pilot shortage
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pilot shortage
with all these airlines announcing the purchase of these new planes , i wonder where the crew will come from.will anybody and everybody be hired. which isnt a bad thing for the pilot community but could be a air safety disaster in the making.the training will get compromised to get the numbers going. the companies are forever trying to up the fdtl with the authorities and with the pilots as well by offering more money.
inexperienced and ill trained crew[including cabin crew] makes me think.....
inexperienced and ill trained crew[including cabin crew] makes me think.....
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got me thinking too. The rush to fill positions especially by 'locals' could leave a large experience gap. Even larger when you consider expedited commands!! 3000 hour pilot commanding an Airbus with a 300 hour F/O. Commander gained position because his fathers mates with the Chief Pilot, not because he was a legend pilot? This sorta promoting 'within' happens all too often in some places. Luckily for the travelling public and narrow minded authorities, aeroplanes are becoming more and more safer these daze.
When will this nonsense stop??
When will this nonsense stop??
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Left Wing
Please tell me you are not serious with your local comment. If you don't know the difference between the first world and the third world training yet you don't belong in a cockpit. The only place that our "locals" could get hired is in their own country, they would not have a prayer in Europe and you know that.
With the world opening up after the downturn I don't think anyone in the sand is worried about losing their job and the recent resigantions have proved that.
Please tell me you are not serious with your local comment. If you don't know the difference between the first world and the third world training yet you don't belong in a cockpit. The only place that our "locals" could get hired is in their own country, they would not have a prayer in Europe and you know that.
With the world opening up after the downturn I don't think anyone in the sand is worried about losing their job and the recent resigantions have proved that.
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As a airline pilot working for a third world company, flying with "locals" and a wide variety of expats with first world training and first world airline experience, both have been competent and safe but i would give the edge to the locals.
flying still reflects the individuals personality, if you are lazy and sloppy so would be said of your flying or anything else.
flying still reflects the individuals personality, if you are lazy and sloppy so would be said of your flying or anything else.
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If you have to give the edge to the locals why are there so many ex-pats working in the middle east and hardly any arabs working in the developed world? Yes anyone can be lazy but it is usually not the guy who has traveled to another country dragging his family with him to better himself and his situation.
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Rock!!
3000 hours can mean a miriad of life experiences for many different pilots in Emirates!! From flying inverted at 50 ft AGL in an A10 tank buster in the Gulf war staying inverted to navigate "SAFELY" at ultra low levels so as not to be pinged by missile fire ALL with the grand total of 400 hours at the grand old age of 20!!!!!! to flying a cessna 172 at 100km at 13000ft kicking parachutists out of the aircraft when pilot in command of that aircraft at the age of (you guessed it) 20!!
However through the twisted miles of time and eventual experience and the "so Called" even playing field banner that we are all recruited under at emirates! we are all subjected to this menatility of the more hours the better!!
so does the the Quality of the flying experience really matter at Emirates? "the worlds FOREVER almost nearly favourite airline" The answer is a resounding NO NO NO!!
A pilot wanting to join Emirates airlines as an FO/or DEC especially the latter can now join with lots of hours as a PILOT but maybe no LIFE experiences or (dare i say it) character building experiences to warrant the latter position!!
I am not saying that EX military pilots are primo pilotus extraordinare!! BUT surely a line has to be drawn as to what is exeptable for DEC and what sort of experience can be drawn from the huge pool of EXPERIENCED pilots who have been tried and tested and NOT!! been found wanting in the present "SO called experienced F/O pilot pool!!!!
Come on "FOREVER almost nearly managers of a self professed almost nearly worlds favourite airline""get your excreta in a pile and start to realize that experience is under your very large turned up noses!! and not in the streets of TIMBUK****ING TU!! PAY if you do want the REAL experience !! 50000plus with 60 space shuttle landings in a 3000ft airfield. But how do you attract those sort of people?? OH yes i know. 1)Offer them 3 pay scales higher than a present scale 1 captain "why not he's not gunna leave"
2)offer an outrageous sum of money to attract this EXPERIENCE!! (take OUTRAGEOUS how you want!!)
Tell everybody that we are in the process of cutting allowances AGAIN especially at Heathrow and Munich!! By the way this goes down REAL well with all the front line crews!! so dont worry your little cost cutting cotton socks about that one!!
Experience can only be truly measured by how an individual performs over a progressive period of time and can not be measured by XXXXXX number of hours from an outside source and be given a position as commander of our companies' aircraft simply because of this "QUANTITY" criteria.
morale within this company is already waning, motivation is at an alltime lowest!! Hence the requirement for the TD purser letter (a pep me up would be better than heads will roll letter) but this is a sidestep!!
Motivation,inspiration and a desire to succeed are key elements for ANY i repeat ANY (starting to sound like my company notams!)
employees,for long term success of a company.
One thought before i get off the soap box!!
"PAY PEANUTS GET MONKEYS" personally i prefer to paid in £, AUS$,US$,EURO.
BUT
KEEP DISCOVERING
3000 hours can mean a miriad of life experiences for many different pilots in Emirates!! From flying inverted at 50 ft AGL in an A10 tank buster in the Gulf war staying inverted to navigate "SAFELY" at ultra low levels so as not to be pinged by missile fire ALL with the grand total of 400 hours at the grand old age of 20!!!!!! to flying a cessna 172 at 100km at 13000ft kicking parachutists out of the aircraft when pilot in command of that aircraft at the age of (you guessed it) 20!!
However through the twisted miles of time and eventual experience and the "so Called" even playing field banner that we are all recruited under at emirates! we are all subjected to this menatility of the more hours the better!!
so does the the Quality of the flying experience really matter at Emirates? "the worlds FOREVER almost nearly favourite airline" The answer is a resounding NO NO NO!!
A pilot wanting to join Emirates airlines as an FO/or DEC especially the latter can now join with lots of hours as a PILOT but maybe no LIFE experiences or (dare i say it) character building experiences to warrant the latter position!!
I am not saying that EX military pilots are primo pilotus extraordinare!! BUT surely a line has to be drawn as to what is exeptable for DEC and what sort of experience can be drawn from the huge pool of EXPERIENCED pilots who have been tried and tested and NOT!! been found wanting in the present "SO called experienced F/O pilot pool!!!!
Come on "FOREVER almost nearly managers of a self professed almost nearly worlds favourite airline""get your excreta in a pile and start to realize that experience is under your very large turned up noses!! and not in the streets of TIMBUK****ING TU!! PAY if you do want the REAL experience !! 50000plus with 60 space shuttle landings in a 3000ft airfield. But how do you attract those sort of people?? OH yes i know. 1)Offer them 3 pay scales higher than a present scale 1 captain "why not he's not gunna leave"
2)offer an outrageous sum of money to attract this EXPERIENCE!! (take OUTRAGEOUS how you want!!)
Tell everybody that we are in the process of cutting allowances AGAIN especially at Heathrow and Munich!! By the way this goes down REAL well with all the front line crews!! so dont worry your little cost cutting cotton socks about that one!!
Experience can only be truly measured by how an individual performs over a progressive period of time and can not be measured by XXXXXX number of hours from an outside source and be given a position as commander of our companies' aircraft simply because of this "QUANTITY" criteria.
morale within this company is already waning, motivation is at an alltime lowest!! Hence the requirement for the TD purser letter (a pep me up would be better than heads will roll letter) but this is a sidestep!!
Motivation,inspiration and a desire to succeed are key elements for ANY i repeat ANY (starting to sound like my company notams!)
employees,for long term success of a company.
One thought before i get off the soap box!!
"PAY PEANUTS GET MONKEYS" personally i prefer to paid in £, AUS$,US$,EURO.
BUT
KEEP DISCOVERING
Last edited by RINGAdingding; 18th Jun 2005 at 01:31.
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Hey Ringa,
Its funny to watch how people jump to conclusions.
If you read my post carefully, it expresses (or tries too) my saftey concern of a 3000 hour pilot gaining his command on a large passenger jet aircraft purely because his or her dad knows someones uncle that is a Chief Pilot blah blah blah and not based on merit.
Flying skills 'to die for' so to speak!!
Now couple that with a relatively inexperienced F/O, 300 hours can be used as a yard stick in this case, with an inexperienced Captain, and Shazzam, you have an inexperienced flight deck!
Other than that, I agree with what you are trying to say.
Its funny to watch how people jump to conclusions.
If you read my post carefully, it expresses (or tries too) my saftey concern of a 3000 hour pilot gaining his command on a large passenger jet aircraft purely because his or her dad knows someones uncle that is a Chief Pilot blah blah blah and not based on merit.
Flying skills 'to die for' so to speak!!
Now couple that with a relatively inexperienced F/O, 300 hours can be used as a yard stick in this case, with an inexperienced Captain, and Shazzam, you have an inexperienced flight deck!
Other than that, I agree with what you are trying to say.
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Hello Ringa,
Since you seem to be in the know as far as EK recruitment is concerned, what do you think EK is looking for in a pilot to consider him for employment? Not only hours do not matter but the quality of experience, nor the life experience does not seem to matter. I can tell you that from personal experience. Back to the original thread, hopefully time is coming, when high houred, worldwide experienced and mature personality F/Os will finally get their chance for the left seat, because nowadays it seems it would be much easier for an "alien" to get a job in the state department, than an F/O getting his long deserved upgrade, in any third world country start-up airline...
Since you seem to be in the know as far as EK recruitment is concerned, what do you think EK is looking for in a pilot to consider him for employment? Not only hours do not matter but the quality of experience, nor the life experience does not seem to matter. I can tell you that from personal experience. Back to the original thread, hopefully time is coming, when high houred, worldwide experienced and mature personality F/Os will finally get their chance for the left seat, because nowadays it seems it would be much easier for an "alien" to get a job in the state department, than an F/O getting his long deserved upgrade, in any third world country start-up airline...
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Attention Ringa
I am quietly amused as to your point in bashing low hour pilots with near death experience flying with 3000 hour crews who have never even seen the a** end of flying into gale force winds landing a 200 ton aeroplane on the numbers. I really wonder what kind of experience airlines like EK or the lot are looking for?
I've had many good mates turned down which is strange.
Makes you think that when an applicant with sooo much more experience than their rater tends to intimidate himself into the "we're sorry, you were not successfull" rubbish bin. That is why the good guys go elswhere while the so so's join the sand pit......
I am quietly amused as to your point in bashing low hour pilots with near death experience flying with 3000 hour crews who have never even seen the a** end of flying into gale force winds landing a 200 ton aeroplane on the numbers. I really wonder what kind of experience airlines like EK or the lot are looking for?
I've had many good mates turned down which is strange.
Makes you think that when an applicant with sooo much more experience than their rater tends to intimidate himself into the "we're sorry, you were not successfull" rubbish bin. That is why the good guys go elswhere while the so so's join the sand pit......
