Emirate Advice: EK drivers only
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Emirates Advice: EK drivers only
Hi Guys and Girls,
I am considering applying for a position at EK and need some honest advice and information. No whiners PLEASE!!!
Having just read the thread: Unofficial EK Poll, it stroke me that the comments are very similar to our cockpit discussions. We pilots are really a bunch of whiners at times...sad!
I am currently employed by SAA on the B738, based in Cape Town. In my opinion, the best flying job in the world.....if it wasn't for the rather disruptive restructuring process SAA is currently undergoing....AGAIN!!!
I have a well structured financial strategy which will enable me to retire in 17 years, age 55, based on my current salary. My career strategy is thus medium-long term, after which I would like to pursue other ventures which will most definitely include flying.
My wife does not work and we have two very young children.
What is life REALLY like in Dubai?
How is the cost and quality of living?
Do most wifes and kids adapt quickly?
What is a typical roster at EK?
How many days off, hours flown?
Please just give the facts without the emotions as I need to make probably the biggest decision in my and my loved one's life's.
Much appreciated
FWK
I am considering applying for a position at EK and need some honest advice and information. No whiners PLEASE!!!
Having just read the thread: Unofficial EK Poll, it stroke me that the comments are very similar to our cockpit discussions. We pilots are really a bunch of whiners at times...sad!
I am currently employed by SAA on the B738, based in Cape Town. In my opinion, the best flying job in the world.....if it wasn't for the rather disruptive restructuring process SAA is currently undergoing....AGAIN!!!
I have a well structured financial strategy which will enable me to retire in 17 years, age 55, based on my current salary. My career strategy is thus medium-long term, after which I would like to pursue other ventures which will most definitely include flying.
My wife does not work and we have two very young children.
What is life REALLY like in Dubai?
How is the cost and quality of living?
Do most wifes and kids adapt quickly?
What is a typical roster at EK?
How many days off, hours flown?
Please just give the facts without the emotions as I need to make probably the biggest decision in my and my loved one's life's.
Much appreciated
FWK
Last edited by FlingWingKing; 18th Sep 2007 at 09:32.
Join Date: Apr 2006
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You're right regarding the best job in the word, you do certainly do have it however you also have 2 chilren and a country that's sliding backwards just like Zim did.
What you have to consider is that when it all goes plop what do you do, do you have enough time for a DEC position around the world because if not you're in the pool with thousands of FO's.
PM me if you want more info.......good luck
What you have to consider is that when it all goes plop what do you do, do you have enough time for a DEC position around the world because if not you're in the pool with thousands of FO's.
PM me if you want more info.......good luck
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As is the case for any job or location. They all have their pros and cons.
You will have to weigh out this particular to you own personal situation.
You are fortunate that you have young children and are the ones that easily adapt.. I find that apart from the usual requirements , you usually find that sometimes the children can form the make or break decsion to make a move.
Being conversant in english your kids should be able to adapt to the UK system or if you prefer there is choice of the International Bacaulleratate (IB) sponsored by United Nation to provide for the internationally mobile family. You will find losts of SA teachers in Dubai expat schools.
Life style in Dubai is generally good , if you can get over the increasing traffic problems we are facing due to the daily influx of vehicles plying the dubai roads . A metro is due for use in late 2009 . Increasing use of Tolls looks the way the Road Transport Authority is going , although quite a few may argue that this has so far been unsuccessfull.
Cost of living is quite high amongst other GCC states . Starbucks coffee 15 Dirhams Big Mac meal 14 Dirhams , Generally complaints in the news paper that rentals on housing is out of control and has been eating into the paypacket of the expat population. Fortunately Emirates provides housing or a housing allowance if someone chooses to avail it. ( not recommended)
Cost of living is lower than Europe however if you are coming from SA or the US North America you may find Dubai a tad expensive.
If you are so inclined . Golf ,Sailing , Camping, Scuba Diving Wadi Bashing ( 4 WD in the Desert and Wadis) Beaches ( mostly accessed via a club membeship of buying on the day).are all available. Club access is subsidized via a the Emirates Pilots Club ( cost approx 50-100 Dirhams per month Single/FamilY) 1 US$ + 3.67 Dirhams Note EPC is a volunteer pilot run club.
Extra curricula activities for the kids are all available ( Ballet , cricket Rugby etc ) usuallyfor an extra fee.
In your case you are flying a 737 in SA. Working conditions on the Fleet are generally good . People are aware of the diversity on the flight deck. Over here in Dubai you will have an opportunity to fly one of the most modern fleet of aircraft . Non stop to New York on a 777-300Er or you may find doing a short turn around to DOHA or Muscat that are nominal 40 mins away. And anyting in between. Emirates has close to 80 destinations . Latest destinations Sao Paulo , Houston, Toranto, Newcastle etc. YOu can look to a minimum of 8-10 days off and if you are lucky at being a computer geek and you are top bid you can find yourself doing a couple of NewYorks and a Perth ( currenlty on the B777) and have 15 days off and some of those days off with a string of 7 days . Similar stories on the airbus if you are on the A 340.
Command prospects . Are bright ( you may find other may not agree) as compared to many other carriers. You will find quite a few posts regarding delayed commands. They will be due to commands being delayed due to DEC or Fast track commands . So depending where you sit in the eligibility criteria and which fleet you are on ,you can see a B777 first officer getting his upgrade letter in a year and if you are on the Airbus you can find your upgrade as late as 4 years . This can and will change in favour of the airbus fleet once the A380m starts joinig the fleet.
Emirates is currently reviewing it future Fleet requirements and should be deciding between the B787 and the A350XWB around 50 firm and 50 options .Also rumours for 20 B747-8 to cover the Dubai -Los Angeles/ San Fransisco route .
Emirates intends to become the largest "International Airline" in the coming years and expects to have a fleet of 150+ wide bodies in the not to distant future ( 2015).
You can look foward to a future that is Secure in the knowledge that the airline has had only one year that it has not been profitable since inception. A mangement that has largely stayed the same . A city state that is supportive of Emirates future objectives . An environment that is safe and secure for you and your family.
The cons are that you may have some adjustment to make living and working in an enviroment that you may not have experienced. Over 75 nationalities . Weather and pollution can sometimes get to you. Traffic is an issue with regards to delays and can be dangerous on most of the highways due to overspeeding. Apart from this there the issue of inflation and its recognition of the this by Emirates as currenlty the pay rise we recently had did not fully cover or meet the publicly accepted 9.5% inflation level.Due to some of these issue we have had quite a few pilots leaving Emirates.
I hope that gives you some idea. I will leave it to the others on the Forum to provide you futher insight to EK and Dubai. You will have to decide how you look at the Glass "Half full or Half empty"
Regards
BM
You will have to weigh out this particular to you own personal situation.
You are fortunate that you have young children and are the ones that easily adapt.. I find that apart from the usual requirements , you usually find that sometimes the children can form the make or break decsion to make a move.
Being conversant in english your kids should be able to adapt to the UK system or if you prefer there is choice of the International Bacaulleratate (IB) sponsored by United Nation to provide for the internationally mobile family. You will find losts of SA teachers in Dubai expat schools.
Life style in Dubai is generally good , if you can get over the increasing traffic problems we are facing due to the daily influx of vehicles plying the dubai roads . A metro is due for use in late 2009 . Increasing use of Tolls looks the way the Road Transport Authority is going , although quite a few may argue that this has so far been unsuccessfull.
Cost of living is quite high amongst other GCC states . Starbucks coffee 15 Dirhams Big Mac meal 14 Dirhams , Generally complaints in the news paper that rentals on housing is out of control and has been eating into the paypacket of the expat population. Fortunately Emirates provides housing or a housing allowance if someone chooses to avail it. ( not recommended)
Cost of living is lower than Europe however if you are coming from SA or the US North America you may find Dubai a tad expensive.
If you are so inclined . Golf ,Sailing , Camping, Scuba Diving Wadi Bashing ( 4 WD in the Desert and Wadis) Beaches ( mostly accessed via a club membeship of buying on the day).are all available. Club access is subsidized via a the Emirates Pilots Club ( cost approx 50-100 Dirhams per month Single/FamilY) 1 US$ + 3.67 Dirhams Note EPC is a volunteer pilot run club.
Extra curricula activities for the kids are all available ( Ballet , cricket Rugby etc ) usuallyfor an extra fee.
In your case you are flying a 737 in SA. Working conditions on the Fleet are generally good . People are aware of the diversity on the flight deck. Over here in Dubai you will have an opportunity to fly one of the most modern fleet of aircraft . Non stop to New York on a 777-300Er or you may find doing a short turn around to DOHA or Muscat that are nominal 40 mins away. And anyting in between. Emirates has close to 80 destinations . Latest destinations Sao Paulo , Houston, Toranto, Newcastle etc. YOu can look to a minimum of 8-10 days off and if you are lucky at being a computer geek and you are top bid you can find yourself doing a couple of NewYorks and a Perth ( currenlty on the B777) and have 15 days off and some of those days off with a string of 7 days . Similar stories on the airbus if you are on the A 340.
Command prospects . Are bright ( you may find other may not agree) as compared to many other carriers. You will find quite a few posts regarding delayed commands. They will be due to commands being delayed due to DEC or Fast track commands . So depending where you sit in the eligibility criteria and which fleet you are on ,you can see a B777 first officer getting his upgrade letter in a year and if you are on the Airbus you can find your upgrade as late as 4 years . This can and will change in favour of the airbus fleet once the A380m starts joinig the fleet.
Emirates is currently reviewing it future Fleet requirements and should be deciding between the B787 and the A350XWB around 50 firm and 50 options .Also rumours for 20 B747-8 to cover the Dubai -Los Angeles/ San Fransisco route .
Emirates intends to become the largest "International Airline" in the coming years and expects to have a fleet of 150+ wide bodies in the not to distant future ( 2015).
You can look foward to a future that is Secure in the knowledge that the airline has had only one year that it has not been profitable since inception. A mangement that has largely stayed the same . A city state that is supportive of Emirates future objectives . An environment that is safe and secure for you and your family.
The cons are that you may have some adjustment to make living and working in an enviroment that you may not have experienced. Over 75 nationalities . Weather and pollution can sometimes get to you. Traffic is an issue with regards to delays and can be dangerous on most of the highways due to overspeeding. Apart from this there the issue of inflation and its recognition of the this by Emirates as currenlty the pay rise we recently had did not fully cover or meet the publicly accepted 9.5% inflation level.Due to some of these issue we have had quite a few pilots leaving Emirates.
I hope that gives you some idea. I will leave it to the others on the Forum to provide you futher insight to EK and Dubai. You will have to decide how you look at the Glass "Half full or Half empty"
Regards
BM
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BM very good post.
Crew planners / Fleet Man's are saying all upgrades 3years 2 months by the end of 08( more then likely the 08- spring 09 plan on the portal). I think there is 240 upgrades planned until spring of 09 100 - 777 140 - 330 so I would not say 777 fo's are going to be much faster if they were to join now.
Crew planners / Fleet Man's are saying all upgrades 3years 2 months by the end of 08( more then likely the 08- spring 09 plan on the portal). I think there is 240 upgrades planned until spring of 09 100 - 777 140 - 330 so I would not say 777 fo's are going to be much faster if they were to join now.
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Very good post BM.
I think it all comes down to a lifestyle choice and the sacrifices you are willing to make to advance your career.I believe on a purely lifestyle choice and from what you state I think you should stay where you are.Most Africans are getting itchy feet and its basically about Dubai.Things like the weather,unsafe roads,rising costs of living and the worries about what your kids will turn out like being raised in the plastic Dubai environment.Its far better to be in your home country as a part of society than to be an expat with no safety net.
I think it all comes down to a lifestyle choice and the sacrifices you are willing to make to advance your career.I believe on a purely lifestyle choice and from what you state I think you should stay where you are.Most Africans are getting itchy feet and its basically about Dubai.Things like the weather,unsafe roads,rising costs of living and the worries about what your kids will turn out like being raised in the plastic Dubai environment.Its far better to be in your home country as a part of society than to be an expat with no safety net.
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If you are leaving SA (not SAA) for the following reasons:
1. Direct threat of crime on your family.
2. You can not find a flying job in SA.
3. You need a new start for some serious reason.
.....then leave and join EK.
3 ex-SAA guys are leaving EK to return to SA to fly for new/ low cost airline.
These guys were training (1 CRM) captains earning 40000 basic + 11800 housing (1 lived out) + 7400 (training pay for 2).
So ask this: A senior trainer clearing Dhs63000 (126000 Rand) leaves EK, to go to SA for 40000 Rand /month?
You will join on half that as a newbie. That is what you already earn in SAA after 10 years NETT!
When you put 2 or more ex-SAA, EK guys together. After the 3rd beer they talk about the good guys in SAA and how they miss the SAA days.
Financially you will be better off in the long run, if you stay in SAA.
You will join EK at # 2000. That means there must be 4000 pilots for you to be near a command. You do the math.
My advice is stay in SA. Maybe leave SAA if things go bad, but stay at home. In your own house, with REAL friends and family around you. Enjoy a civilized country. I know, even a 3rd world place like SA, makes this place look like a feudal system.
Stay where you have legal rights, a union, good weather and your children have an identity.
Enjoy the 4 seasons, rugby, and good braais.
You can work until you are 65 without uprooting your family.
Enjoy the company and good working environment you have. With some of the best guys in aviation in the world.
I can say all these things on PRUNE, but face to face I will tell you my net worth and salary in rands. How most ex-SAA guys are 340/777 trainers. 15 years ahead of their time in SAA.
But in my heart only I know the truth: I SHOULD NEVER HAVE LEFT SAA!!!!
1. Direct threat of crime on your family.
2. You can not find a flying job in SA.
3. You need a new start for some serious reason.
.....then leave and join EK.
3 ex-SAA guys are leaving EK to return to SA to fly for new/ low cost airline.
These guys were training (1 CRM) captains earning 40000 basic + 11800 housing (1 lived out) + 7400 (training pay for 2).
So ask this: A senior trainer clearing Dhs63000 (126000 Rand) leaves EK, to go to SA for 40000 Rand /month?
You will join on half that as a newbie. That is what you already earn in SAA after 10 years NETT!
When you put 2 or more ex-SAA, EK guys together. After the 3rd beer they talk about the good guys in SAA and how they miss the SAA days.
Financially you will be better off in the long run, if you stay in SAA.
You will join EK at # 2000. That means there must be 4000 pilots for you to be near a command. You do the math.
My advice is stay in SA. Maybe leave SAA if things go bad, but stay at home. In your own house, with REAL friends and family around you. Enjoy a civilized country. I know, even a 3rd world place like SA, makes this place look like a feudal system.
Stay where you have legal rights, a union, good weather and your children have an identity.
Enjoy the 4 seasons, rugby, and good braais.
You can work until you are 65 without uprooting your family.
Enjoy the company and good working environment you have. With some of the best guys in aviation in the world.
I can say all these things on PRUNE, but face to face I will tell you my net worth and salary in rands. How most ex-SAA guys are 340/777 trainers. 15 years ahead of their time in SAA.
But in my heart only I know the truth: I SHOULD NEVER HAVE LEFT SAA!!!!
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Just a correction to kokkos's post. 1 out of the 3 guys left to go back, he spent over 10 years here as a single guy, he really doesn't need the cash, as for the other 2, they still labour on.
What the guy needs here is factual advise and not emotional, this is a big step for him. A simple fact and observation is that he can read and write in English, saves us from having to do Portugese lessons!!!!!
Very good post by BM
What the guy needs here is factual advise and not emotional, this is a big step for him. A simple fact and observation is that he can read and write in English, saves us from having to do Portugese lessons!!!!!
Very good post by BM
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Thank you all
To each and everybody who posted a reply or send me a PM.....THANX
Bigmoutain, your excelent post swung the scales towards a move to EK
.
I had hoped to attend the roadshow in Cape Town today, but have to fly and would thus not be able to hand in an application.
How can I secure an interview? I have submitted my online application. Do I now just wait for them to come back to me, or is it adviseble to e-mail Donna Rawson to inform her of my interest?
On the interview point: any advice regarding this?
I am one of those chaps who always sees the glass as half full. Having married an ex Zimbabwean, I think I will not have to do a lot of convining. However, I am planning a trip to Dubai with the family in November to go see first hand what things are like there.
Would I be able to meet with some of you for a "tour", or could some of your wifes take my wife and kids around town to some of the venues they normally attend?
I would appreciate any information regarding accomodation, car hire etc.
Once again, thank you all for the great advice
Bigmoutain, your excelent post swung the scales towards a move to EK
. I had hoped to attend the roadshow in Cape Town today, but have to fly and would thus not be able to hand in an application.
How can I secure an interview? I have submitted my online application. Do I now just wait for them to come back to me, or is it adviseble to e-mail Donna Rawson to inform her of my interest?
On the interview point: any advice regarding this?
I am one of those chaps who always sees the glass as half full. Having married an ex Zimbabwean, I think I will not have to do a lot of convining. However, I am planning a trip to Dubai with the family in November to go see first hand what things are like there.
Would I be able to meet with some of you for a "tour", or could some of your wifes take my wife and kids around town to some of the venues they normally attend?
I would appreciate any information regarding accomodation, car hire etc.
Once again, thank you all for the great advice
