.
For those of you who retain little pride...... please enjoy!
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 92
Likes: 0
From: north
For those of you that think the market is strong, then jump ship. It certainly isnt in the UK. EG Last years 767 shortage is no more with mergers and restructures all over the industry. Decs are used in all companies bar a few, as Im sure some of you F/os will take advantage of if you do leave. The interview waitnig rooms are full of captains looking for captains jobs. Innapropiate hiring is just as rife here in the uk as it may or may nor be where you are. Those are the facts these days gents.
The expat market...well look on these threads, and others. moan moan moan.
A command interview is the least of your worries. EK/qr et al arent going to merge you arent going to be made redundant. Its not as good as it was but guess what...NO WHERE IS....But if you insist on thinking the world ends at the Dubai border or (in the context of how the companies treat you) its any different anywhere else , then just do it.
Obsessing with the DEC thing right or wrong as it may be just makes you all look like you have a chip.
The expat market...well look on these threads, and others. moan moan moan.
A command interview is the least of your worries. EK/qr et al arent going to merge you arent going to be made redundant. Its not as good as it was but guess what...NO WHERE IS....But if you insist on thinking the world ends at the Dubai border or (in the context of how the companies treat you) its any different anywhere else , then just do it.
Obsessing with the DEC thing right or wrong as it may be just makes you all look like you have a chip.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 180
Likes: 0
From: The Far Side
Dear Wee One, all chips flicked off when after 4 years of baby sitting I was so generously awarded the scrambled eggs. Same job, it still sucks, only change was the pay and log book collumn.
Reality is that the pool of locally experienced senior First Officers is far safer than DEC. The real issue is money saved on the quick rostering fix. Have a bit of courage management and build an airline on airmanship merit and not of a catering rating.
Three cheers for the caterers who have brought you 5 stars this far, but there is so much further to go to be an airline to work for with pride.
Bring Back the Biff... You work for such an airline, blessed you are. May your career bring much personal satisfaction.
Reality is that the pool of locally experienced senior First Officers is far safer than DEC. The real issue is money saved on the quick rostering fix. Have a bit of courage management and build an airline on airmanship merit and not of a catering rating.
Three cheers for the caterers who have brought you 5 stars this far, but there is so much further to go to be an airline to work for with pride.
Bring Back the Biff... You work for such an airline, blessed you are. May your career bring much personal satisfaction.
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
From: in harmony
stupid politics going on that's a reason behind. Every manager is trying to escape any kind of responsibility pushing the ball through the next door. Sure if a DEC does do a damage it's just a little mistake happening worldwide and more important no one is to blame. Upgrading people requires ability to take responsibility. Our management lets rather two captains fly together costing hell a lot of cash to the company but to take that responsibility. It's a wonder how some people became manager at last?? The whole situation is pathetic causing a huge shortage of first officers. The companies world wide are fighting for them offering fast tracks. Time to smell the roses for our team?
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 628
Likes: 0
From: Australia
So who passes? The guy who knows the OMA inside out word for word and just makes it through his sim ride or the seasoned pilot who knows a portion of the OMA but flies like a dream regardless of what they throw at him in the sim?
Last edited by Sal-e; 8th October 2007 at 08:49.
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 138
Likes: 0
From: 30 West
Black Stain,
So an experienced First Officer is safer than a DEC? Quantify that one will you? To make that statement is a load of uninformed rubish. Yeah, he might know some local rules and how to figure out flight time limitations, but I will take a DEC from a worldwide airline with 15000 hours and his experience over a 4000 f/o that has memorized chapter 10. And probably those 4000 hours at EK has been in 8 hour blocks, not 2 hour blocks. Experience trumps memorizing the books any day.
And any news if you guys are going to let others fly your 747-8s on order?
IXNAT
So an experienced First Officer is safer than a DEC? Quantify that one will you? To make that statement is a load of uninformed rubish. Yeah, he might know some local rules and how to figure out flight time limitations, but I will take a DEC from a worldwide airline with 15000 hours and his experience over a 4000 f/o that has memorized chapter 10. And probably those 4000 hours at EK has been in 8 hour blocks, not 2 hour blocks. Experience trumps memorizing the books any day.
And any news if you guys are going to let others fly your 747-8s on order?
IXNAT
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 180
Likes: 0
From: The Far Side
Dear IXNAT,
With the exception of the one guy who punched a Dispatcher, there have been no problems with any guys upgraded within here. None that I have heard of anyway??
Several DEC have been terminated here over recent years for dangerous acts.
It is you that need to get the facts straight.
With the exception of the one guy who punched a Dispatcher, there have been no problems with any guys upgraded within here. None that I have heard of anyway??
Several DEC have been terminated here over recent years for dangerous acts.
It is you that need to get the facts straight.
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 312
Likes: 0
From: middle of nowhere
JNB grassplough regular
MUC snowplough regular
GLA grassplough regular
Himalaya almost snowplough local talent
DXB almost wallplough DEC (sacked because he discovered
that it was a software sc###up)
go figure BS
MUC snowplough regular
GLA grassplough regular
Himalaya almost snowplough local talent
DXB almost wallplough DEC (sacked because he discovered
that it was a software sc###up)
go figure BS
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,848
Likes: 40
From: Dubai - sand land.
IXNAT - you're forgetting that a large percentage of F/O's at EK were CAPTAINS prior to coming here
And quite a few with over the 10000 hr DEC requirement.
As for 8 hr blocks instead of 2 hr blocks - I wish it were all 8 hr blocks on my roster, alas, lots of turnarounds this month
And quite a few with over the 10000 hr DEC requirement.As for 8 hr blocks instead of 2 hr blocks - I wish it were all 8 hr blocks on my roster, alas, lots of turnarounds this month
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 242
Likes: 0
Gretchen Petal
Lets set the record straight. GLA was a DEC, not that the fact is necessarily relevant. The facts surrounding this incident are unknown by most and therefore most professional pilots are refraining from passing judgement.
Munich was an outright component failure, I'm assuming you're referring to the broken axle.
The DEC with the barrier incident, that was just the tip of the iceberg. Right call in my opinion but it wasn't his hired status (DEC) that controlled his style of operation.
Most of the DEC's here are competent enough. Question is, are they necessarily anymore competent than upgrading an FO? In most cases the answer is an emphatic, no. Thousands of hours implies ability, it doesn't prove it.
Regardless of anyones opinion, DEC's have been hired in the past and the policy will continue to remain in place.
Back to the thread. Yes there should be an interview for command upgrade. I also believe that the whole DEC/Upgrade process should be reviewed/adjusted to ensure a common product after FLC. Another airlines command process is not necessarily an appropriate benchmark for Emirates and the interview is inconsequential for anyone that is up to it.
Lets set the record straight. GLA was a DEC, not that the fact is necessarily relevant. The facts surrounding this incident are unknown by most and therefore most professional pilots are refraining from passing judgement.
Munich was an outright component failure, I'm assuming you're referring to the broken axle.
The DEC with the barrier incident, that was just the tip of the iceberg. Right call in my opinion but it wasn't his hired status (DEC) that controlled his style of operation.
Most of the DEC's here are competent enough. Question is, are they necessarily anymore competent than upgrading an FO? In most cases the answer is an emphatic, no. Thousands of hours implies ability, it doesn't prove it.
Regardless of anyones opinion, DEC's have been hired in the past and the policy will continue to remain in place.
Back to the thread. Yes there should be an interview for command upgrade. I also believe that the whole DEC/Upgrade process should be reviewed/adjusted to ensure a common product after FLC. Another airlines command process is not necessarily an appropriate benchmark for Emirates and the interview is inconsequential for anyone that is up to it.
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 312
Likes: 0
From: middle of nowhere
atiuta
Could work for comments on DEC's the same.
GLA DEC? Not Management?
MUC was the one suffocating the engine in a snow wall.
But apart from this:
that's the best contribution to this problem.
The facts surrounding this incident are unknown by most and therefore most professional pilots are refraining from passing judgement.
GLA DEC? Not Management?
MUC was the one suffocating the engine in a snow wall.
But apart from this:
Back to the thread. Yes there should be an interview for command upgrade. I also believe that the whole DEC/Upgrade process should be reviewed/adjusted to ensure a common product after FLC. Another airlines command process is not necessarily an appropriate benchmark for Emirates and the interview is inconsequential for anyone that is up to it.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 242
Likes: 0
GLA DEC? Yes. Into a management position, but DEC none-the-less.
Comments on specific cases based on fact.
Have to admit that Black Stain is right, there have been more DEC's terminated here than FO's. Either the the hiring process has a weak spot or the individuals were able to hide their flaws better than the FO's can.
Comments on specific cases based on fact.
Have to admit that Black Stain is right, there have been more DEC's terminated here than FO's. Either the the hiring process has a weak spot or the individuals were able to hide their flaws better than the FO's can.
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: sky
