Flying Instructor or Airline Pilot????
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Sorry, but I'm not the kind of person who sucks up to people to 'make contacts'. I do know a number of people who work for the airlines but no-one in a position to actually help me. As for getting recommended by the school, it's a bit late for that now since I finished years ago!
Indeed. Well I have worked in aviation for a few years now and having been an ATPL groundschool instructor I have seen many morons somehow get qualified. I have encountered many people who I would be terrified to fly as a passenger with myself. Out of the many people I have seen qualify, I would definitely put myself nearer the top of the pile than the bottom.
Anyway, this is all academic since as I've said, I'm not going to bother with the airlines. I can always go into it later when I'm older and tired of being shot at!
TB
there is little hope or they need a severe reality check and ask themselves the tough question as to what they are doing wrong
Anyway, this is all academic since as I've said, I'm not going to bother with the airlines. I can always go into it later when I'm older and tired of being shot at!
TB
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Thomsonfly, Easyjet, Jet2, Ryanair, Aer Arran, BA, Aer Lingus, Eastern, BMI & Flybe
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Right place wrong time...
TB I'll second your 'no sucking up' rule and add that to the 'don't pay for your own type rating' rule that I abide by.
I completed the ATPL g/s and modular flying in record time of 6mths excl the xmas break all in an effort to get to CTC before I was too old. Having achieved that target, they stopped recruiting! Fantastic!
To date I've sent out circa100 applications, played the game and got about 20% reply rate; all No thanks/ not recruiting/ not enough experience, blah blah..
In the course of all of this no-one has been more aware that making contacts can be helpful or even vital but i will and do stop short of shining the shoes of CFI's and line pilots who are friend of friends!
So Airline pilot or Instructor? Without a well paid job in hand with which to create oodles of disposible wedge and fly up and down the continent for the sake of it, I'm off to do an F.I. rating and try to assist those with the big ambition or spare time to learn to fly tin cans around southern Britain. In that way I can stay aloft without paying for it and build experience. Lets face it, aviation is there to be enjoyed and we all get more real flying in 1 ton machines whether you sit in the reight or the left seat.
I completed the ATPL g/s and modular flying in record time of 6mths excl the xmas break all in an effort to get to CTC before I was too old. Having achieved that target, they stopped recruiting! Fantastic!
To date I've sent out circa100 applications, played the game and got about 20% reply rate; all No thanks/ not recruiting/ not enough experience, blah blah..
In the course of all of this no-one has been more aware that making contacts can be helpful or even vital but i will and do stop short of shining the shoes of CFI's and line pilots who are friend of friends!
So Airline pilot or Instructor? Without a well paid job in hand with which to create oodles of disposible wedge and fly up and down the continent for the sake of it, I'm off to do an F.I. rating and try to assist those with the big ambition or spare time to learn to fly tin cans around southern Britain. In that way I can stay aloft without paying for it and build experience. Lets face it, aviation is there to be enjoyed and we all get more real flying in 1 ton machines whether you sit in the reight or the left seat.
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Yes sadly, there are a group of people extremely eager to pay for their TR but often it is a financially sound decision for those involved. One particular guy I've met laid down the maths for me. For him to go the TR way made perfect sense...
Option A.) go and instruct for a year, earning around £12k. Advantage lots of hours gained but live a very poor life, risking and jeapordising everything you own.
Option B.) Stay in your current profession and earn enough money to build around 100 hours a year (plenty), enough cash for a TR and a holiday for the kids with no financial worries.
Fact: A TR is just as likely to get you a job in this current climate as being an FI is.
Hence in my opinion why option B) is fast becoming the norm.
Option A.) go and instruct for a year, earning around £12k. Advantage lots of hours gained but live a very poor life, risking and jeapordising everything you own.
Option B.) Stay in your current profession and earn enough money to build around 100 hours a year (plenty), enough cash for a TR and a holiday for the kids with no financial worries.
Fact: A TR is just as likely to get you a job in this current climate as being an FI is.
Hence in my opinion why option B) is fast becoming the norm.
Last edited by Superpilot; 29th May 2007 at 08:07.
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Well if I compare my life as an FI, and life as an airline pilot:
As an FI I flew 6 days a week with no planned break in the day. It was hard work, dangerous at times while flying ****e aircraft. It was very satisfying when you saw a student improve, however often the job was frustrating. After 1 year I had had enough of the whole thing. The really good side was working with great people, meeting lots of interesting / different people etc.
As an airline pilot I get paid much better, much more time off, I fly nice new jets to some interesting places etc. I just came back from the beach with the other pilots enjoying the med, having a swim, sunbathe, cheeky beer etc. A much better lifestyle. The job is still satisfying in a different way, rather than when you instruct you gain pleasure from your students gaining skills, in a selfish was I can now be happy with my own skills improving - a nice landing in a strong x-wind certainly puts a smile on my face.
I wouldn't be here right now if I didn't pay for a type rating. Further to my last report, I have since found out that the ONLY people from my fATPL course who have found jobs as airline pilots have self funded type ratings. That said I know people who have had type ratings paid for, however these have been on turboprops (talking first job here). Nothing wrong with that, but again I have seen people have to pay for type ratings when trying to go from TP to jet. Hey ho, it is a tricky business! I'm sure there are loads of people out there who get their TR's paid for and I am a chump for paying, such is life.
Good luck.
As an FI I flew 6 days a week with no planned break in the day. It was hard work, dangerous at times while flying ****e aircraft. It was very satisfying when you saw a student improve, however often the job was frustrating. After 1 year I had had enough of the whole thing. The really good side was working with great people, meeting lots of interesting / different people etc.
As an airline pilot I get paid much better, much more time off, I fly nice new jets to some interesting places etc. I just came back from the beach with the other pilots enjoying the med, having a swim, sunbathe, cheeky beer etc. A much better lifestyle. The job is still satisfying in a different way, rather than when you instruct you gain pleasure from your students gaining skills, in a selfish was I can now be happy with my own skills improving - a nice landing in a strong x-wind certainly puts a smile on my face.
I wouldn't be here right now if I didn't pay for a type rating. Further to my last report, I have since found out that the ONLY people from my fATPL course who have found jobs as airline pilots have self funded type ratings. That said I know people who have had type ratings paid for, however these have been on turboprops (talking first job here). Nothing wrong with that, but again I have seen people have to pay for type ratings when trying to go from TP to jet. Hey ho, it is a tricky business! I'm sure there are loads of people out there who get their TR's paid for and I am a chump for paying, such is life.
Good luck.
Don't know how long it takes for the airline buzz to wear off (watch this space), but in my experience of instructing 18 months full time is about the max. Any instructors doing more than that start to get increasingly frustrated. As luck would have it, this coincides with the 1000 hour + mark where airlines and other operators start to take you more seriously.
Strangely, having left a full time instructor job, it didn't take long til I started to miss it, so now doing a bit part time to tide me over and keep my hand in.
Wouldn't have missed my instructor experience, but to do it for the next 10 years - no thanks.
Strangely, having left a full time instructor job, it didn't take long til I started to miss it, so now doing a bit part time to tide me over and keep my hand in.
Wouldn't have missed my instructor experience, but to do it for the next 10 years - no thanks.
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Best of luck. I'm sure you will be flying for money or love. Just hope you remember to keep the balance and it will all be good - family, flying, friends. At the end of the day take care of her, and know how to do it, and the rest will be OK.
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Interesting question that, also interesting ` How long before the buzz wears off` Make no mistake it will wear off after a honeymoon period, how long that will be depends on the individual the same thing happens with many relationships, and how many of us have thought ` If I just buy that car I`ll keep it for years, I won`t get fed up with it. Its part of our mindset as human beings allways looking for the next gratifying thing, flying is normally only that. 20 years ago when I began flying in a Cessna 150 I thought ` wouldn`t it be great to do this for a living` drawn in by romantic notions of becoming an airline pilot so I did. I did not consider that it would become just another job with all the negatives that come with any work commitment.
I used to fly when I wanted to, when the weather was fine and the hours were civilised, once it becomes your occupation it takes on a whole new look.
I now fly on a part time basis which I find suits me far better I no longer wish to be tied to aviation full time as I find other pursuits just as interesting many of them more so. This is of course a personal opinion based on my experiences with various airlines. In todays climate with the `sell your soul to become a pilot` ethos that has become custom and practise, would I do it again, absolutely not, but now I have the benefit of hindsight and also the world was not such a `I want it now` every man for himself `kind of place and everything in society has been affected by that attitude, not good.
Peace out.
I used to fly when I wanted to, when the weather was fine and the hours were civilised, once it becomes your occupation it takes on a whole new look.
I now fly on a part time basis which I find suits me far better I no longer wish to be tied to aviation full time as I find other pursuits just as interesting many of them more so. This is of course a personal opinion based on my experiences with various airlines. In todays climate with the `sell your soul to become a pilot` ethos that has become custom and practise, would I do it again, absolutely not, but now I have the benefit of hindsight and also the world was not such a `I want it now` every man for himself `kind of place and everything in society has been affected by that attitude, not good.
Peace out.
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FNG
Hi everyone! (oh, not another one),
Nationality: GBR. Age: 32 (Single). Hours: 300 ASEL with IR. Got my ticket in Arizona when I was 18 years old. First-job-was-at-the-airport story and I soloed on my 16th birthday before I got my driver's license. Loved flying ever since I could break my brother's toys but ran out of cash at 19 and slowly, surely I have gained 300 hours.
Done a lot of living and learning in the last 14 years and well, it's time to do what I can't get out of my head. Only twist here is that I'm leaving my job in TV in Bangkok and heading off to Aussie to jump in and out of those juicy clouds down there. The usual questions rear their ugly head: Too old? Too inexperienced? I'm going to get my aussie CPL and license conversions done down there with a long term goal of emmigration and flying all over the GAFA (Great Australian Frig All).
They like to grew their own down there though and I just would like to know in a worldly wise aviation setting, where am I when it comes to getting on the ladder as a FI with a long term goal of regionals or majors?
Cheers,
Deano
Nationality: GBR. Age: 32 (Single). Hours: 300 ASEL with IR. Got my ticket in Arizona when I was 18 years old. First-job-was-at-the-airport story and I soloed on my 16th birthday before I got my driver's license. Loved flying ever since I could break my brother's toys but ran out of cash at 19 and slowly, surely I have gained 300 hours.
Done a lot of living and learning in the last 14 years and well, it's time to do what I can't get out of my head. Only twist here is that I'm leaving my job in TV in Bangkok and heading off to Aussie to jump in and out of those juicy clouds down there. The usual questions rear their ugly head: Too old? Too inexperienced? I'm going to get my aussie CPL and license conversions done down there with a long term goal of emmigration and flying all over the GAFA (Great Australian Frig All).
They like to grew their own down there though and I just would like to know in a worldly wise aviation setting, where am I when it comes to getting on the ladder as a FI with a long term goal of regionals or majors?
Cheers,
Deano
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hard to tell at the moment, I am at the point of deciding whether to do CPL and then FI, followed by the IR, after a season or two instructing. Mixed responses on here make the decision very hard indeed. Some say airlines are going mad for people, others are not being touched! Which way to go???
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Certainly a shortage of instructors at the moment, and it's hours that you get paid for. Schools less fussy than airlines so prospects of employment higher-that said they pay less!
B
B
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Very true indeed. I've even applied for this elusive Cabair Instructor Sponsorship. Now that is interesting. It has not materliased in to anything at the moment.
There is a thread running elsewhere, and the whole scheme has been very heavily marketed, but not even a sniff! I have heard though that it is being purely marketed at the moment, so time will tell. The guy to speak to is as difficult to get hold of as Mr Bin Laden! Possible scam alert.
Anyway back to the point, its all about risk. Instructing poses much less of a risk, however on the other side of the coin there are jobs out there.
There is a thread running elsewhere, and the whole scheme has been very heavily marketed, but not even a sniff! I have heard though that it is being purely marketed at the moment, so time will tell. The guy to speak to is as difficult to get hold of as Mr Bin Laden! Possible scam alert.
Anyway back to the point, its all about risk. Instructing poses much less of a risk, however on the other side of the coin there are jobs out there.
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Originally Posted by expedite08
I've even applied for this elusive Cabair Instructor Sponsorship.
The instructor sponsorhip is a good idea-something I may even consider myself when the time comes. Look at it from the other angle though, you go to Cabair as an instructor and maybe finish up teaching integrated guys on courses like the Flybe sponsorship. Now that's irony!
B
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sponsorship for FIC & lapsed licence
Would love to Go for that Cabair sponsorship if I had the experience just now - Good luck to you's!, I am 33 ive let my licence lapse and havent flown PIC for 3 years but now, I will do it again very shortly, I would like to gain my CPL and go FIC too. I will have to renew my licence and obviously take a skill test again. Does anyone Know if i'll have to sit any exams again??
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Question regarding original subject
Rather than starting a new post and getting yelled at, thought I would just ask here. Are the horror stories of the ghastly wages for flight instuctors also applicable to flight schools in the US? I have no illusions that I could possibly make what I'm making now, but was just looking from some input from this side of the pond. My stats - getting old(er) (looking at the big 30), already have bachelors, master's was in progress but on hold due to illness, current ocupation probably wouldn't allow for doing flying as a hobby (at least not beyond private/instrument). I am curious what the quality of life/salary range for career flight instructors is. As someone still not willing to part altogether with my flying dream but not wanting to rack up any more loans on education, or put undue stress on my marriage, I was wondering if career flight instruction was a reasonable route to pursue said flying dreams. Thoughts?? Advice?? Words of wisdom? Any thoughts from women in aviation who fly and have a work/life balance?
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Good discussion.
How about Flight Instructor (flying SEP VFR) v Commercial on a MEP type flying IFR/VFR (No type rating required)???
Let's say the Airline thing is just going nowhere for now and you need to get to the 500h milestone then the 1000h milestone for more interviews to come your way?
(Take out the cost factor for the FI rating).
Any clear advantages/disadvantages between these 2?
How about Flight Instructor (flying SEP VFR) v Commercial on a MEP type flying IFR/VFR (No type rating required)???
Let's say the Airline thing is just going nowhere for now and you need to get to the 500h milestone then the 1000h milestone for more interviews to come your way?
(Take out the cost factor for the FI rating).
Any clear advantages/disadvantages between these 2?
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hello
sir.... i am an aspiring pilot....and not even touched a plane yet...but still being an instructor xcites me....it can add to your knowledge and can contribute to the aviation industry too...
i wanted to ask you that can i become an instructor with only CFI(single engine) and earnings from that can sponsor my CFII and MEI...
also suggest how to go about selecting an academy...what are the parameters to look for....
ned advice!!!!! i ll be obliged to hear from you...
i wanted to ask you that can i become an instructor with only CFI(single engine) and earnings from that can sponsor my CFII and MEI...
also suggest how to go about selecting an academy...what are the parameters to look for....
ned advice!!!!! i ll be obliged to hear from you...
When I learned to fly, I was amazed at the number of fellow student pilots who aspired to a career in commercial aviation. I was a student pilot in the early 1970's, a member of Sportair Flying Club at Biggin Hill. I chose that club because they had interesting aircraft to fly, wooden taildraggers, biplanes, motorgliders. My longest distance flight (power, not gliding) has been my qualifying cross country for the PPL. I quickly learned to avoid the treadmill of night rating / IMC rating / etc. IMHO flying a single engined light aircraft at night is 
dangerous - not fun either.
I never saw my flying as anything but fun, and certainly not a reliable means of transport.
I learned some aerobatics, and flew mostly local flights.
I went on to fly gliders, acquiring a third share in an aerobatic Pilatus B-4, where I soon amassed more hours without an engine than I had with.
Throughout my passion for flying, there has been a determination to do it only for fun - never to be a slave to the addiction of flight.
The point of this is the realisation that the most enjoyable flying you will ever do is in light aircraft, whether instructing, or tugging gliders, or just kissing the turf gently with a perfect 3-point landing on a summer's evening on a sloping field.
Get a good job - earn enough to fly for fun - keep the addiction under control and enjoy. It doesn't need to be a ratrace.
But then I'm not a "Professional Pilot" - by choice.
dangerous - not fun either.I never saw my flying as anything but fun, and certainly not a reliable means of transport.
I learned some aerobatics, and flew mostly local flights.
I went on to fly gliders, acquiring a third share in an aerobatic Pilatus B-4, where I soon amassed more hours without an engine than I had with.
Throughout my passion for flying, there has been a determination to do it only for fun - never to be a slave to the addiction of flight.
The point of this is the realisation that the most enjoyable flying you will ever do is in light aircraft, whether instructing, or tugging gliders, or just kissing the turf gently with a perfect 3-point landing on a summer's evening on a sloping field.
Get a good job - earn enough to fly for fun - keep the addiction under control and enjoy. It doesn't need to be a ratrace.
But then I'm not a "Professional Pilot" - by choice.
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there are so many pilots with few hours and a type rating.
airlines are full for these next years. some have a waiting list of over 1 year.
it doesnt matter if you are a good pilot or not. it s just a question to be in the right place at the right time.
airlines are full for these next years. some have a waiting list of over 1 year.
it doesnt matter if you are a good pilot or not. it s just a question to be in the right place at the right time.