CTC McAlpine/easyJet/JMC Sponsorship Selection
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A quick question for those who have already been to the stage 2 selection: is it a formal event? that is, is wearing a suit advisable or can you get away with being casual?
Main reason I ask is my "suit shoes" have a slippery sole - not conducive to fine control of sensitive pedals!! (like the test described by wannabe1000 earlier in this thread).
Also, whats the accommodation at CTC like? Is it room only?
B&B? etc.
Cheers
Random
Main reason I ask is my "suit shoes" have a slippery sole - not conducive to fine control of sensitive pedals!! (like the test described by wannabe1000 earlier in this thread).
Also, whats the accommodation at CTC like? Is it room only?
B&B? etc.
Cheers
Random
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Well, I am of one of the lucky ones who made it to Stage 2, but not to stage 3.... Well, I would not have made it to stage 4 anyway, so no regrets. Stage 2, for the kind of person I am and my background, was already excellent.
First of all, I have to say that some of you have described the days very well so I won't describe them again.
It is not difficult to find the CTC Aviation Centre, but be aware that most people in Southampton have never heard of it. Might be tricky if you have to take a taxi....
It is indeed a very nice day which I thoroughly enjoyed. You are offered tea, coffee, juice on arrival (they also ask you to pay the £160!LOL), then you have another break for coffee.... then lunch... The manor itself is pretty and you are definitely in a place dedicated to aviation (for example, you have a wall covered with photos of CTC graduates, a few aircraft posters, a cockpit in the main sitting area...). It is also true that Mary Brown and Rod Wren are friendly people and try their best to make you feel relax.
On my Testing Day, there was 14 people, me included. Rod told us that 50% of applicants had made it through to stage 2 and had therefore passed the 4 questions Stage. He then told us that about 50 % of us would make it to stage 3 (7/14). At the end, 1 or 2 would go to New Zealand (provided they pass the Medical......) I heard someone talking about a guy who had been accepted for the training and had passed all the selection stages, but had failed the medical!!!
!!!
In total, they expect to offer around 70 places, although at the moment, only 28 places are on offer (24 for easyJet and 4 for Thomas Cook). They also said they expect other airlines (Ryanair, BMI, My Travel???) to join the scheme, but refused to say who. Fair enough.... We shall see....They precised, however, that employment was not guaranteed at the end and you might be put on a waiting list.
I do not think you need serious flying experience to get through to Stage 2, most people did not have a PPL, so I suppose that flying experience is not a vital requirement.
There will be indeed a Stage 5 for at least some people. Stage 5 will be an interview with easyjet or Thomas Cook. They basically want to know who they are investing in.
Do you have to wear a suit? Well, I did, and I would advise you to do so too. They told us it did not matter (orange culture of easyJet...), that they were not assessing us that day (except through the tests), but I am sure that Stage 2 was already a way for them to assess us informally. So watch the way you talk, the answers you give....
Well, as far as the tests are concerned, I think that they are OK. However, Rod told us the tests were meant to predict your ability to fly and would show your innate qualities. Even with practice, he pretended you could not improve your score. I have to say I disagree 'cause this type of tests only show a potential, but are definitely not as clear cut as he pretends. How can a computer test with a joystick you can hardly control reveal if you are born to be a pilot???? I am sure an airline pilot could fail them, and I am sure that with practice, you also could improve your score. So, Mr Wren, watch what you say. Do not tell people that if they do not pass your tests, they will never be an airline pilot. I hope one day to prove the contrary.
As far as the tests themselves are concerned, this is a brief description of how I saw things (once again, some of you have described the tests very well, so my description will be brief):
First of all, the computer based tests were quite challenging, but were sometimes a bit dodgy as well.
The test for which you have to use the rudder pedals and the joystick is very dodgy. You cannot really control the needle and the ball in the middle because of the lack of precision of the joystick and pedals. Come on, it is not realistic at all, even Flight Simulator is better....!!!!! I do not recommend slippery soles!!!
The Maths test is OK, but having to calculate 4567512 divided by 2879 is a bit ridiculous. What is the point?? You need to know your basic maths, but it is not that difficult otherwise. The difficulty lies in the time limit you have to comply with.
The tests with the autopilot setting (multi task and memory) are quite easy too, but you have to comply with the time limit once again. The setting of the autopilot along with turning off alert signals (multitask) was not too bad, the only thing is that you do not really know if you have managed to turn the signal off (there is no indication such as a green light...). So you keep on pressing keys without knowing how well you are performing. A bit frustrating...
The test with the three instruments (RBI, Artificial horizon and Compass) definitely lacks explanations. Lots of people found it difficult at first. I myself took ages to understand how it was meant to work. I did work it out though. Take your time, there is no time limit for this one.
Well, I will not describe the verbal and numerical tests which are quite common in the world of recruitment. The group discussion is not really objectively assessed....because they were ticking boxes (human judgement = subjective).
What I would like to say through this post, is that I personally believe these tests are only there to help CTC people select a few candidates among so many applicants, which is fine... They have to find a wat to select people after all. However, failing to pass the tests or failing at the interview does not mean you cannot do the job in question. Always remember this kind of tests only suggests you might be able to do the job. They are not a 100% guarantee. There are many other parameters to take into account for the tests to be 100% accurate, if accurate.
The perfect example is to be found on the easyJet website itself where a pilot says that he had never succeeded in securing a place on a sponsorship scheme (which probably involved all this selection process) and had to fund himself. He was not meant to have the qualities required to be an airline pilot. Well....The guy is now a pilot for easyJet !!!
So, if you have failed after Stage 2 or Stage 3, or even Stage 1, it does not mean you are not capable of becoming an airline pilot and that you are a failure. I am sure you are totally able to do it.... and remember, life goes on....
Cheers......
First of all, I have to say that some of you have described the days very well so I won't describe them again.
It is not difficult to find the CTC Aviation Centre, but be aware that most people in Southampton have never heard of it. Might be tricky if you have to take a taxi....
It is indeed a very nice day which I thoroughly enjoyed. You are offered tea, coffee, juice on arrival (they also ask you to pay the £160!LOL), then you have another break for coffee.... then lunch... The manor itself is pretty and you are definitely in a place dedicated to aviation (for example, you have a wall covered with photos of CTC graduates, a few aircraft posters, a cockpit in the main sitting area...). It is also true that Mary Brown and Rod Wren are friendly people and try their best to make you feel relax.
On my Testing Day, there was 14 people, me included. Rod told us that 50% of applicants had made it through to stage 2 and had therefore passed the 4 questions Stage. He then told us that about 50 % of us would make it to stage 3 (7/14). At the end, 1 or 2 would go to New Zealand (provided they pass the Medical......) I heard someone talking about a guy who had been accepted for the training and had passed all the selection stages, but had failed the medical!!!
!!! In total, they expect to offer around 70 places, although at the moment, only 28 places are on offer (24 for easyJet and 4 for Thomas Cook). They also said they expect other airlines (Ryanair, BMI, My Travel???) to join the scheme, but refused to say who. Fair enough.... We shall see....They precised, however, that employment was not guaranteed at the end and you might be put on a waiting list.
I do not think you need serious flying experience to get through to Stage 2, most people did not have a PPL, so I suppose that flying experience is not a vital requirement.
There will be indeed a Stage 5 for at least some people. Stage 5 will be an interview with easyjet or Thomas Cook. They basically want to know who they are investing in.
Do you have to wear a suit? Well, I did, and I would advise you to do so too. They told us it did not matter (orange culture of easyJet...), that they were not assessing us that day (except through the tests), but I am sure that Stage 2 was already a way for them to assess us informally. So watch the way you talk, the answers you give....
Well, as far as the tests are concerned, I think that they are OK. However, Rod told us the tests were meant to predict your ability to fly and would show your innate qualities. Even with practice, he pretended you could not improve your score. I have to say I disagree 'cause this type of tests only show a potential, but are definitely not as clear cut as he pretends. How can a computer test with a joystick you can hardly control reveal if you are born to be a pilot???? I am sure an airline pilot could fail them, and I am sure that with practice, you also could improve your score. So, Mr Wren, watch what you say. Do not tell people that if they do not pass your tests, they will never be an airline pilot. I hope one day to prove the contrary.
As far as the tests themselves are concerned, this is a brief description of how I saw things (once again, some of you have described the tests very well, so my description will be brief):
First of all, the computer based tests were quite challenging, but were sometimes a bit dodgy as well.
The test for which you have to use the rudder pedals and the joystick is very dodgy. You cannot really control the needle and the ball in the middle because of the lack of precision of the joystick and pedals. Come on, it is not realistic at all, even Flight Simulator is better....!!!!! I do not recommend slippery soles!!!
The Maths test is OK, but having to calculate 4567512 divided by 2879 is a bit ridiculous. What is the point?? You need to know your basic maths, but it is not that difficult otherwise. The difficulty lies in the time limit you have to comply with.
The tests with the autopilot setting (multi task and memory) are quite easy too, but you have to comply with the time limit once again. The setting of the autopilot along with turning off alert signals (multitask) was not too bad, the only thing is that you do not really know if you have managed to turn the signal off (there is no indication such as a green light...). So you keep on pressing keys without knowing how well you are performing. A bit frustrating...
The test with the three instruments (RBI, Artificial horizon and Compass) definitely lacks explanations. Lots of people found it difficult at first. I myself took ages to understand how it was meant to work. I did work it out though. Take your time, there is no time limit for this one.
Well, I will not describe the verbal and numerical tests which are quite common in the world of recruitment. The group discussion is not really objectively assessed....because they were ticking boxes (human judgement = subjective).
What I would like to say through this post, is that I personally believe these tests are only there to help CTC people select a few candidates among so many applicants, which is fine... They have to find a wat to select people after all. However, failing to pass the tests or failing at the interview does not mean you cannot do the job in question. Always remember this kind of tests only suggests you might be able to do the job. They are not a 100% guarantee. There are many other parameters to take into account for the tests to be 100% accurate, if accurate.
The perfect example is to be found on the easyJet website itself where a pilot says that he had never succeeded in securing a place on a sponsorship scheme (which probably involved all this selection process) and had to fund himself. He was not meant to have the qualities required to be an airline pilot. Well....The guy is now a pilot for easyJet !!!
So, if you have failed after Stage 2 or Stage 3, or even Stage 1, it does not mean you are not capable of becoming an airline pilot and that you are a failure. I am sure you are totally able to do it.... and remember, life goes on....
Cheers......
Guest
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I am awaiting feedback after attending stage 2 of the selection. Has anyone actually received feedback?
The feedback was promised on the day and for £160 I would expect some. I understand they must be very busy with the non-failures, but to hear absolutely nothing after it being promised ain't very nice.
I am not sure what the best way forward is to try and chase it up. They must get so many emails and phone calls from people chasing up applications and confirming attendance that I feel my plea would not be heard amongst the noise of the masses. I would like to know where I went wrong as I am currently applying to something else and could do with brushing up on my weak points.
Is anyone else in the same boat or has any advice?
Cheers
PT
The feedback was promised on the day and for £160 I would expect some. I understand they must be very busy with the non-failures, but to hear absolutely nothing after it being promised ain't very nice.
I am not sure what the best way forward is to try and chase it up. They must get so many emails and phone calls from people chasing up applications and confirming attendance that I feel my plea would not be heard amongst the noise of the masses. I would like to know where I went wrong as I am currently applying to something else and could do with brushing up on my weak points.
Is anyone else in the same boat or has any advice?
Cheers
PT
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Yeah I'm in the same boat. Was promised it on the phone by Mary - I was happy to allow a reasonable length of time but it's been 6 weeks now. Sent Rod Wren a PM ages ago about that, he read it but didn't reply. Useless.
I'm not paying their accommodation bill until they send some feedback
Ultimately, the test papers and applicant files all have our names on them so the Data Protection Act can be used to obtain them if necessary.
I'm not paying their accommodation bill until they send some feedback
Ultimately, the test papers and applicant files all have our names on them so the Data Protection Act can be used to obtain them if necessary.
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emmaGG,
Yeah, i've booked flights from Glasgow to Southampton on the 31st, arriving around 2pm. Decided i'd rather fly down and not have the hassle of spending hours on trains etc.
No idea how to get to the CTC site from the airport though. I guess if the worst comes to the worst i'll take a taxi (and get completely shafted into the bargain!!)
Random
Yeah, i've booked flights from Glasgow to Southampton on the 31st, arriving around 2pm. Decided i'd rather fly down and not have the hassle of spending hours on trains etc.
No idea how to get to the CTC site from the airport though. I guess if the worst comes to the worst i'll take a taxi (and get completely shafted into the bargain!!)
Random
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You could get a train from the airport into central Southampton, then the ferry, then a taxi; should come to under a tenner. Or take a train through to Totton then a taxi from there.
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Fancy navigator
A comprehensive post and I agree with almost all of what you say. All but what Rod Wren said about failing the aptitude tests. He stressed several times that failing any section did not mean that you would not become an airline pilot - all it meant was that "you might not make it to a shiny new 737 in the minimum time" and you might need extra training to make the grade.
A comprehensive post and I agree with almost all of what you say. All but what Rod Wren said about failing the aptitude tests. He stressed several times that failing any section did not mean that you would not become an airline pilot - all it meant was that "you might not make it to a shiny new 737 in the minimum time" and you might need extra training to make the grade.
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When I went he didn't even go as far as that - just said that not getting selected doesn't mean you cannot be a professional pilot. Perhaps the more assessments they do, the more they believe in it 
I think this sort of testing is fool-proof in so far as if you haven't got the appropriate aptitudes then there's no way that you can ever do well in them. The flaw is that, conversely, you can easily mess up and perform less than brilliantly even if you do actually have the right skills - of course, I still feel that makes the tests fair as a competitive way to whittle down the short-list, but I don't believe you can make many cast-iron assumptions out of the results.
I think this sort of testing is fool-proof in so far as if you haven't got the appropriate aptitudes then there's no way that you can ever do well in them. The flaw is that, conversely, you can easily mess up and perform less than brilliantly even if you do actually have the right skills - of course, I still feel that makes the tests fair as a competitive way to whittle down the short-list, but I don't believe you can make many cast-iron assumptions out of the results.
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Carb, you're right. He did stipulate that failing the aptitude does not, in any way, rule you out from being suitable for airline pilot work. He did point out, however, that failing them indicated that you are not the type of person they were looking for in this particular circumstance i.e. some who can grip a pretty steep learning curve.
Having said all that I am not sure how those couple of hours of computer based test on dodgy joysticks can predict your long-term learning ability. Whilst I was there, there were three candidates that had to resit the computer based examinations as it was thought that their computers had played up; makes you wonder about the rest of them....
This, for me, was the first set of any aptitude tests that I had ever failed. In my defence I wasn't feeling very well on the day, tired and little head achey (despite laying off the drink and a load of early nights). I personally KNOW I can do better than I did that day and I don't anticipate having trouble with any future aptitude tests.
Good luck to all those still in the CTC game and to those that were let go, keep your chin up. If you truly have what it takes and deserve this job then it will come your way eventually.
Cheers
PT
Having said all that I am not sure how those couple of hours of computer based test on dodgy joysticks can predict your long-term learning ability. Whilst I was there, there were three candidates that had to resit the computer based examinations as it was thought that their computers had played up; makes you wonder about the rest of them....
This, for me, was the first set of any aptitude tests that I had ever failed. In my defence I wasn't feeling very well on the day, tired and little head achey (despite laying off the drink and a load of early nights). I personally KNOW I can do better than I did that day and I don't anticipate having trouble with any future aptitude tests.
Good luck to all those still in the CTC game and to those that were let go, keep your chin up. If you truly have what it takes and deserve this job then it will come your way eventually.
Cheers
PT
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Mea culpa, you are right, folks, I went a bit far by saying that.... oops What made me say that is that he talked about innate qualities and all that carry on....which leads to think that if you do not pass the tests, you will never be a pilot... Anyway, everybody seems to agree (except maybe those who will go to New Zealand-will they ever get to read this forum though ?) that the tests are certainly not a 100% proof in itself. I am sure it is easy not to do well at them (stress/nervousness, lack of sleep, lack of practice/No knowledge of the type of tests.... dodgy joysticks....). On top of that, I am pretty sure that some people who did not pass the tests could do it to a 737 in the minimum time (after all, most candidates were graduates...). CTC should let me prove the contrary and take me on the course LOL
The tests are just a way (a good way?) for CTC to select people, that's all.
Receiving feedback might take ages.... probably not before a lot of people have been through the selection process.... We shall see.
As PT Flea said, keep your chin up. All the best!
Cheers
What made me say that is that he talked about innate qualities and all that carry on....which leads to think that if you do not pass the tests, you will never be a pilot... Anyway, everybody seems to agree (except maybe those who will go to New Zealand-will they ever get to read this forum though ?) that the tests are certainly not a 100% proof in itself. I am sure it is easy not to do well at them (stress/nervousness, lack of sleep, lack of practice/No knowledge of the type of tests.... dodgy joysticks....). On top of that, I am pretty sure that some people who did not pass the tests could do it to a 737 in the minimum time (after all, most candidates were graduates...). CTC should let me prove the contrary and take me on the course LOL The tests are just a way (a good way?) for CTC to select people, that's all.
Receiving feedback might take ages.... probably not before a lot of people have been through the selection process.... We shall see.
As PT Flea said, keep your chin up. All the best!
Cheers
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Random Bloke
If you don't mind me asking how much did it cost for you to book your flight from Glasgow to Southampton? Who flys it? Definately the best way to get down there, you'll arrive fresh and not tired etc
If you don't mind me asking how much did it cost for you to book your flight from Glasgow to Southampton? Who flys it? Definately the best way to get down there, you'll arrive fresh and not tired etc
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Chris,
British Airways are the only company who fly direct from Glasgow to Southampton and it's costing me almost 190 of the Queen's finest to do so.
Justified it to myself tho - thought getting train wouldnt be much cheaper, wouldnt have to worry about trains running late and also I would also arrive fresher for the event.
Why use any other form of transport when you can fly.
British Airways are the only company who fly direct from Glasgow to Southampton and it's costing me almost 190 of the Queen's finest to do so.
Justified it to myself tho - thought getting train wouldnt be much cheaper, wouldnt have to worry about trains running late and also I would also arrive fresher for the event.
Why use any other form of transport when you can fly.
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message for fancy navigator
i agree with most of what u said, and i am sorry u didnt get through.
when were u down there?
and when didu find out?
as i was there on the 24th, stage 2, and we were told that we would find out on mon.
anyway good luck.
ph.
i agree with most of what u said, and i am sorry u didnt get through.
when were u down there?
and when didu find out?
as i was there on the 24th, stage 2, and we were told that we would find out on mon.
anyway good luck.
ph.
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Well unfortunately got the call from Mary saying not through to third stage, gutted. On another day, who knows what might have happened, but everything has got be judged on what you do on the day. I echo everyone’s comments about the professionalism and general all round good feeling from Mary et al. Been to a final board so hopefully can do it again before I am too old for sponsorship (approaching 25 now). Good luck to those going through and well done to all those who get through , you will have earned it, New Zealand is a fantastic place.
Cest la Vie.
152sulky
, you will have earned it, New Zealand is a fantastic place.Cest la Vie.
152sulky
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Dear All
I have been out the pprune circular for a while. Like a lot of people I too got the 'Unfortunately.....' call from Mary some time ago, never really did hear the rest of what she said, as the first word said it all!
I was slightly pissed off as I knew on the day I didn't give it 100% and I don't agree that you can't change your aptitude so I am not going to give in at this stage.
If any of you who were at the second stage on 14th Dec got all the way then let me know.
Someone asked what is the best way from Scotland to Southampton ..............take the BA hassle free route to Southampton as I didn't and arrived at CTC at midnight and didn't get a good sleep for the next day....the easyjet flight was late...no bloody suprise there and my hire car order got c*cked up so I had to get several trains across London and then one to Southampton.....not a good way to prepare yourself. Total cost was 170 compared to 270 BA all the way.
All the best to those who are about to take the testing and all the best to those going to NZ
DIGGLER
I have been out the pprune circular for a while. Like a lot of people I too got the 'Unfortunately.....' call from Mary some time ago, never really did hear the rest of what she said, as the first word said it all!
I was slightly pissed off as I knew on the day I didn't give it 100% and I don't agree that you can't change your aptitude so I am not going to give in at this stage.
If any of you who were at the second stage on 14th Dec got all the way then let me know.
Someone asked what is the best way from Scotland to Southampton ..............take the BA hassle free route to Southampton as I didn't and arrived at CTC at midnight and didn't get a good sleep for the next day....the easyjet flight was late...no bloody suprise there and my hire car order got c*cked up so I had to get several trains across London and then one to Southampton.....not a good way to prepare yourself. Total cost was 170 compared to 270 BA all the way.
All the best to those who are about to take the testing and all the best to those going to NZ
DIGGLER
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152 and purple haze,
can you elaborate on these compass tests that you failed? I am through to stage two now and would be grateful for any advice on how to avoid a similar fate. Unlucky this time and good luck in future.
Hotairlass,
if you read some of the earlier posts in this thread you will see many people are or have been waiting a long time for replies from CTC. I myself waited over a month for any response at all regarding stage two. All i can suggest is to be patient and keep fingers crossed. the guys at CTC are snowed under big time.
can you elaborate on these compass tests that you failed? I am through to stage two now and would be grateful for any advice on how to avoid a similar fate. Unlucky this time and good luck in future.
Hotairlass,
if you read some of the earlier posts in this thread you will see many people are or have been waiting a long time for replies from CTC. I myself waited over a month for any response at all regarding stage two. All i can suggest is to be patient and keep fingers crossed. the guys at CTC are snowed under big time.