Self Sponsored Type Rating With Line Hours
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Purchasing a Type Rating
If you must go down the self sponsor type rating route, why not try the Ryanair scheme for type rating B.737 pilots, at least you get a job at the end of the training, should you come up to their training standards.
Standards which i am told are closely monitored by the IAA.
Ryanair are not the most popular choice, but I know that they are very selective in whom they take and that many guys are getting their first job with them, and building hours, whilst not earning high salaries initially the potential after reaching 1500 hours as an F/O is higher than some new Captains make at 3000 hours.
No I am not employed by Ryanair, or connected with them but many of my fellow pilots have joined them and are happy with the work and the New 5/4 rosters.
If you pay for a rating you could get advice from people in the industry before committing your hard earned cash.
Some Training Managers were not happy with the product from some training establishments, and found that the pilots had to be re-trained almost from scratch to achieve the required standards.
Low Cost training = BIG RISK = Lower Job prospects.
Most airlines prefer to do their own training or go through organisations like CTC who have a proven track record.
The moral of this story is, Research before you Buy.
Standards which i am told are closely monitored by the IAA.
Ryanair are not the most popular choice, but I know that they are very selective in whom they take and that many guys are getting their first job with them, and building hours, whilst not earning high salaries initially the potential after reaching 1500 hours as an F/O is higher than some new Captains make at 3000 hours.
No I am not employed by Ryanair, or connected with them but many of my fellow pilots have joined them and are happy with the work and the New 5/4 rosters.
If you pay for a rating you could get advice from people in the industry before committing your hard earned cash.
Some Training Managers were not happy with the product from some training establishments, and found that the pilots had to be re-trained almost from scratch to achieve the required standards.
Low Cost training = BIG RISK = Lower Job prospects.
Most airlines prefer to do their own training or go through organisations like CTC who have a proven track record.
The moral of this story is, Research before you Buy.
Join Date: Aug 2006
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My advice for the day, be aware that if it worked for a friend/somebody does not mean it will work for you.
We are different, different personnality, hours, experience, attitude etc
Don't do a SSTR just because you know your neiborghood did it or because you read something on this forum (Professional PIlots Rumours Network)
Be vigilant, be yourself and listen to yourself only : your goal, lifestyle, network etc
So if you don't have enough money in this case be very very careful how you will spend it.
We are different, different personnality, hours, experience, attitude etc
Don't do a SSTR just because you know your neiborghood did it or because you read something on this forum (Professional PIlots Rumours Network)
Be vigilant, be yourself and listen to yourself only : your goal, lifestyle, network etc
So if you don't have enough money in this case be very very careful how you will spend it.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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the time you finish your type rating, the market will be overloaded with low time pilot (less than 1500h),type rating and line training.
with this, even a type rating and 300h, it is not easy to find a job view that everybody soon will have 300 h on type and low hours(total time).
years ago, they wanted MCC. then they asked for the t/r, today they ask for 300/500h on type, tomorrow they will ask you 1000h on type,...
ask you friends who fly since 20-30 years, they will tell you the same.
The time you finish your type rating, you will discover you need more hours on type...
better to keep your money, and look for a company which pay all or instruct as a FI.
with this, even a type rating and 300h, it is not easy to find a job view that everybody soon will have 300 h on type and low hours(total time).
years ago, they wanted MCC. then they asked for the t/r, today they ask for 300/500h on type, tomorrow they will ask you 1000h on type,...
ask you friends who fly since 20-30 years, they will tell you the same.
The time you finish your type rating, you will discover you need more hours on type...
better to keep your money, and look for a company which pay all or instruct as a FI.
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: canada
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being a canadian pilot i'm new to this strange e.u. system of sstr and line hours.
i understand paying for a tr and how that works, but what are line hours? does that mean you pay an air carrier to be a co-pilot on their revenue runs and build time after a tr?
can someone summarize the path to being employed as a f/o, ie: what happens after your fatpl and mcc course are completed?
pk
i understand paying for a tr and how that works, but what are line hours? does that mean you pay an air carrier to be a co-pilot on their revenue runs and build time after a tr?
can someone summarize the path to being employed as a f/o, ie: what happens after your fatpl and mcc course are completed?
pk
Join Date: Feb 2004
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SSTR
PK.
Some training organisations offer line training with no or little renumeration.
In some instances i've heard of the trainees paying for their own drinks/meals onboard and paying for their accommodation down route.
You can buy as much line training as you want. Some people take 5-10 hours others take 100 or more.
You will be trained in that respective airlines SOPs.
Once you've done your MCC and got your FATPL, it's a choice of paths to take to get that illusive 1st job.
Instructing is a great way of honing your skills, improving your flying, building hours, meeting people, flying different types etc. Most importantly, in the eyes of the CFI who may interview you, it's a way you can pass on your knowledge to teach others to fly....!!!
(CFI - Q: Why do you want to instruct? A: To teach others to fly. CFI Welcome aboard.....) It can be that easy.....was for me providing I performed in the check out.
The long-winded debate about the rights and wrongs of SSTRs is here to stay and it's the individuals choice entirely like anything in life and aviation training.
No-one says anyone has to do an FI, there's not always a guarantee there that the training provider will give you a job at the end of it, they might not like you as a person.
No-one says anyone has to do an SSTR, it's your choice again, jobs are far from guaranteed.
The market is now being flooded as others have said.
I did an SSTR and got a bunch of job offers with no line time on type.
Right place, right time, face fits....?!?
It got me the job......
Some training organisations offer line training with no or little renumeration.
In some instances i've heard of the trainees paying for their own drinks/meals onboard and paying for their accommodation down route.
You can buy as much line training as you want. Some people take 5-10 hours others take 100 or more.
You will be trained in that respective airlines SOPs.
Once you've done your MCC and got your FATPL, it's a choice of paths to take to get that illusive 1st job.
Instructing is a great way of honing your skills, improving your flying, building hours, meeting people, flying different types etc. Most importantly, in the eyes of the CFI who may interview you, it's a way you can pass on your knowledge to teach others to fly....!!!
(CFI - Q: Why do you want to instruct? A: To teach others to fly. CFI Welcome aboard.....) It can be that easy.....was for me providing I performed in the check out.
The long-winded debate about the rights and wrongs of SSTRs is here to stay and it's the individuals choice entirely like anything in life and aviation training.
No-one says anyone has to do an FI, there's not always a guarantee there that the training provider will give you a job at the end of it, they might not like you as a person.
No-one says anyone has to do an SSTR, it's your choice again, jobs are far from guaranteed.
The market is now being flooded as others have said.
I did an SSTR and got a bunch of job offers with no line time on type.
Right place, right time, face fits....?!?
It got me the job......
Join Date: Dec 2006
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thanks for the info capt y&b,
to elaborate on this "line hour" practice... what does it cost to do something like that? wouldn't it be free and in return you'd work for free? how is this arranged? are there any airlines that hire you right after you've completed an mcc?
i have just over 1000 hrs all on light aircraft, does that put me in a good position with respect to 'hire-ability' for lack of a better term?
pk
to elaborate on this "line hour" practice... what does it cost to do something like that? wouldn't it be free and in return you'd work for free? how is this arranged? are there any airlines that hire you right after you've completed an mcc?
i have just over 1000 hrs all on light aircraft, does that put me in a good position with respect to 'hire-ability' for lack of a better term?
pk
Join Date: Feb 2004
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PK.
Where are you considering trying for jobs?
1000 hours on light aircraft is good but has it been useful flying ie instructing etc? Sometimes too many hours can be a disadvantage if it has just been zipping around the local area etc. Good flying is cross country flights, flying in controlled airspace etc. I used to talk to myself all the time
whilst flying, reminding myself of scans and checklists etc, think about my techniques and improve upon weaker area's etc, that'd be most of my flying then...!!! 
I don't know how most TRTO's work with their line flying but the one that I am aware of charged you to fly the line as an F/O, something like GBP10000 for 100 hours and you did not get paid. If they liked you, if you were any good then they might offer you a job or put you in a hold pool whereby you can swim for months or longer.
As I said in my previous post, instructing is an excellent way to build hours and improve your knowledge and techniques.
It's a tough industry to get in to but once you're in it's like winning lotto.
With a 1000 hours on light aircraft i'd go for the commuter airlines, turboprop operators, air taxi companies etc, by all means try the jet operators, you might be lucky.
If you do consider doing an SSTR, research it VERY carefully, choose the TRTO wisely, read the contract & T&C's VERY carefully so you know exactly what you will be getting and don't run up against any nasty surprises. Try to pay as little as possible up front and pay in parts just so if they did go belly up you aren't left with a big hole in your pocket and nothing to show for it.
Cheers.
Where are you considering trying for jobs?
1000 hours on light aircraft is good but has it been useful flying ie instructing etc? Sometimes too many hours can be a disadvantage if it has just been zipping around the local area etc. Good flying is cross country flights, flying in controlled airspace etc. I used to talk to myself all the time
whilst flying, reminding myself of scans and checklists etc, think about my techniques and improve upon weaker area's etc, that'd be most of my flying then...!!! I don't know how most TRTO's work with their line flying but the one that I am aware of charged you to fly the line as an F/O, something like GBP10000 for 100 hours and you did not get paid. If they liked you, if you were any good then they might offer you a job or put you in a hold pool whereby you can swim for months or longer.
As I said in my previous post, instructing is an excellent way to build hours and improve your knowledge and techniques.
It's a tough industry to get in to but once you're in it's like winning lotto.
With a 1000 hours on light aircraft i'd go for the commuter airlines, turboprop operators, air taxi companies etc, by all means try the jet operators, you might be lucky.
If you do consider doing an SSTR, research it VERY carefully, choose the TRTO wisely, read the contract & T&C's VERY carefully so you know exactly what you will be getting and don't run up against any nasty surprises. Try to pay as little as possible up front and pay in parts just so if they did go belly up you aren't left with a big hole in your pocket and nothing to show for it.
Cheers.
Join Date: Feb 2003
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A Type rating and a minimum of 100 hours on type, is the entry level for expatriate First Officers in India.
This is required by the DGCA and is not negotiable.
However the carriers are crying out for pilots as their networks grow, so the risk of not getting a job after training is lower than some here would like you to believe.
I was out there at a time when flights were being grounded and routes not taken up, due to the lack of pilots.
If you can raise the money for a type rating and line training, its a good route to take as yes you do improve your chances of obtaining that first airline job.
Going to India or China to work is not for everybody, but If you can put up with being out of your home environment for a couple of years, you will get a wealth of experience and the hours to return possibly to your dream job at home.
There will always be people here on pprune who will run down anyone proposing this route, some who cannot afford this option and others who believe the world owes them and their new licence a living.
Its my strong suggestion that a proactive approach to job seeking, is the only way to land that first job, and anything that puts you that bit ahead of the others can only be good for you.
Don't let the minority on here influence your decision.
Look at the facts over 30 pilots have been hired by Ryanair from OAA alone this year all on the Self Sponsored Type Rating scheme, Plus there are many more from other training schools both integrated and modular.
The SSTR is here for the forseeable future and the choice is relatively simple, pay and fly your dream or sit and wait for some HR department to finally get to you on their long list of wannabees.
This is required by the DGCA and is not negotiable.
However the carriers are crying out for pilots as their networks grow, so the risk of not getting a job after training is lower than some here would like you to believe.
I was out there at a time when flights were being grounded and routes not taken up, due to the lack of pilots.
If you can raise the money for a type rating and line training, its a good route to take as yes you do improve your chances of obtaining that first airline job.
Going to India or China to work is not for everybody, but If you can put up with being out of your home environment for a couple of years, you will get a wealth of experience and the hours to return possibly to your dream job at home.
There will always be people here on pprune who will run down anyone proposing this route, some who cannot afford this option and others who believe the world owes them and their new licence a living.
Its my strong suggestion that a proactive approach to job seeking, is the only way to land that first job, and anything that puts you that bit ahead of the others can only be good for you.
Don't let the minority on here influence your decision.
Look at the facts over 30 pilots have been hired by Ryanair from OAA alone this year all on the Self Sponsored Type Rating scheme, Plus there are many more from other training schools both integrated and modular.
The SSTR is here for the forseeable future and the choice is relatively simple, pay and fly your dream or sit and wait for some HR department to finally get to you on their long list of wannabees.
