Yank in need of advice
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Yank in need of advice
New to the forum and would like a little guidance from my European brothers and sisters. I am another Yank wannabe interested the JAA ATPL license conversion. Any and all help appreciated and welcomed in advance. 
I am 35 yo, have about 600 TT with 110 ME (Multi), FAA Commercial, IR, Certified Flight Instructor and Certified Instrument Flight Instructor (IR). I have about 320 TT dual given instruction, mostly single engine. Unlike most other Yanks, I believe that I would have the right to work in the EU because my wife of 11 years is a Spanish citizen. I picked her up while serving in Spain....very nice souvenir to have, I must say.
I understand that in order to attempt a JAA license conversion, I would have to do the dreaded 14 exams. Furthermore, I also understand that I would have to do the equivilant IR oral and checkride, as well as the same for the CPL conversion. I have scoped out what it would cost and the effort that I would have to put into this endeavor in order to achieve the rightful conversion, as well as the MCC that the JAA requires. That is about as far as I have gotten in my knowledge quest.
What I am confused about is the differences in getting into an airline between here in the States and over there (UK mostly). Taking into consideration that the current atmosphere with high fuel prices is indeed skewing the employment picture in Europe at the moment, would it even be worth it for me at my ripe old age of 35 to even pursue an attempt at doing the license conversions and eventually to pursue employment with a carrier based in the UK? I understand that there are unique sponsorships with airlines, as well as self sponsored individuals pursuing the ATPL licenses. However, I am unsure of how that factors into getting an interview and prospects of gainful employment with a carrier.
Are the prospects for a self-sponsored pilot with my background and age too big of an obstacle to overcome? Also, how common is it for an EU carrier to make someone "buy" their own type rating?
Thanks for reading my post, and again I appreciate the feedback in advance.
I am 35 yo, have about 600 TT with 110 ME (Multi), FAA Commercial, IR, Certified Flight Instructor and Certified Instrument Flight Instructor (IR). I have about 320 TT dual given instruction, mostly single engine. Unlike most other Yanks, I believe that I would have the right to work in the EU because my wife of 11 years is a Spanish citizen. I picked her up while serving in Spain....very nice souvenir to have, I must say.
I understand that in order to attempt a JAA license conversion, I would have to do the dreaded 14 exams. Furthermore, I also understand that I would have to do the equivilant IR oral and checkride, as well as the same for the CPL conversion. I have scoped out what it would cost and the effort that I would have to put into this endeavor in order to achieve the rightful conversion, as well as the MCC that the JAA requires. That is about as far as I have gotten in my knowledge quest.
What I am confused about is the differences in getting into an airline between here in the States and over there (UK mostly). Taking into consideration that the current atmosphere with high fuel prices is indeed skewing the employment picture in Europe at the moment, would it even be worth it for me at my ripe old age of 35 to even pursue an attempt at doing the license conversions and eventually to pursue employment with a carrier based in the UK? I understand that there are unique sponsorships with airlines, as well as self sponsored individuals pursuing the ATPL licenses. However, I am unsure of how that factors into getting an interview and prospects of gainful employment with a carrier.
Are the prospects for a self-sponsored pilot with my background and age too big of an obstacle to overcome? Also, how common is it for an EU carrier to make someone "buy" their own type rating?
Thanks for reading my post, and again I appreciate the feedback in advance.
Join Date: Dec 2002
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A steep hill Chewie..
Hi Chewie. I can't comment on your right (or otherwise) to work in Europe.
However, I hope that the following points may help:
1 I don't think that you have much chance with any airline-sponsorship deal. The normal cut-off age is 28 and is sometimes lower.
2 Even after full conversion to JAA licences (and maybe even paying for a type-rating) you will most likely find yourself in a very long queue.
3 I don't believe that your nationality would necessarily hold you back but there are many hundreds (maybe thousands) of jobseekers on this side and many have been hunting since early 2006 - perhaps longer.
4 I suggest that you think very carefully about paying for a type-rating. A TR without line experience is of limited value and many airlines prefer TRs to be conducted by an organisation that they have an arrangement with.
I'm genuinely sorry if this seems negative but wish you all the very best nevertheless.
Best regards bm
However, I hope that the following points may help:
1 I don't think that you have much chance with any airline-sponsorship deal. The normal cut-off age is 28 and is sometimes lower.
2 Even after full conversion to JAA licences (and maybe even paying for a type-rating) you will most likely find yourself in a very long queue.
3 I don't believe that your nationality would necessarily hold you back but there are many hundreds (maybe thousands) of jobseekers on this side and many have been hunting since early 2006 - perhaps longer.
4 I suggest that you think very carefully about paying for a type-rating. A TR without line experience is of limited value and many airlines prefer TRs to be conducted by an organisation that they have an arrangement with.
I'm genuinely sorry if this seems negative but wish you all the very best nevertheless.
Best regards bm
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Not negative at all man, but directly to the point - and I appreciate that. Thanks for the reply. I really don't see how you guys are able to do it. The cost of your flight training in the EU is at least twice what we Yanks pay for ours, and most of the time it is almost impossible for someone here in the US to even get a full loan of the estimated $60k for complete flight training. Then, the loan repayments typically require a monthly payback of anywhere between $600-$800 per month. Even when we get hired on by the regional airlines, the first 3 years of annual salary is $25k first year, $29k second year, and $32k for the third year as an FO. That is, when the US airlines are hiring. And that isn't expected to happen again for another 4 or 5 years.
I'm afraid there will be a good generation of us that might never get a shot at living the dream.
At this point, the closest thing that I can get to it is teaching Indians how to fly small GA aircraft. And, if I make it out alive... Our Indian friends, for the most part, are not very fond of spinning an aircraft. However, the concept of keeping the ball centered while stalling the aircraft is not something that comes natural for the majority of Indian students.
I'm afraid there will be a good generation of us that might never get a shot at living the dream.
At this point, the closest thing that I can get to it is teaching Indians how to fly small GA aircraft. And, if I make it out alive... Our Indian friends, for the most part, are not very fond of spinning an aircraft. However, the concept of keeping the ball centered while stalling the aircraft is not something that comes natural for the majority of Indian students.
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N reg
N-Reg looks like the most cost effective route for you bro.
The only problem is, if you're not here looking for them there is no way you'll find n-regs on the internet.
I've been through the conversions myself and landed a left seat job in the UK but it was no walk in the park.
It took me almost a year of "harassing" people to get a job.
You are pretty low time and that works against you as well.
I wish I had better news.
Good luck with your hunt.
If you need anything just pm me.
Cheers
The only problem is, if you're not here looking for them there is no way you'll find n-regs on the internet.
I've been through the conversions myself and landed a left seat job in the UK but it was no walk in the park.
It took me almost a year of "harassing" people to get a job.
You are pretty low time and that works against you as well.
I wish I had better news.
Good luck with your hunt.
If you need anything just pm me.
Cheers
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Well I don't think you are that different from anyone on this side of the pond 
Therefore I'd say you've got just as good a chance to get through the training and land a job as any other. In fact coupled with your dual experience from both the US and eventually the UK you should be quite rounded. There are of course many in the UK that will look down/discourage you from doing this but dismiss because it's the gameplan that should be the most effective route to a seat in the cockpit.
In the end it's up to you but I wish you well my friend.
Therefore I'd say you've got just as good a chance to get through the training and land a job as any other. In fact coupled with your dual experience from both the US and eventually the UK you should be quite rounded. There are of course many in the UK that will look down/discourage you from doing this but dismiss because it's the gameplan that should be the most effective route to a seat in the cockpit. In the end it's up to you but I wish you well my friend.
