Emirates T and C changes
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The rise in resignations will snowball even further if 330/777 Decs show up:
There has to be transition upgrades and if 3 years has been clicked over a course date should be given , even if it is six months away.
Is it really that hard ?
Unfortunately the way they are opererating a lot of loyalty is being lost throughout, guys who would have stayed here till 60 will always be on the edge of there seat and looking for better options .
Its sad Emirates has come to this, just another contract job.
There has to be transition upgrades and if 3 years has been clicked over a course date should be given , even if it is six months away.
Is it really that hard ?
Unfortunately the way they are opererating a lot of loyalty is being lost throughout, guys who would have stayed here till 60 will always be on the edge of there seat and looking for better options .
Its sad Emirates has come to this, just another contract job.
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I just got back from my leave (I know you guys missed me) and come to find out that they hired 12 Airbus DEC's and 12 B-777 DEC's while I was gone. What the hell, over? I must admit this is just one pilots opinion and most decidedly rumour. I thought those tactics were gone. What happened and is it true? If it is true this must end but I have to admit how do we as a pilot group stop it without submitting our resignations.
Keep Discovering!
Keep Discovering!
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LHR Rain is a wind up merchant.
I dont think his comments on this thread or any other contain any substance whatsoever. Granted this is a rumour network, but there is a difference between rumour and fabrication. I think LHR specialises in the latter.
If there has been that many DEC's hired or the 20 resignations last week that he mentions on another thread, then the word would be all over the street, not on prune.
I dont think his comments on this thread or any other contain any substance whatsoever. Granted this is a rumour network, but there is a difference between rumour and fabrication. I think LHR specialises in the latter.
If there has been that many DEC's hired or the 20 resignations last week that he mentions on another thread, then the word would be all over the street, not on prune.
This is serious news if it is true, i dont think you are correct.
But i have heard a lot of DECs are going on A310 and have airbus and boeing ratings and will be moved to mainline in around 1 year , so the DECs are filtering via the 310 .
How can these guys think they can hide things from us is unbelievable.
But i have heard a lot of DECs are going on A310 and have airbus and boeing ratings and will be moved to mainline in around 1 year , so the DECs are filtering via the 310 .
How can these guys think they can hide things from us is unbelievable.
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turtleneck, agree with your comments. Interesting thing is though that the EK ad on Flight jobs website for 310 captains indicates a 12 month contract. So is Rambo onto something? Who knows. We aren't going to hear about it until after it happens, because it is our job to keep discovering!
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You are right it was just roumour like I admitted on another thread but there is some substance because come to find out we have A-310 DECs all over the place. Maybe that is what they were talking about on the flight down from the rainny island.
Also talking to a friend, a 777 DEC just moved in next door to him and he just started about 10 days ago. Is this true? Where does it end?
EK needs more pilots like MR8and to get rid of Bird On. I don't think that Bird On gets out of bed in the morning without the okay from the company he is that insecure.
Also talking to a friend, a 777 DEC just moved in next door to him and he just started about 10 days ago. Is this true? Where does it end?
EK needs more pilots like MR8and to get rid of Bird On. I don't think that Bird On gets out of bed in the morning without the okay from the company he is that insecure.
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There are currently 3 dec's for the 310 in class, which is not exactly what I would call "DEC's all over the place". (LHR Rain you will never learn will you son)!
I saw one of the 777 FCTI's last night and I asked him if we had any DEC'S in class for either the 330 or 777 and he said "hell no".
Regards,
330 Man
I saw one of the 777 FCTI's last night and I asked him if we had any DEC'S in class for either the 330 or 777 and he said "hell no".
Regards,
330 Man
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In my book 3 DEC is all over the place. That means for you 330 man that it is 3 too many. If you like the DECs good on you mate but most of the FOs at EK don't like it one bit. Those captian slots on the 310 could be for the FO here already.
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LHR Rain,
Finally you and I agree on something. Three is indeed 3 too many. I do think though that ALL of the F/O's do not like it. We all have to keep in mind it is not the DEC's fault, but the companies. I blame no one for taking a Captains job here, I blame the company. The DEC program has been a disaster from the beginning. It is typical Emirates: We always try to reinvent the wheel, and our finished wheel is always square, and never rolls.
I think it is the OZ factor! (that will rile someone)!
Regards,
330 Man
Finally you and I agree on something. Three is indeed 3 too many. I do think though that ALL of the F/O's do not like it. We all have to keep in mind it is not the DEC's fault, but the companies. I blame no one for taking a Captains job here, I blame the company. The DEC program has been a disaster from the beginning. It is typical Emirates: We always try to reinvent the wheel, and our finished wheel is always square, and never rolls.
I think it is the OZ factor! (that will rile someone)!
Regards,
330 Man
330 man,
Can you explain this OZ factor for me please?
Don
Can you explain this OZ factor for me please?
Don
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330 Man
Yes we do agree on some things including the Aussie factor here at EK. What they do in the cockpit goes beyond the mim. and might even cause FOs to tune out while they go on and on about briefings, wx, airport conditions, pay conditions, work enviroment, mangement etc etc. There logic is why say something in 2 sentences when you can say it it 7 sentences.
But having said that the problems at EK go way above the Aussie factor that you metion. Mike O'Grady is the top Aussie here and I don't think he is responsible for the DECs or T&C changes and overall low moral.
Maybe we can agree on more in the future since we are such a roll!
Yes we do agree on some things including the Aussie factor here at EK. What they do in the cockpit goes beyond the mim. and might even cause FOs to tune out while they go on and on about briefings, wx, airport conditions, pay conditions, work enviroment, mangement etc etc. There logic is why say something in 2 sentences when you can say it it 7 sentences.
But having said that the problems at EK go way above the Aussie factor that you metion. Mike O'Grady is the top Aussie here and I don't think he is responsible for the DECs or T&C changes and overall low moral.
Maybe we can agree on more in the future since we are such a roll!
Thread Starter
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Its fair to say that DEC's at EK are definitely a poor attempt at mitigating the affects of the recent changes to our T and C's----- a resultant loss of desirable pilots applying for positions and the loss of qualified and experienced pilots at an alarming rate.
Even 'Bird On', in spite of his obvious alterior motives, might agree that the present policy will have disastrous long term affects for EK. And if he doesn't agree then he is truly lacking as a human being. This is made quite clear with his ridiculous comments wrt being a 'patient F/O', 'things at EK are prospering' and 'all good things come to those who wait' rhetoric. He may continue to talk up the good life at EK with hopes of attracting desirable pilots but i believe that those considering uprooting families to come to EK, should be given the entire truth before making such a decision. His attempts at trapping fellow pilots into something without full disclosure is devious and self-serving. And believe me, i want pilots applying to Emirates as it will ensure the success of this airline and thereby my career. Yet unlike Bird On, I refuse to mislead.
I have to state that I do not hold anything against DEC's. I place no blame upon them and treat them with respect. I entirely place the blame for this misguided policy on Emirates management. In fact i find it disturbing that some of these DEC's are absolutely pathetic in their primary job of being a safe and effective captain. Some of these guys are stellar captains and would be an attibrute to any airline but its entirely correct in stating that some of these pilots are way out of their element. I have seldom seen such poor airmanship and lack of knowledge regarding SOP's, TR avoidance, crew cooperation, fuel saving measures, as I have seen from some DEC's at EK. That is a sad reflection on the DEC policy at EK.
Even if all the DEC's were stellar captains I still believe the policy is flawed. It promotes dissention amongst the pilot group and rewards the ill-advised policies of managers. There is absolutely no reason why EK could not promote from within. This was the most desirable pilot job as little as 3 years ago....... in the entire world. Now, it is only desirable for those with a marked decrease in experience and training as compared to those applying in the past.
This policy must be axed and the sooner the better. And the only way that there is any hope of having this airline continue to prosper will be to completely review the recent decisions regarding T and C's. Pls go back and review the policy changes I have listed at the beginning of this thread, that have occured in the past year. Even the likes of Bird On will have to agree, this airline is pointed in the wrong direction wrt our careers and it is all in the name of profit. Too bad the managers can't see beyond a couple of months and realize that profit will suffer immensely due to these changes. Sometimes i wonder if it all comes down to jealously.
Even 'Bird On', in spite of his obvious alterior motives, might agree that the present policy will have disastrous long term affects for EK. And if he doesn't agree then he is truly lacking as a human being. This is made quite clear with his ridiculous comments wrt being a 'patient F/O', 'things at EK are prospering' and 'all good things come to those who wait' rhetoric. He may continue to talk up the good life at EK with hopes of attracting desirable pilots but i believe that those considering uprooting families to come to EK, should be given the entire truth before making such a decision. His attempts at trapping fellow pilots into something without full disclosure is devious and self-serving. And believe me, i want pilots applying to Emirates as it will ensure the success of this airline and thereby my career. Yet unlike Bird On, I refuse to mislead.
I have to state that I do not hold anything against DEC's. I place no blame upon them and treat them with respect. I entirely place the blame for this misguided policy on Emirates management. In fact i find it disturbing that some of these DEC's are absolutely pathetic in their primary job of being a safe and effective captain. Some of these guys are stellar captains and would be an attibrute to any airline but its entirely correct in stating that some of these pilots are way out of their element. I have seldom seen such poor airmanship and lack of knowledge regarding SOP's, TR avoidance, crew cooperation, fuel saving measures, as I have seen from some DEC's at EK. That is a sad reflection on the DEC policy at EK.
Even if all the DEC's were stellar captains I still believe the policy is flawed. It promotes dissention amongst the pilot group and rewards the ill-advised policies of managers. There is absolutely no reason why EK could not promote from within. This was the most desirable pilot job as little as 3 years ago....... in the entire world. Now, it is only desirable for those with a marked decrease in experience and training as compared to those applying in the past.
This policy must be axed and the sooner the better. And the only way that there is any hope of having this airline continue to prosper will be to completely review the recent decisions regarding T and C's. Pls go back and review the policy changes I have listed at the beginning of this thread, that have occured in the past year. Even the likes of Bird On will have to agree, this airline is pointed in the wrong direction wrt our careers and it is all in the name of profit. Too bad the managers can't see beyond a couple of months and realize that profit will suffer immensely due to these changes. Sometimes i wonder if it all comes down to jealously.
You summed it up well mensa ,
the truth is out there , the standard is appalling yet these guys came here and jumped over guys with similar and in some cases more experience.
If you leave a command job to come here as an F/O you will pay dearly.
There is more suitably qualified captains in the right seat than you may imagine.
Now management must know why F/os are so pissed off, there is no merit in this company it is all about saving money .
Also there r good jobs out there SIA cargo and sia 777 for example who will look at f/os for command if they meet the hour requirements including previous command time.
Funny thing is Emirates needs these guys for upgrade (I think) yet they are the ones more likely to leave .
If you were offered a command with another company and you are an F/O with EK why would you stay,when there is no idea when upgrades will happen.
If they get really short they can just keep throwing DECs over you indefinately or if you are on the wrong type such as 777 in about 3 years you could be an 8 year f/o while your mates on the airbus get 3 year upgrades .
Its no way to treat people.
the truth is out there , the standard is appalling yet these guys came here and jumped over guys with similar and in some cases more experience.
If you leave a command job to come here as an F/O you will pay dearly.
There is more suitably qualified captains in the right seat than you may imagine.
Now management must know why F/os are so pissed off, there is no merit in this company it is all about saving money .
Also there r good jobs out there SIA cargo and sia 777 for example who will look at f/os for command if they meet the hour requirements including previous command time.
Funny thing is Emirates needs these guys for upgrade (I think) yet they are the ones more likely to leave .
If you were offered a command with another company and you are an F/O with EK why would you stay,when there is no idea when upgrades will happen.
If they get really short they can just keep throwing DECs over you indefinately or if you are on the wrong type such as 777 in about 3 years you could be an 8 year f/o while your mates on the airbus get 3 year upgrades .
Its no way to treat people.