Hi guys, long time reader - first time poster here.

Having read through this thread a couple of times now, I can't quite understand whether or not the scheme takes you right from the very start? i.e. Little to no flying experience and no medicals.

Sorry I seem a little ignorant, im currently applying to the RAF and looking for a potential back up plans.

Also trying to catch up on the civie street lingo:p

Cheers for any help!

thanks guys.. i guess just sit tight and watch this is the most reliable source, becuase like was said, as soon as it goes public, this page will balloon. just hope my cv wil be good enough. any rumours on what their looking for? selection and interview process?

Rocknerd,

Yep - it's ab initio training, zero to hero, right from the start, etc. I imagine many of the successful applicants will have some kind of flying experience though, be it gliding or PPL...

B&S

If Thomas cook wanted successful candidates to pay for all of the training at FTE Jerez, would that cost be less to those people that had their PPL already, or would you still be required to pay the same and spend the time 'breaking bad habits'?

These schemes are generally ab-initio so ppl would likely be disregarded and no discount on training is to be expected :(

What hollingworthp said. A well-known UK integrated school which has recently become an academy used to offer a discount a few years ago but stopped it, for self-sponsored and airline tagged students alike.

A PPL might not save you on course costs but it demonstrates a commitment to, and investment in, flying, amongst other things like (you'd hope!) at least a bit of natural aptitude.

B&S

thanks for the advice/information.

Main point already covered (no discount for pre-existing hours), but the one thing not covered that mightbe worth considering if you have a PPL and then go integrated - sponsored or not - is that learning from scratch to CPL/ME/Ir standard with no prior experience is a big hill to climb. Far from impossible (god, even I managed it!) but I would say, from my experience that I feel my confidence and ability to absorb the new information in every flight would have been a LOT higher had I had a lot more hours than I did when I started.

What I'm trying to say is that a PPL won't save you cash explicitly, but it may well save you having additional training (that you need to pay extra for) and it may well help keep your lesson scores up - which in turn helps breed the confidence that is all important for your flight tests.

Not to mention having a PPL may well help you nudge ahead of the competition during selection tests.

well here's hoping!

New cadet scheme goes live?
 

Heard from a mate on the inside...looks like they're launching this cadet scheme at the Manchester University Careers fair.

Careers fair website seems to back this up:

Exhibitor A-Z (The University of Manchester)

No details yet on how/when to apply - website suggests 'coming weeks'. Best dig the old cv out...!

So, anyone manage to get to the Careers Fair up in Manchester today and get to check this out? Any more details?

Thomas Cook are only there on Thurday not Wednesday so maybe we will get some posts later...

so did anyone make it to the fair in manchester? did they give a launch date?
cheers lads.. :ok:

Could someone kindly explain why TCX need to offer this scheme when there are so many unemployed pilots out of work/so many from Flybe that would be willing to join anyway, or will it just be a way of having the RHS on a much lower payscale?

In addition, do they get any kick-back from FTE?

Presumably, the course cost will be lower than self-sponsored as TCX must have been able to gain a discount for guaranteeing circa 10 places, i.e. £0.5million - £1 million.

I'm not having a go at the scheme, I just don't really understand why in the current climate.

cheers

My thoughts in no particular order:

a) Probably not too many pilots type-rated on Q400 (purely a guess).

b) Airlines are run by accountants who like the cheapest option and quite a few of these schemes will take on cadets on a reduced FO salary.

c) Airlines are very conservative and the schemes provide a known quantity 'product' with pre-selection and monitoring throughout their training without any commitment to actually recruit anyone who turns out to be a donkey (based on skills or more likely personality / work ethic etc) so it's a bit like a year long interview process taking place during the training.

d) Most airlines don't recruit captains but would like to take pre-selected FO's who would be suitable for LHS are are likely to be loyal enough to hang around long enough to make the move.

Probably other reasons but that is some of why I think these schemes form part of the recruitment these companies conduct.

DISCLAIMER: These are only possible explanations and not my personal beliefs - so no requirement for flaming .... muchas.

As someone who was at the receiving end of the previous AIH/MYT cadet scheme, perhaps I could pose the following answers to FANS;

I fully accept that there are many unemployed/ low hour pilots currently out there doing their level best to secure employment. I most certainly wish all could find the right job in the right place. The facts behind the establishment of this scheme were to provide TCX with a reliable stream of well qualified, known individuals. They will be monitored throughout their training with feedback to TCX from both the FTE and FlyBe. The cadets know this, and if anything it makes you feel a part of an organisation even before you really join it.

This scheme affords TCX the ability to plan ahead for the arrival of the cadets which works well given upcoming retirements etc. There may be pilots now, but who knows in 2-3 years time.

The idea of a scheme such as this was always to try and 'gain' a pilot for life. Sometimes this works and sometimes it doesn't. There are still many ex cadets in the company and many have progressed easily into the LHS.

Don't be under any illusion that TCX will not be contributing to this. A very strong case had to be made at board level for financial support in a very difficult trading environment. The comittment is there from the company and I feel the scheme will help both parties.

This is why I have come out of BALPA - It has no teeth.
Why are we as professional pilots standing for this?
The market is saturated with good pilots, why do we need more cadet schemes coming through?
We need to unite, tell BALPA that if this isn’t sorted in 6 months, they can shove their membership. There should be a %age of the pilot workforce as cadets, not like Easy, RyanAir etc... all jumping on the cadet-train and it becoming the norm.
It is currently, with 3000TT, impossible to get a job thanks to the greed of the airlines. And don't blame the banks for the climate, this has been forming for years as more cadets take the 100k plunge. I am thinking of changing my name by deed and applying myself.

not to sidetrack where this conversation is at, but, does anyone know when the scheme is being launched for definate?

I am going to agree on this - I think BALPA should be taking the fight against this scheme.

It is not fair to the currently employed and the currently unemployed in the industry.

There are hundreds of experienced FOs and Captains out there with B757/B767/A320 experience (often with thousands of hours!), and yet here there is an offer to install a whole new selection of inexperienced pilots onto the line.

BALPA need to take a stand against schemes like this, while the going is still good. It is not a popular idea inside the industry and will increase a great deal of resentment across the board.

TCX actively sought out many pilots from many airlines that have recently failed and they are now on the payroll. What TCX want, quite rightly, is a broad spectrum of experience in the flightdeck. This caters for FO/CP ratios, retirements, etc.

In the UK, there have been low-hours pilots being mentored by an airline during training and then going on to fly airliners for decades. It's not the new 'cancer' some suggest it is. Yes, the T&Cs of previous schemes were substantially better than those of the last couple of years or so (pay-for-a-rating, pay-to-fly, etc.) but this scheme represents a shift towards more investment from the airline, which is, I think, a step in the right direction.

I agree that BALPA should be stamping on paying for ratings and, more so, on the ridiculous practice of paying for line training/flying but too many people on these forums lump pay-to-fly with low-hours pilots. Yes, low-hours pilots are those paying to fly but not all low-hours pilots are paying to fly.

Are you suggesting, though, that BALPA should be discouraging new pilots from joining the industry (through reasonable, fair schemes)? Note: we don't know the financial details of this scheme just yet so can't classify it as a good deal or a p***take but it looks like it might have the potential to be fair deal, with give and take on both sides...

I am suggesting that lets keep the whole recruitment fair and above board. For many months / years now Easy, Ryan and others have only advertised for ‘low hours’ FO’s. Yes they were good enough to take on crews from a few sinking ships, but the only way in is still via CTC, or other, if you are not experienced on type. With airline time, why should anyone become a victim of their own experience?
If they need, for example, 60 FO's – recruit:

6-10 cadets, depending on their current number of cadets
20 TR pilots from various age groups, again depending on their current situation
Remainder from instructor or Turbo Prop backgrounds 1500hrs +.
All from the UK and outside if they cannot fill the places.

PAPI-74,

I completely agree. I can't think, off-hand, of any other industry that does this.

Again, I think something like this is a good idea and, speaking as someone who knows a bit about TCX, I genuinely think TCX try and do something approaching this - admittedly though, positions for those with experience don't seem to be advertised quite as obviously as you might hope.

From your first post I got the impression that you advocate a freeze on new pilots entering the industry until those, experienced, guys who have fallen on bad times are employed. I don't think airlines like TCX owe people a job - the company interests should come first but I completely agree with your proportional representation idea (with the 'cadets' still being a minority of those recruited) - that way there are still opportunities for those with the drive and ability to be accepted on to 'sponsored'/tagged schemes to enter the industry, while, quite rightly, the company can poach the best qualified/most experienced pilots at the same time, like any other industry/profession.

B&S :ok:

Running it through FTE... apparently 3 years with Flybe then onto Thomas Cook..? Info should be on net within a week.

what are the region and postcode reqd in the search engine to apply?
cheers..

rick0,

It's 2 years with flyBE.

Felys & aviator001,

You've just failed the first stage of selection, finding the (not very well hidden) application section!

B&S :eek:

In fairness, the application on the website came out a few hours after it was linked on FTE's site.

It's up and running now though!

Find the latest vacancies for Thomas Cook pilots

My bad.

Good luck!

B&S :ok:

...Any idea of what the selection process will consist of ? type of test ect ?

anyone know what about the cadet pilot will be?

money,selection,course....

thanks!:ok:

There doesn't appear to be any detailed information about the scheme on FTE's or TC's website. Anyone have link to something with a bit more information?

K

I actually posed that before the page was up on FTE's website :ok: I got the info from a bloke who did the career fair in Manchester.. but yeah.. my mistake.

give that man a coconut..............:ugh:

please...anyone know something about the cadet pilot?

antes56 -If you read through this thread, you'll find links and information that contains everything you need to know. The link to the recruitment fair was a pretty detailed account of the role and requirements. At this stage though, I'd hope you would know fully what was expected of you. If you go to Thomas Cook's recruitment page, it will tell you everything you need to know. You have to do some things yourself, don't expect everyone to do all the hard work and post everything here for you. I don't mean that in a patronising way, but you should be looking through the links that were very helpfully posted by others in this thread.

Dear Chrisbowe82

thanks for the answer...I read all the thread,and although I find the information interesting,i think they are almost only what all the people here supposed will be this scheme...
anyway,as i understand,you have to pay for the course with fte ,the TC pay 1000£ a month for you and at the end they will pay for the TR on the aircraft..is this correct?

:ok:

on the tcx website it says you will need to be able to pass a class 1 medical.

I started the application and it asked if I had a class 1 medical. I clicked no and it refused my application?! :{

Im a fit and healthy young laddy! lol

It said the same to me!.I think you have to get the medical before you apply.

Hi all,

it was asked:

2. Do you hold, or are you able to obtain, a valid JAR class one medical certificate?

So if you don't have it but are able to have it it is ok ?

I'm french but i think i well understood ;)