The CTC Wings (Cadets) Thread - Part 2.
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I for one enjoyed reading your post EvelcyclopS. Sorry to hear about your disappointment with the flying career but trust your current job is treating you well.
[Grammar Pedant]
Paragraphs would have saved my eyes a little though
[/Grammar pedant]
[Grammar Pedant]
Paragraphs would have saved my eyes a little though
[/Grammar pedant]
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A good post EvelcyclopS. It's amazing, the people that say they have decided to leave commercial flying alone are without question the most reasoned, factual, sensible people I have heard within the industry and probably the ones who SHOULD go for it. They ignore their emotions and look at the facts - a quality that would see you good in non-normal flight. For what it is worth I do think you have made the right choice - you shouldn't mix business and pleasure and that is what has happened to this industry and I can assure you, ruined it beyond repair.
I maintain that you'd be crazy......no I'll be nice, you'd be brave to go near CTC within the next 9-10 months, these will be their most telling (and NOT because I have anything against them) - and rest assured 9 -10 months (especially now) will not make you miss the boat. It says alot about people how they are when they are winning and they are losing - look how all the FTOs have been in these terrible times i.e. one of the toughest times to place a pilot in the history of aviation (relatively speaking and for all the wrong reasons) and with people becoming ever more uncurrent and ever more disheartened. If they wanted this to be, it should be an opportunity for them and any other FTO to be the ONLY choice - sacrifice a relatively small amount of income now for a large amount in the future. There should be people coming on here and fighting for their FTOs, saying how loyal and supportive they have been. Instead it is nothing but bent truths, 'selling' and manipulation. And that is across all integrated FTOs.
Luck IS timing, get it right and you'll be very happy with life, get it wrong and you'll be one of those 'life is unfair' types - and no not like me! Don't rush into things, be lucky.
I maintain that you'd be crazy......no I'll be nice, you'd be brave to go near CTC within the next 9-10 months, these will be their most telling (and NOT because I have anything against them) - and rest assured 9 -10 months (especially now) will not make you miss the boat. It says alot about people how they are when they are winning and they are losing - look how all the FTOs have been in these terrible times i.e. one of the toughest times to place a pilot in the history of aviation (relatively speaking and for all the wrong reasons) and with people becoming ever more uncurrent and ever more disheartened. If they wanted this to be, it should be an opportunity for them and any other FTO to be the ONLY choice - sacrifice a relatively small amount of income now for a large amount in the future. There should be people coming on here and fighting for their FTOs, saying how loyal and supportive they have been. Instead it is nothing but bent truths, 'selling' and manipulation. And that is across all integrated FTOs.
Luck IS timing, get it right and you'll be very happy with life, get it wrong and you'll be one of those 'life is unfair' types - and no not like me! Don't rush into things, be lucky.
There should be people coming on here and fighting for their FTOs
But I don't owe them anything, I paid them a lot of money and now I have a well paid job on an Airbus. The course for me did what it said on the tin. I wouldn't recommend anyone start an integrated course with any FTO right now. It is nothing against CTC, I just think paying silly money up front in these turbulent times, particularly when it's secured against a property of some sort (as it is with many people) is complete idiocy. Just my opinion.
When times are good, I will be on here proclaiming CTC's name loud and clear.
EvelcyclopS a thousand thank you's. Truly you are a hero. You came, you saw, you left AND you posted about it. The vast vast majority do not post about leaving. Many do, its the best decision, but they have no incentive to relate the fact.
You would have made a fine commercial pilot.
CTC like all flying schools at present are merely following airlines in their fight for survival.
Best of luck in your new endeavours,
WWW
You would have made a fine commercial pilot.
CTC like all flying schools at present are merely following airlines in their fight for survival.
Best of luck in your new endeavours,
WWW
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In response to a previous question I got posted the following information in a PM.....
Some very good inside / honest information for anyone currently considering spending serious money on a CTC course.
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Hello there, I'd prefer to stay anonymous but feel free to post this:
To the best of my knowledge, there are roughly 70-80 cadets in the official hold pool, this includes 15 ATP and 5 Wings cadets who have already done a white-tail A320 type rating. This is set to grow by 14 people a month.
I was told by someone that the ATP guys got to do the TR instead of Wings Cadets because they had been in the Pool for more then a year.
Dropping guys after 12 months would be pretty bad PR for CTC and tragic for cadets. We did sign the contract that stated they could do this though.
easyJet took 70 cadets this year as Flexicrew. Will they need new cadets as well as the current Flexicrew for next summer? Will they even need the FC guys back?!
BA/Thomson won't be hiring for at least 2-3 years.
Not sure about the other airlines, anyone care to comment on the situation at Thomas Cook, Monarch, Jet2, DHL, CityJet, JetStar?
Aer Lingus took guys recently. However they are cutting LH routes and transfering LH pilots to SH so I don't think there's much scope for placement at the moment.
I do think CTC are doing all they can to place people. Like you already said though, they can't force airlines to take us on. There is only so much CTC can do at times like this, the industry at the moment is terrible.
Good luck to everyone, we definitely need it.
Some very good inside / honest information for anyone currently considering spending serious money on a CTC course.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello there, I'd prefer to stay anonymous but feel free to post this:
To the best of my knowledge, there are roughly 70-80 cadets in the official hold pool, this includes 15 ATP and 5 Wings cadets who have already done a white-tail A320 type rating. This is set to grow by 14 people a month.
I was told by someone that the ATP guys got to do the TR instead of Wings Cadets because they had been in the Pool for more then a year.
Dropping guys after 12 months would be pretty bad PR for CTC and tragic for cadets. We did sign the contract that stated they could do this though.
easyJet took 70 cadets this year as Flexicrew. Will they need new cadets as well as the current Flexicrew for next summer? Will they even need the FC guys back?!
BA/Thomson won't be hiring for at least 2-3 years.
Not sure about the other airlines, anyone care to comment on the situation at Thomas Cook, Monarch, Jet2, DHL, CityJet, JetStar?
Aer Lingus took guys recently. However they are cutting LH routes and transfering LH pilots to SH so I don't think there's much scope for placement at the moment.
I do think CTC are doing all they can to place people. Like you already said though, they can't force airlines to take us on. There is only so much CTC can do at times like this, the industry at the moment is terrible.
Good luck to everyone, we definitely need it.
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Cheers 99jolegg much more helpful
Also I don't know if these have ever been posted about, I'd be surprised if at least one of them hasn't but there definitely worth a look.
Petition to: Freeze student pilot loans until such time that the economy and therefore aviation industry recovers and we can find work. | Number10.gov.uk
Petition to: award official student status to british trainee professional pilots... | Number10.gov.uk
Also I don't know if these have ever been posted about, I'd be surprised if at least one of them hasn't but there definitely worth a look.
Petition to: Freeze student pilot loans until such time that the economy and therefore aviation industry recovers and we can find work. | Number10.gov.uk
Petition to: award official student status to british trainee professional pilots... | Number10.gov.uk
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EvelcyclopS - I don't usually comment on these but you're post sounded so familiar - good decision making mate.
I'm sure you won't look back. In fact, I'm willing to bet that in 10 years time - you'll be in a senior extremely well-paid position in your microbiology career with your own home (mortgage paid off), something that you'll almost certainly never achieve in aviation - and also hold a commercial pilot license. You will have gained your PPL + night + CPL over countless weekends of having fun at your local grass strip and then be instructing in your spare time.
I made that same decision as you back in 1999 and boy I'm so glad I did. The opportunities that I've had could never had been matched had I been financially shackled to an aviation career.
When I look at the people I know who hold commercial licenses - most of them have main careers in other industries.
I'm sure you won't look back. In fact, I'm willing to bet that in 10 years time - you'll be in a senior extremely well-paid position in your microbiology career with your own home (mortgage paid off), something that you'll almost certainly never achieve in aviation - and also hold a commercial pilot license. You will have gained your PPL + night + CPL over countless weekends of having fun at your local grass strip and then be instructing in your spare time.
I made that same decision as you back in 1999 and boy I'm so glad I did. The opportunities that I've had could never had been matched had I been financially shackled to an aviation career.
When I look at the people I know who hold commercial licenses - most of them have main careers in other industries.
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From the desk of The Supreme Leader (with apologies to Private Eye)
Hello Cadets (UK and NZ)
As you are aware, we introduced the Zenbu internet system on June 1 – this was introduced to curb the excessive internet use for non-training and communications home by cadets in CTC accommodation. Most of you realise that NZ is limited in internet usage and does not have an option by any IT provider for unlimited usage. The new government has recently awarded contracts to Australia to improve the availability and speed in NZ, and this investment will take a few years.
We provide the internet for training reasons, in particular, Tracker, Weather Info, accessing Air Law, NOTAMS and the Schedule and recognise the need for contact with home.
Last week Zenbu started to have faults at Clearways and Peachgrove, this continued for 4 days with our IT Company initially unable to pinpoint the problem.
It has now been determined that the faults have been caused by cadets ‘hacking’ into Zenbu or trying to bypass it for free internet. The Peachgrove IT cupboard had been forced open, our system reset and our timer removed. This abuse of CTC property is totally unacceptable as is the hacking into any IT system in use at CTC.
Out of respect of cadets needs for contact home and study – we changed from Zenbu back to ordinary free internet, until problems were resolved on the Zenbu system.
Using recently introduced monitoring tools we can see that within 1 hour of switching back to the free internet, some cadets were downloading at extreme rates and we were able to pinpoint these cadets as well as what sites they were downloading from. One cadet downloaded 4.2GB in less than 10 hours (extrapolate that out to a month and it is 120GB for a month for that cadet). Downloads were from sites clearly not approved at CTC.
All of the above behaviour from cadets is totally unacceptable – our records show it is mostly 20% of cadets using 80% of the internet bandwidth. CTC showed respect to cadets by quickly switching you to free internet whilst problems with Zenbu (caused by cadet interference) were resolved. CTC expects the same respect from cadets, and that the policy you all signed on arrival is observed.
From today, any cadet found downloading to the extreme and accessing sites that are prohibited by CTC policy (decided solely at CTC's discretion) will be instantly disconnected from the internet and immediately suspended from training under grounds of “gross misconduct” and will attend a DHoW review to assess suitability to continue on the programme.
Any cadet identified as having hacked into the CTC IT system or tried to circumvent Zenbu or any other monitoring system put in place will immediately be suspended from training under grounds of “gross misconduct” and will attend a DHoW review to assess suitability to continue on the programme.
Cadets are reminded that anyone terminated from the programme on the grounds of gross misconduct WILL NOT receive any failure protection.
Do not under estimate how seriously CTC is taking this issue – if, as an employee in almost any business, including an airline, you were caught downloading pornography or hacking into an IT system you could expect instant dismissal and likely face criminal charges – your training here should be considered to be the same sort of environment.
This problem can be controlled by the sensible and professional 80% of you not tolerating what the other 20% are doing – help us control or eliminate these people from our training organisation – the consequences for you all will only become more severe if the individuals causing these issues are not curbed.
Please read this and absorb the contents well – our patience on this issue is at an end.
Regards
As you are aware, we introduced the Zenbu internet system on June 1 – this was introduced to curb the excessive internet use for non-training and communications home by cadets in CTC accommodation. Most of you realise that NZ is limited in internet usage and does not have an option by any IT provider for unlimited usage. The new government has recently awarded contracts to Australia to improve the availability and speed in NZ, and this investment will take a few years.
We provide the internet for training reasons, in particular, Tracker, Weather Info, accessing Air Law, NOTAMS and the Schedule and recognise the need for contact with home.
Last week Zenbu started to have faults at Clearways and Peachgrove, this continued for 4 days with our IT Company initially unable to pinpoint the problem.
It has now been determined that the faults have been caused by cadets ‘hacking’ into Zenbu or trying to bypass it for free internet. The Peachgrove IT cupboard had been forced open, our system reset and our timer removed. This abuse of CTC property is totally unacceptable as is the hacking into any IT system in use at CTC.
Out of respect of cadets needs for contact home and study – we changed from Zenbu back to ordinary free internet, until problems were resolved on the Zenbu system.
Using recently introduced monitoring tools we can see that within 1 hour of switching back to the free internet, some cadets were downloading at extreme rates and we were able to pinpoint these cadets as well as what sites they were downloading from. One cadet downloaded 4.2GB in less than 10 hours (extrapolate that out to a month and it is 120GB for a month for that cadet). Downloads were from sites clearly not approved at CTC.
All of the above behaviour from cadets is totally unacceptable – our records show it is mostly 20% of cadets using 80% of the internet bandwidth. CTC showed respect to cadets by quickly switching you to free internet whilst problems with Zenbu (caused by cadet interference) were resolved. CTC expects the same respect from cadets, and that the policy you all signed on arrival is observed.
From today, any cadet found downloading to the extreme and accessing sites that are prohibited by CTC policy (decided solely at CTC's discretion) will be instantly disconnected from the internet and immediately suspended from training under grounds of “gross misconduct” and will attend a DHoW review to assess suitability to continue on the programme.
Any cadet identified as having hacked into the CTC IT system or tried to circumvent Zenbu or any other monitoring system put in place will immediately be suspended from training under grounds of “gross misconduct” and will attend a DHoW review to assess suitability to continue on the programme.
Cadets are reminded that anyone terminated from the programme on the grounds of gross misconduct WILL NOT receive any failure protection.
Do not under estimate how seriously CTC is taking this issue – if, as an employee in almost any business, including an airline, you were caught downloading pornography or hacking into an IT system you could expect instant dismissal and likely face criminal charges – your training here should be considered to be the same sort of environment.
This problem can be controlled by the sensible and professional 80% of you not tolerating what the other 20% are doing – help us control or eliminate these people from our training organisation – the consequences for you all will only become more severe if the individuals causing these issues are not curbed.
Please read this and absorb the contents well – our patience on this issue is at an end.
Regards
Absolutely bloody farcical.
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A mate of mine sent me this
Presumably, all those cadets out there who happen to say something CTC find distasteful, so defined "solely at CTC's discretion" will also be sent to the gulag or to toil in the salt mines.
Pprune is listed as one of their 'approved sites', so I don't think they're trying to hinder our 'freedom of expression'. Let's be honest, CTC have their hands full (and some) and doubt very much they would be hiring a crack team of specialists to decipher and censor our emails and other internet traffic. They seemingly will only take issue with the website (eg. porn.com) or volume of traffic.
The internet, before they brought in Zenbu, was abysmal; slower than dialup. At least some restriction on downloading has freed up bandwidth for those who want to check their emails/speak to family on Skype etc.
It's not the best situation to be in but I personally have greater things to worry about (training, job markets, what's on for dinner etc)
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Kerosine. I think you miss the point. It is yet another example of CTC's appalling record of communication with cadets. Who could forget the time the CFO in NZ turned the internet off at Clearways without telling anyone, saying "You are here to study, not to surf the internet."
Further, the fact that CTC talk about internet "misuse" constituting "gross misconduct" and threatening offending cadets with suspension from training is just ludicrous. Those out in NZ are, and have always been, customers of CTC; they ARE NOT employees. I look forward to their first attempt to chop, without a refund, a cadet on the grounds of internet misuse.
Further, the fact that CTC talk about internet "misuse" constituting "gross misconduct" and threatening offending cadets with suspension from training is just ludicrous. Those out in NZ are, and have always been, customers of CTC; they ARE NOT employees. I look forward to their first attempt to chop, without a refund, a cadet on the grounds of internet misuse.
Who could forget the time the CFO in NZ turned the internet off at Clearways without telling anyone, saying "You are here to study, not to surf the internet."
Like I said in an earlier post I'll always defend their standard of training, but this sort of thing is where CTC let themselves down. I understand the problems, I was as frustrated as anyone when the internet repeatedly broke due to people going OTT on BitTorrent, but their response to things like this usually consists of wield sledgehammer first, ask questions later.
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Now that is funny! What is wrong with guys downloading a bit of porn? You ship them 12000 miles away from their girlfriends/wives/boyfriends
and expect them never to have a Tommy? They need material for goodness sake. That would be hilarious (initially at least) if someone was kicked off this course for masturbating over porn watched over CTCs internet. Who indirectly pays for the internet anyway?
and expect them never to have a Tommy? They need material for goodness sake. That would be hilarious (initially at least) if someone was kicked off this course for masturbating over porn watched over CTCs internet. Who indirectly pays for the internet anyway?