Emirates - New Conditions
Join Date: Sep 1999
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Muttley, you should be well aware of how the EK accom dept works or doesn't work for some.
The reasons for leaving EK accom are many and varied. 4 or 5 years ago you could get good accom for what they offered and then you would not have to deal with those a----holes again.
In the last three years the cost of a villa in Dubai has increased by more than 100% and the allowance by about 20%. Reasonable 4 bedroom villas in Al-saffa area are now over 200,000AED. + 20000 for services, meadows, ranches are all the same..
EK allowance about 125000AED.
Don't even try to ask to come back to eK accom, you will get an ass kicking.
I will leave when I can and accom will be one of the main reasons. Shame really, but what to do...
The reasons for leaving EK accom are many and varied. 4 or 5 years ago you could get good accom for what they offered and then you would not have to deal with those a----holes again.
In the last three years the cost of a villa in Dubai has increased by more than 100% and the allowance by about 20%. Reasonable 4 bedroom villas in Al-saffa area are now over 200,000AED. + 20000 for services, meadows, ranches are all the same..
EK allowance about 125000AED.
Don't even try to ask to come back to eK accom, you will get an ass kicking.
I will leave when I can and accom will be one of the main reasons. Shame really, but what to do...
Last edited by ShockWave; 17th Jan 2007 at 07:51.
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I agree that this is not the perfect answer to our problems. There are a number of issues that are not addressed. Perhaps we should look at it as the first step though. If this doesn't stop or slow down resignations and increase applications, maybe another change is in store.
To be brutally honest, I was looking around, but found nothing that suited, so would have stayed with the normal 3 percent pay increase. I am now going to be getting an average of Dhs7000 extra a month. 7000 more than I expected, so I will say thanks for that.
Will it stop me looking? No. Will it make it more difficult for me to motivate a change? Yes. Goal achieved for EK? Maybe.
Everyone of us has extremely personal reasons for being here. Not one of us is exactly the same. I don't think this offer is perfect, but it certainly helps; and for that I accept it with thanks.
To be brutally honest, I was looking around, but found nothing that suited, so would have stayed with the normal 3 percent pay increase. I am now going to be getting an average of Dhs7000 extra a month. 7000 more than I expected, so I will say thanks for that.
Will it stop me looking? No. Will it make it more difficult for me to motivate a change? Yes. Goal achieved for EK? Maybe.
Everyone of us has extremely personal reasons for being here. Not one of us is exactly the same. I don't think this offer is perfect, but it certainly helps; and for that I accept it with thanks.
Last edited by Yossarian; 16th Jan 2007 at 16:08. Reason: Piss poor spelling
Join Date: May 2005
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THERE IS NO PAYRISE!!
Its simple, we all know that the record profits again this year will mean another totally lied about 1/5th of the profit shared out.
Increasing profits year on year made 10 weeks become 4? This isn't even a backpayment, its probably this years 1/5th profit share payment reduced again, to not alot, so as to pay for the marginal increase from May. THEY ARE PAYING US OUT OF THE REAL PROFIT SHARE INTO THIS YEAR AS FLIGHT PAY!! AND THEY THINK WE BELIVE EM 
Its simple, we all know that the record profits again this year will mean another totally lied about 1/5th of the profit shared out.
Increasing profits year on year made 10 weeks become 4? This isn't even a backpayment, its probably this years 1/5th profit share payment reduced again, to not alot, so as to pay for the marginal increase from May. THEY ARE PAYING US OUT OF THE REAL PROFIT SHARE INTO THIS YEAR AS FLIGHT PAY!! AND THEY THINK WE BELIVE EM
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What about quality of life?!!!
There are so many months with minimum legal days off, manual intervention in the rosters, no time off to be with family and see friends, only recovery! i hope this attracts more people as we need them to try and improve life style,but i don't think this announcement will be enough to help.
if this had been with immediate effect, then see what happens by April/May, then this would be more encouraging that they are taking this shortage of crew seriously and would have the time to tweek it at the normal time of announcements...........but
Why not start giving back a little of what has been taken away over the past few years, just throwing a little more money at the problem will not solve it, we still need to live a normal life!!!
gee...............
if this had been with immediate effect, then see what happens by April/May, then this would be more encouraging that they are taking this shortage of crew seriously and would have the time to tweek it at the normal time of announcements...........but
Why not start giving back a little of what has been taken away over the past few years, just throwing a little more money at the problem will not solve it, we still need to live a normal life!!!
gee...............
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I just wonder...........
I just wonder how many pilots in EK actually made more money or lived better lives before they came to EK to complain about the new pay raise
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HundredPercentPlease,
Just a couple of my own sums to help you along mate,
My basic today= 20800dhs + 9% = 22672 dhs basic (£3240 @ 7dhs/£)
75hrs @ 35dhs=2625dhs
Currency Protection against GBP approx 1800dhs with the % increase
Grand Total = 27000 dhs (£3900 NET)
Over time can boost this significantly ie. by the end of this month, I will have done 98 hours flying with 15 days off (2xJFK's 3xFRA's and 1 turnround). If this was transposed forward to June, this would equate to 33500 dhs or £4800 NET
I know for a fact that Easy do not pay more than £4k NET to SFO's (The captains only take home £500 more than that!!). And, yes a larger proportion of your salary is made up of productivity (read sector) pay than ours, so I guess you too are stuffed while on vacation/sick leave?
Not a snipe buddy, just a reality check on what you actually do earn compared to us (a significant pay rise coming from easy to here me thinks?)
Just a couple of my own sums to help you along mate,
My basic today= 20800dhs + 9% = 22672 dhs basic (£3240 @ 7dhs/£)
75hrs @ 35dhs=2625dhs
Currency Protection against GBP approx 1800dhs with the % increase
Grand Total = 27000 dhs (£3900 NET)
Over time can boost this significantly ie. by the end of this month, I will have done 98 hours flying with 15 days off (2xJFK's 3xFRA's and 1 turnround). If this was transposed forward to June, this would equate to 33500 dhs or £4800 NET
I know for a fact that Easy do not pay more than £4k NET to SFO's (The captains only take home £500 more than that!!). And, yes a larger proportion of your salary is made up of productivity (read sector) pay than ours, so I guess you too are stuffed while on vacation/sick leave?
Not a snipe buddy, just a reality check on what you actually do earn compared to us (a significant pay rise coming from easy to here me thinks?)
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These numbers include DECs, F/Os and junior Captains. Presumably there are others of the same background who are preparing to leave and others who although keen to move on will for personal reasons stick it out for longer.
And I doubt that this pay rise will reduce the outflow because in real terms local inflation and the continuing fall of the yankee dollar are still ahead. Never mind the growing problems of living in Dubai.
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So you "think" you had a pay rise!
Cost Neutral
"Accept with thanks" the fact that our overtime rules were changed. If the change was truly "cost neutral" then why do it? Makes no sense to do so, no manager would make a change like that without a saving. I know one thing for sure, we are all working much harder since the change occurred. That is more like a change in conditions, and for the worse. The overall savings must have been enormous. We've managed to get by with fewer pilots than the old regime required. Managed to alienate a lot of pilots in the meanwhile. So now that we (EK) have saved a pile of money, we can afford to give you a little bit back (because it is cost neutral). Only we'll give it back later (we've banked the savings). Why? Because rampant inflation means that the numbers might look similar but the VALUE is less. A lot less.
If you are reading this from outside Dubai then you don't really get it. And the posts made so far reveal your naivety. Unless of course you live in Zim!
The IMF noted in 2006 that inflation remained one of the largest challenges for the UAE economy. The IMF indicated shortcomings in the methodology used to compile CPI data, including outdated weightings, lack of imputations for missing data and different reference periods. IE lets hide the true rate of inflation.
The next time you get stopped for speeding on the SZR ask your police man how big his pay rise was. Single digits? No....
We didn't get 18. We got 6 and some flight pay (no PF, or end of service)
Government employees get whopper pay rises. We are not government employees:
Expatriates versus nationals
In the case of the GCC countries, it is important to note there is a difference in the inflation levels felt by nationals and foreigners. In the majority GCC countries, a number of benefits are provided to nationals. For example, UAE nationals are provided with land to build a house and can apply for a soft loan to finance the building of a house. Other differences include the fact that UAE nationals pay less for electricity than expatriates and are not charged for water.
If you don't like your apartment, you won't be given any land to build on. No, you'll have to shut up or move out. Most pilots are smart enough to know that land ownership is a pension in a world where pensions are worthless. If you want to buy, this place is not cheap, and the villas are not expected to last longer than 30 years (that may be optimistic).
We work hard. Make no bones about it. No pen pushing, penny counting office wallah I ever met understood how hard a roster was to LIVE through. Any roster is hard work, but add time zone changes and working mostly through the graveyard shift (any where near 4am on your body clock) and that that is truly hard.
MY FINAL WORD:
In its Cost of Living Survey, Mercer Human Resources Consulting place Dubai as the 25th most expensive city in the world in 2006, out of 144 cities ranked; Dubai's ranking jumped from 73rd position in 2005.
Unless your pay jumped that much also then you received NO real payrise. Don't look at Dubai through Europe tinted glasses.
"Accept with thanks" the fact that our overtime rules were changed. If the change was truly "cost neutral" then why do it? Makes no sense to do so, no manager would make a change like that without a saving. I know one thing for sure, we are all working much harder since the change occurred. That is more like a change in conditions, and for the worse. The overall savings must have been enormous. We've managed to get by with fewer pilots than the old regime required. Managed to alienate a lot of pilots in the meanwhile. So now that we (EK) have saved a pile of money, we can afford to give you a little bit back (because it is cost neutral). Only we'll give it back later (we've banked the savings). Why? Because rampant inflation means that the numbers might look similar but the VALUE is less. A lot less.
If you are reading this from outside Dubai then you don't really get it. And the posts made so far reveal your naivety. Unless of course you live in Zim!
The IMF noted in 2006 that inflation remained one of the largest challenges for the UAE economy. The IMF indicated shortcomings in the methodology used to compile CPI data, including outdated weightings, lack of imputations for missing data and different reference periods. IE lets hide the true rate of inflation.
The next time you get stopped for speeding on the SZR ask your police man how big his pay rise was. Single digits? No....
We didn't get 18. We got 6 and some flight pay (no PF, or end of service)
Government employees get whopper pay rises. We are not government employees:
Expatriates versus nationals
In the case of the GCC countries, it is important to note there is a difference in the inflation levels felt by nationals and foreigners. In the majority GCC countries, a number of benefits are provided to nationals. For example, UAE nationals are provided with land to build a house and can apply for a soft loan to finance the building of a house. Other differences include the fact that UAE nationals pay less for electricity than expatriates and are not charged for water.
If you don't like your apartment, you won't be given any land to build on. No, you'll have to shut up or move out. Most pilots are smart enough to know that land ownership is a pension in a world where pensions are worthless. If you want to buy, this place is not cheap, and the villas are not expected to last longer than 30 years (that may be optimistic).
We work hard. Make no bones about it. No pen pushing, penny counting office wallah I ever met understood how hard a roster was to LIVE through. Any roster is hard work, but add time zone changes and working mostly through the graveyard shift (any where near 4am on your body clock) and that that is truly hard.
MY FINAL WORD:
In its Cost of Living Survey, Mercer Human Resources Consulting place Dubai as the 25th most expensive city in the world in 2006, out of 144 cities ranked; Dubai's ranking jumped from 73rd position in 2005.
Unless your pay jumped that much also then you received NO real payrise. Don't look at Dubai through Europe tinted glasses.
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Don,
There are at least 50 FO's hired before the DEC debacle that are disadvantaged and will be quickly approaching four years to upgrade. A solid three years on the Boeing and no signs of slowing down. Good for them.. It's really two separate entities, until they actually transfer some bus captains over. Senoirity ?? Not in the dictionary over here. Cest la vie...
There are at least 50 FO's hired before the DEC debacle that are disadvantaged and will be quickly approaching four years to upgrade. A solid three years on the Boeing and no signs of slowing down. Good for them.. It's really two separate entities, until they actually transfer some bus captains over. Senoirity ?? Not in the dictionary over here. Cest la vie...
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I agree about the payrise , no matter how much is given the changes need to be made with:
1 duty hours (get s/os)
2 Basings, guys need a way out of this screwed up city
3 Commuting and jumpseats for pilots.
4 When i came here i thought i could stay for 20 years and retire, no more Im looking at 7 years and gone, I may even reduce it to 5 and no amount of salary increase will keep me here, I like the flying when its not at the limits , but I cant stand living in Dubai and I do not want my kids growing up here into their young adult life.
This is not all EKs fault but they need to address the fact that guys still want to work for them but not live in Dubai, its really the companys loss if the pilot moves to Korean or some other commuting job.
5 The F/os need to be catered for highly experienced guys on Airbus are denied commands while relatively low houred guys on the 777 are getting commands in 3 years.
This is not fair and every other airline cannot be wrong about transition upgrades. Unfortunately you have to spend money on training , cost cutting in that department is frought with danger.
6 well if no basings in 2 years goodbye EK............
1 duty hours (get s/os)
2 Basings, guys need a way out of this screwed up city
3 Commuting and jumpseats for pilots.
4 When i came here i thought i could stay for 20 years and retire, no more Im looking at 7 years and gone, I may even reduce it to 5 and no amount of salary increase will keep me here, I like the flying when its not at the limits , but I cant stand living in Dubai and I do not want my kids growing up here into their young adult life.
This is not all EKs fault but they need to address the fact that guys still want to work for them but not live in Dubai, its really the companys loss if the pilot moves to Korean or some other commuting job.
5 The F/os need to be catered for highly experienced guys on Airbus are denied commands while relatively low houred guys on the 777 are getting commands in 3 years.
This is not fair and every other airline cannot be wrong about transition upgrades. Unfortunately you have to spend money on training , cost cutting in that department is frought with danger.
6 well if no basings in 2 years goodbye EK............
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Agree with most of what is posted about the quantam and method of the pay-raise. 'Nuff said.
More to the point - how is this going to be tracked, managed and paid? Do swaps count for the 'basic' flight pay? Or will it be like overtime - rostered block only, unless called out?
This is the outfit that can't agree if we have flown 900 hours remember. Should be fun to watch.
More to the point - how is this going to be tracked, managed and paid? Do swaps count for the 'basic' flight pay? Or will it be like overtime - rostered block only, unless called out?
This is the outfit that can't agree if we have flown 900 hours remember. Should be fun to watch.
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Don't get fooled
Ok, I am 'pleased' with the improved conditions. At least, if I'm still here in May, still on the lookout...
First of all, it will improve our pay UP TO the threshold of 76hrs (78-76-73-70 depending on the month). Actually, the valuation of our overtime went down quite a bit... For me personally:
Before: 20860/month / 76hrs = 275dhs
So, I was paid (basic) to fly at 275dhs/hour. Overtime at 325dhs = 18% extra pay for your effort to work overtime. Not a big deal, but there is some appreciation...
Now (well, in may that is..) 22775/month/76hr = 300 dhs
On top of that, we get a 35dhs flightpay, so I am basically paid 335dhs/hour.
Since the overtime didn't change, I will still get 325dhs for overtime (the flightpay is not paid for overtime). So, in overtime, I will be paid less per hour than in basic. This is ridiculous...
Another Scam:
AAR points out how much per month Flight Pay you will get based on 75hrs. This is completely misleading. How many months do we actually fly nicely JUST up to the threshold? Personally, I got a few 50hr months (annual leave or sick) where we would LOOSE pay. On the other hand, all the other months I work my ass off, and fly between 80 and 95 hours, LOOSING out on the flightpay again for my overtime...
Best of all does it get for the company once you hit the 900 hour limit. So, now you have been working very hard for a year, mostly in overtime again... You can not fly anymore for a month, and they reward you by... NOT paying you for the hours you made in the months before to get them out of their problems..
So, to conclude, you will get a 18-19% payrise if you work every month just up to the threshold to exactly 900 hours/year.
For my personal roster, 2006, I would get paid exactly for 727 hours. So instead of a yearly pay of 12 x 20860 = 250320, I will get 12 x 22110 (I only used the 6%, the other 3% is contractual seniority pay) 265320 + 727 x 35 (25445) = 290765
I had around 130 hours of overtime, at 325 = 42250, which remain unchanged.
My payrise fo 2006 would have been 290765+42250 / 250320+42250 = 13.8%
This is suddenly a completely different picture. Less then 14% payrise... So this is probably just making up for the 'new' productivity pay introduced 2 years ago.
MR8
PS: Sorry for all the numbers, just trying to get a point over..
First of all, it will improve our pay UP TO the threshold of 76hrs (78-76-73-70 depending on the month). Actually, the valuation of our overtime went down quite a bit... For me personally:
Before: 20860/month / 76hrs = 275dhs
So, I was paid (basic) to fly at 275dhs/hour. Overtime at 325dhs = 18% extra pay for your effort to work overtime. Not a big deal, but there is some appreciation...
Now (well, in may that is..) 22775/month/76hr = 300 dhs
On top of that, we get a 35dhs flightpay, so I am basically paid 335dhs/hour.
Since the overtime didn't change, I will still get 325dhs for overtime (the flightpay is not paid for overtime). So, in overtime, I will be paid less per hour than in basic. This is ridiculous...
Another Scam:
AAR points out how much per month Flight Pay you will get based on 75hrs. This is completely misleading. How many months do we actually fly nicely JUST up to the threshold? Personally, I got a few 50hr months (annual leave or sick) where we would LOOSE pay. On the other hand, all the other months I work my ass off, and fly between 80 and 95 hours, LOOSING out on the flightpay again for my overtime...
Best of all does it get for the company once you hit the 900 hour limit. So, now you have been working very hard for a year, mostly in overtime again... You can not fly anymore for a month, and they reward you by... NOT paying you for the hours you made in the months before to get them out of their problems..
So, to conclude, you will get a 18-19% payrise if you work every month just up to the threshold to exactly 900 hours/year.
For my personal roster, 2006, I would get paid exactly for 727 hours. So instead of a yearly pay of 12 x 20860 = 250320, I will get 12 x 22110 (I only used the 6%, the other 3% is contractual seniority pay) 265320 + 727 x 35 (25445) = 290765
I had around 130 hours of overtime, at 325 = 42250, which remain unchanged.
My payrise fo 2006 would have been 290765+42250 / 250320+42250 = 13.8%
This is suddenly a completely different picture. Less then 14% payrise... So this is probably just making up for the 'new' productivity pay introduced 2 years ago.
MR8
PS: Sorry for all the numbers, just trying to get a point over..
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Once the emotive responses are done with and tempers have cooled somewhat, maybe it’s time to look at what’s really happened here.
1. Do the PowersThatBe recognise that something needs to be done to address the current situation?
- It would appear so – (and some would say: “not before time!!”)
2. What does this announcement really represent?
- An ambit offer, pared down to the absolute minimum those same PowersThatBe believe they can get away with.
3. Is it sufficient?
- While it’s certainly welcome, I don’t think the PowersThatBe really understand the depth – or breadth – of disillusionment and cynicism among the pilot group, especially the First Officers. It’s now a novelty to meet a happy FO, and if he is, you can almost guarantee he’s still in the ‘toy phase’, that first few months in the country.
I agree with the person who already said it above – it’s now gone well beyond ‘just’ a question of money.
4. Will this stem the rate of resignations?
- Perhaps a little, but in my opinion, not by much. Most looking to go elsewhere are weighing many other factors apart from money.
6. Will it increase the recruit base?
- Let’s be honest – yes. But much of this positive effect will be lost by the very negative message potential recruits will receive by word of mouth from friends and colleagues who are already here – and from sites like this.
EK will always attract applications from a wide range of wannabes, many with no shortage of skills and aptitude, but without the experience levels EK has to date been able to demand. And in the not so distant future, I suspect they may be forced to dip a little deeper into that wannabe pool than they have to date, which has all sorts of implications to the training that will have to be provided that until now, EK has got for free (even if they all too often make no use of it!!!).
7. What are some of the non monetary considerations that are weighing so heavily on people’s unhappiness levels?
- Some have been mentioned already. I can only mention the ones that impact on me.
Dubai simply isn’t what it used to be.
The traffic has become utterly horrendous. Mr Ed himself mentioned in his last missive to pilots that over the last twelve months, and extra 500,000 cars have been added to Dubai’s roads, (and God alone knows how many unregistered cars on top of that).
But it’s not just the quantity of traffic, but the two tier system of law enforcement (and not just on the roads) that prevails in Dubai. Many drivers operate their vehicles with utterly mind-boggling disregard for the most basic rules of commonsense survival, to the point where many of us now avoid using the roads as much as possible because we go in fear of our lives every time we step into our cars.
As an example far too close to home for comfort, many of us will be going to a memorial service on Thursday for the daughter of one of our senior pilots. She was killed in particularly grisly circumstances in a road accident a few days ago. At 20, she is the third young person from the same year from one Dubai high school to be killed on the roads in Dubai since they graduated – (and it’s worth noting that one of the other two dead from that same class was also an Emirates pilot’s daughter). Her 22 year old companion killed in the same accident last week is the second to die on Dubai roads from his year from the same school.
And it needs to be said that in most of these accidents, the major cause wasn’t the young kids speeding or doing something silly, but others, their elders, driving at ridiculous speeds in heavy traffic in built up areas.
Housing/rental, or the cost thereof. The subject’s been done to death, but it’s a huge factor to many here.
Basings. In the not so distant past, the Dubai economy was small and the financial input of the EK pilot group having their families in Dubai was a significant part of the local economy. Dubai has grown well past the point where the (even larger) EK pilot group has any real impact anymore.
In fact, the company has grown now to the point where another factor should be seen as having become more important: EK can no longer hope to get away with finding someone on leave in a distant port who is willing to bail the company out by operating a flight when someone goes sick downroute.
We need to start basing pilots, or failing that, (and maybe even better than basings), allowing a number of pilots to write their rosters from a designated outport. Of course it will make things more complicated for the schedulers, but it will save the company money and give it far more flexibility downroute when crews go out of hours or fall sick, Another huge factor, basing will retain for the company many pilots who are willing to remain in EK employment but are not willing to remain living in the ‘new’ Dubai.
8. Will they up the offer?
- I think they’ll have to, (or at least sweeten the deal with a few more lumps of sugar that won’t necessarily involve more money), if I’m right and the resignations continue and suitable recruits don’t appear in considerably larger numbers.
I’d also like to know the details of the new hourly flight pay. Will it apply to deadheading? Simulator? Groundschool?
1. Do the PowersThatBe recognise that something needs to be done to address the current situation?
- It would appear so – (and some would say: “not before time!!”)
2. What does this announcement really represent?
- An ambit offer, pared down to the absolute minimum those same PowersThatBe believe they can get away with.
3. Is it sufficient?
- While it’s certainly welcome, I don’t think the PowersThatBe really understand the depth – or breadth – of disillusionment and cynicism among the pilot group, especially the First Officers. It’s now a novelty to meet a happy FO, and if he is, you can almost guarantee he’s still in the ‘toy phase’, that first few months in the country.
I agree with the person who already said it above – it’s now gone well beyond ‘just’ a question of money.
4. Will this stem the rate of resignations?
- Perhaps a little, but in my opinion, not by much. Most looking to go elsewhere are weighing many other factors apart from money.
6. Will it increase the recruit base?
- Let’s be honest – yes. But much of this positive effect will be lost by the very negative message potential recruits will receive by word of mouth from friends and colleagues who are already here – and from sites like this.
EK will always attract applications from a wide range of wannabes, many with no shortage of skills and aptitude, but without the experience levels EK has to date been able to demand. And in the not so distant future, I suspect they may be forced to dip a little deeper into that wannabe pool than they have to date, which has all sorts of implications to the training that will have to be provided that until now, EK has got for free (even if they all too often make no use of it!!!).
7. What are some of the non monetary considerations that are weighing so heavily on people’s unhappiness levels?
- Some have been mentioned already. I can only mention the ones that impact on me.
Dubai simply isn’t what it used to be.
The traffic has become utterly horrendous. Mr Ed himself mentioned in his last missive to pilots that over the last twelve months, and extra 500,000 cars have been added to Dubai’s roads, (and God alone knows how many unregistered cars on top of that).
But it’s not just the quantity of traffic, but the two tier system of law enforcement (and not just on the roads) that prevails in Dubai. Many drivers operate their vehicles with utterly mind-boggling disregard for the most basic rules of commonsense survival, to the point where many of us now avoid using the roads as much as possible because we go in fear of our lives every time we step into our cars.
As an example far too close to home for comfort, many of us will be going to a memorial service on Thursday for the daughter of one of our senior pilots. She was killed in particularly grisly circumstances in a road accident a few days ago. At 20, she is the third young person from the same year from one Dubai high school to be killed on the roads in Dubai since they graduated – (and it’s worth noting that one of the other two dead from that same class was also an Emirates pilot’s daughter). Her 22 year old companion killed in the same accident last week is the second to die on Dubai roads from his year from the same school.
And it needs to be said that in most of these accidents, the major cause wasn’t the young kids speeding or doing something silly, but others, their elders, driving at ridiculous speeds in heavy traffic in built up areas.
Housing/rental, or the cost thereof. The subject’s been done to death, but it’s a huge factor to many here.
Basings. In the not so distant past, the Dubai economy was small and the financial input of the EK pilot group having their families in Dubai was a significant part of the local economy. Dubai has grown well past the point where the (even larger) EK pilot group has any real impact anymore.
In fact, the company has grown now to the point where another factor should be seen as having become more important: EK can no longer hope to get away with finding someone on leave in a distant port who is willing to bail the company out by operating a flight when someone goes sick downroute.
We need to start basing pilots, or failing that, (and maybe even better than basings), allowing a number of pilots to write their rosters from a designated outport. Of course it will make things more complicated for the schedulers, but it will save the company money and give it far more flexibility downroute when crews go out of hours or fall sick, Another huge factor, basing will retain for the company many pilots who are willing to remain in EK employment but are not willing to remain living in the ‘new’ Dubai.
8. Will they up the offer?
- I think they’ll have to, (or at least sweeten the deal with a few more lumps of sugar that won’t necessarily involve more money), if I’m right and the resignations continue and suitable recruits don’t appear in considerably larger numbers.
I’d also like to know the details of the new hourly flight pay. Will it apply to deadheading? Simulator? Groundschool?
Join Date: Sep 1999
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Well said Wiley!
On the point regarding resignations:
If you hand in your letter of resignation before the end of may, will they still pay you your proffit share?
On the point regarding resignations:
If you hand in your letter of resignation before the end of may, will they still pay you your proffit share?
Join Date: May 2002
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you will only get your profit share if you are still on the property at the time you get your May paycheck, i.e., you have to be on the payroll on May 26.., so resign no earlier than February 27...
...."check"!!! ...or is it "checked"? ...or "checks"?
...."check"!!! ...or is it "checked"? ...or "checks"?
Now the new info on the site says 20840 + 2625 (£3249) which I agree is about the same (once bonuses and shares are considered), but not enough to tempt me away from the left seat pay here.
I understand the reason people went to work in the sand in the past was because you earned a pile of cash, and so put up with the "oddities". If that was the case now, I'd go!
Join Date: Nov 2005
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The problem here is credibility. How on earth can management take us seriously when we complain about things like traffic. Will more money ease that inconvenience. Dubai is a growing city and like all growing cities it has its problems, traffic being but a part of this issue. Its tantamount to complaining of the rain back home, simply nonsense and it minimises our real complaint base.
Please lets leave that one alone.
The real issue’s are things like inflation, the hidden tax we pay and the fact that management is constantly eroding our non remunerative perks. There are issues with the amount of work we do and the impact that has on our family lives, rostering matters and the fact that at any stage management can call us in and read us the riot act without us having a leg to stand on.
We have a non-flying boss who has absolutely NO!!! idea with regards to what goes on in the modern flight deck but has the cheek and audacity to issue directives on how to fly and limit our influence in the flight deck with nonsense FCI’s.
A two tier legal system, enough said.
But please leave the traffic gripe alone.
Please lets leave that one alone.
The real issue’s are things like inflation, the hidden tax we pay and the fact that management is constantly eroding our non remunerative perks. There are issues with the amount of work we do and the impact that has on our family lives, rostering matters and the fact that at any stage management can call us in and read us the riot act without us having a leg to stand on.
We have a non-flying boss who has absolutely NO!!! idea with regards to what goes on in the modern flight deck but has the cheek and audacity to issue directives on how to fly and limit our influence in the flight deck with nonsense FCI’s.
A two tier legal system, enough said.
But please leave the traffic gripe alone.