Airlines looking for pilots.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Thread Starter
Airlines looking for pilots.
The number of airlines now looking for pilots must be reaching an all time high - and it's only going to get better, as retirements spiral over the next 10 years or so.
Let's have look at who's recruiting around Asia...please feel free to add to the list:-
SILK AIR - Singapore - A320
TIGER AIRWAYS -Singapore - B737
AIR JAPAN - Japan - B767
SKY NET ASIA - Japan - B737
JAL EXPRESS - Japan - MD90
NIPPON CARGO AIRWAYS - Japan - B747 Classic
VIETNAM AIRLINES - Viet Nam - B767.B777
SHENZEN AIRLINES - China - B73NG
HAINAN AIRLINE - China - B73NG
AIR INDIA - India - B747
Airlines that are going to need pilots in the near future are either going to have to start recruiting NOW, or make considerably significant increases to their current employment terms & conditions to lure pilots away from their present employers.
Ever wondered WHY there aren't going to be nearly enough experienced pilots to go around?
One only need look at the way pilots have been abused and screwed over the past 7-8years (or so) to realise why so many have been DRIVEN AWAY from flying, and why prospective pilots see no reasonable return on their massive cash outlay required for BASIC training.
Aggressive management MAY have saved a few pennies along the way, but it's going to cost POUNDS to rectify the situation they've created!
Let's have look at who's recruiting around Asia...please feel free to add to the list:-
SILK AIR - Singapore - A320
TIGER AIRWAYS -Singapore - B737
AIR JAPAN - Japan - B767
SKY NET ASIA - Japan - B737
JAL EXPRESS - Japan - MD90
NIPPON CARGO AIRWAYS - Japan - B747 Classic
VIETNAM AIRLINES - Viet Nam - B767.B777
SHENZEN AIRLINES - China - B73NG
HAINAN AIRLINE - China - B73NG
AIR INDIA - India - B747
Airlines that are going to need pilots in the near future are either going to have to start recruiting NOW, or make considerably significant increases to their current employment terms & conditions to lure pilots away from their present employers.
Ever wondered WHY there aren't going to be nearly enough experienced pilots to go around?
One only need look at the way pilots have been abused and screwed over the past 7-8years (or so) to realise why so many have been DRIVEN AWAY from flying, and why prospective pilots see no reasonable return on their massive cash outlay required for BASIC training.
Aggressive management MAY have saved a few pennies along the way, but it's going to cost POUNDS to rectify the situation they've created!
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Kaptin, how could you forget Cathay and Dragon?
See inside back cover of this week's Fllight for article on recuitment and the coming upturn.
Good News for once I hope.
See inside back cover of this week's Fllight for article on recuitment and the coming upturn.
Good News for once I hope.
Plus in Europe (Actually just Britain!)...
Easyjet
Britania/Thomsonfly
Ryanair
British Airways
Virgin....
Things DO seem to be on the up...
Easyjet
Britania/Thomsonfly
Ryanair
British Airways
Virgin....
Things DO seem to be on the up...
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Out of the Turboprop on your own? Diffucult but not impossible. Try as many operators you know. One day the requirement will
drop and you would be able to get a position. First the market will absorb the qualified and current pilots. After the operators cannot fill the seats then typeratings with training bonds will be offered. Sit tight and wait ..... Singapore, Quatar and more are already given convertions and they are still not get enough Pilots.
Good luck
NG
drop and you would be able to get a position. First the market will absorb the qualified and current pilots. After the operators cannot fill the seats then typeratings with training bonds will be offered. Sit tight and wait ..... Singapore, Quatar and more are already given convertions and they are still not get enough Pilots.
Good luck
NG
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thats all great but most of these companies want jet time or a rating .Both i dont have 
close to 4.000 hours lots of turbine and PIC but thats it .
.....University degree in psychology ......Nobody cares about LOL
i keep slugging away i guess
close to 4.000 hours lots of turbine and PIC but thats it .
.....University degree in psychology ......Nobody cares about LOL
i keep slugging away i guess
Shenlin:
I simply cannot believe that you really do have a University Degree in Psychology.
If you had, then you would surely understand that the last the thing you would ever want to tell any prospective airline employer (when seeking employment as a pilot) was that you had a University Degree in Psychology!
I simply cannot believe that you really do have a University Degree in Psychology.
If you had, then you would surely understand that the last the thing you would ever want to tell any prospective airline employer (when seeking employment as a pilot) was that you had a University Degree in Psychology!
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JW411,
Not using joined up thinking, JW. He'd be a cert for CRM Trainer,
a nesseccary precursor for senior management in any modern airline. Cynical, moi?
nesseccary=necessary.
Not using joined up thinking, JW. He'd be a cert for CRM Trainer,
a nesseccary precursor for senior management in any modern airline. Cynical, moi?
nesseccary=necessary.
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Hey, nothing against Psychology. It may not be the most suitable study field for a pilot (sometimes it may be indeed), but at least you have a university degree, that places you above average and showed that you did something.
Actually I know of a pilot who was psychologist before. He really was one of the best pilots I ever flew with, also because of CRM.
Actually I know of a pilot who was psychologist before. He really was one of the best pilots I ever flew with, also because of CRM.
Very interesting article in Flight magazine today about the pilot situation in Russia where they are getting despartely short of pilots due to poor pay and company expansion.
The poor pay is driving Russian pilots to see employment overseas so watch out guys your job might be taken by our friends from Russia!
Joking apart times seem to be improving and I dont think the recent hike in oil prices will have any significant effect. Apparently once the oil price hits $40 a barrel (like now!) it becomes economic to start mining it from other areas which in turn will bring the prices back down again.
The poor pay is driving Russian pilots to see employment overseas so watch out guys your job might be taken by our friends from Russia!
Joking apart times seem to be improving and I dont think the recent hike in oil prices will have any significant effect. Apparently once the oil price hits $40 a barrel (like now!) it becomes economic to start mining it from other areas which in turn will bring the prices back down again.
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Why would i not tell any company that i have a degree in psychology ?
I flew twin otters and beavers on floats before i got my current job , so my hands and feet skills are pretty good . I fly single pilot IFR now and my interpersonal skills are ok as i am told by many friends .
Should i lie about my university education and have a 4 year void on my application ?
If thats what it takes to get a jet job i might not want it afterall .
thanks for the input so
Nothing in this industry surprises me anymore ....
I flew twin otters and beavers on floats before i got my current job , so my hands and feet skills are pretty good . I fly single pilot IFR now and my interpersonal skills are ok as i am told by many friends .
Should i lie about my university education and have a 4 year void on my application ?
If thats what it takes to get a jet job i might not want it afterall .
thanks for the input so
Nothing in this industry surprises me anymore ....
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Thread Starter
Nothing in this industry surprises me anymore ....
You are SO right, Shenlin.
The profession of pilot has been systematically attacked over the past decade, by airline "managers" and H.R. departments whose singular objective and sole purpose appeared to be that of destroying pilots' conditions by FORCE, rather than through negotiation and mediation.
And so although our work tasks have primarily remained the same, a lot more (unnecessary) stress and aggravation have been added to the job by having to deal with people intent on trying to destroy a job that could give satisfaction by striving to SAVE money for the employer.
Pilots used to ENJOY going to work years ago - regardless of the length of duty hours involved.
Over the years, management have been successful in reducing conditions to such that flying is "justa another job".As a matter of fact, it is quite often LESS than "just another job", due to the long periods spent away from home, the unproductive scheduling of crews, and the miserable salaries paid which are not commensurate with the regularly checked levels of proficiency and high medical standards that must be maintained.
Yes, airlines ARE now looking for pilots, but if they want to ATTRACT and KEEP them, they are going to have to make it WORTHWILE, and restore the profession to what it was before.
Benefits that have been withdrawn, and that cost NOTHING - such as First Class travel, and foc travel on space available - are the "extras" that might convince a pilot to choose employer A over employer B.
With many pilots as p!ssed off as they are, and with the increasing demand, I believe that there may be an opening for "part-time" pilots - pilots who are happy to work say 3 or 4 days per week.
I believe that the impending pilot shortage can, in large part, be attributed to the shoddy treatment pilots have been dished out.
As an example of how companies are starting to feel the squeeze, I know of 1 guy who has had a recent job offer in China increased by USD1,000 per month plus a FREE conversion (from the 73 Classic) onto the NG.
Another pilot was told that all he had to do to get the job was "show up...no interview, no sim check ride", free ticket provided.
Don't sell yourselves cheap - it is only going to get better.
But it is up to EACH and EVERY one of us to try to get the BEST we can (which is why it is in the companies' interests to exclude unions).
Conditions ARE negotiable - regardless of what you are told.
After all, contracts are "Individual"!
Happy Hunting.
You are SO right, Shenlin.
The profession of pilot has been systematically attacked over the past decade, by airline "managers" and H.R. departments whose singular objective and sole purpose appeared to be that of destroying pilots' conditions by FORCE, rather than through negotiation and mediation.
And so although our work tasks have primarily remained the same, a lot more (unnecessary) stress and aggravation have been added to the job by having to deal with people intent on trying to destroy a job that could give satisfaction by striving to SAVE money for the employer.
Pilots used to ENJOY going to work years ago - regardless of the length of duty hours involved.
Over the years, management have been successful in reducing conditions to such that flying is "justa another job".As a matter of fact, it is quite often LESS than "just another job", due to the long periods spent away from home, the unproductive scheduling of crews, and the miserable salaries paid which are not commensurate with the regularly checked levels of proficiency and high medical standards that must be maintained.
Yes, airlines ARE now looking for pilots, but if they want to ATTRACT and KEEP them, they are going to have to make it WORTHWILE, and restore the profession to what it was before.
Benefits that have been withdrawn, and that cost NOTHING - such as First Class travel, and foc travel on space available - are the "extras" that might convince a pilot to choose employer A over employer B.
With many pilots as p!ssed off as they are, and with the increasing demand, I believe that there may be an opening for "part-time" pilots - pilots who are happy to work say 3 or 4 days per week.
I believe that the impending pilot shortage can, in large part, be attributed to the shoddy treatment pilots have been dished out.
As an example of how companies are starting to feel the squeeze, I know of 1 guy who has had a recent job offer in China increased by USD1,000 per month plus a FREE conversion (from the 73 Classic) onto the NG.
Another pilot was told that all he had to do to get the job was "show up...no interview, no sim check ride", free ticket provided.
Don't sell yourselves cheap - it is only going to get better.
But it is up to EACH and EVERY one of us to try to get the BEST we can (which is why it is in the companies' interests to exclude unions).
Conditions ARE negotiable - regardless of what you are told.
After all, contracts are "Individual"!
Happy Hunting.
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Shenlin
please ignore JW411
I'm sure you'll be fine
lots of jobs coming up. The oil price will be absorbed by the travelling public
please ignore JW411
I'm sure you'll be fine
lots of jobs coming up. The oil price will be absorbed by the travelling public
Last edited by silverhawk; 18th Aug 2004 at 10:49.
especially for those thinking of starting a pilot education Join Date: Feb 2000
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Kaptin M
Perhaps for "With many pilots as p!ssed off as they are", we should read "With Kaptin M as p!ssed off as he is", and for "the shoddy treatment pilots have been dished out", we should read "the shoddy treatment Kaptin M has been dished out"...
Agree with you though, I have pretty much decided to leave the industry and do something else. I can't reconcile the amount of responsibility we are expected to shoulder, the level of skill we are required to demonstrate, and the ease with which we can lose our livelihood every six months, with the the petty degradation in our pay and conditions.
When you consider that one of us screwing up could easily end an airline, we are not valued nearly highly enough these days, especially when upper-middle managers are getting more perks than we will ever see.
I for one have had enough of having my life dicked about by Crewing - paying for their screw-ups with my time; staring at hotel rooms, wasting my life spending weeks at outstations.
There are much better things in life...
Perhaps for "With many pilots as p!ssed off as they are", we should read "With Kaptin M as p!ssed off as he is", and for "the shoddy treatment pilots have been dished out", we should read "the shoddy treatment Kaptin M has been dished out"...
Agree with you though, I have pretty much decided to leave the industry and do something else. I can't reconcile the amount of responsibility we are expected to shoulder, the level of skill we are required to demonstrate, and the ease with which we can lose our livelihood every six months, with the the petty degradation in our pay and conditions.
When you consider that one of us screwing up could easily end an airline, we are not valued nearly highly enough these days, especially when upper-middle managers are getting more perks than we will ever see.
I for one have had enough of having my life dicked about by Crewing - paying for their screw-ups with my time; staring at hotel rooms, wasting my life spending weeks at outstations.
There are much better things in life...
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I agree that employment conditions are deteriorating year after year. Not everywhere, but in most places. On the other hand I can understand to a certain degree that HR guys and airline chiefs try to destroy the once shiny picture of the "god of the skies", because we have seen some very unhealthy practises of pilots and their unions over the years. Some companies seem to be in the strong hand of a powerful pilot union, and some even go bankrupt (not only because of the unions but they maybe could avoid it without them).
Sometimes I miss the common sense when I talk to pilots, common sense, which is the most important thing in a cockpit. But also in strategic issues and economic consideration within the industry. The middle of the road is where you have the biggest distance to the edges.
Dani
Sometimes I miss the common sense when I talk to pilots, common sense, which is the most important thing in a cockpit. But also in strategic issues and economic consideration within the industry. The middle of the road is where you have the biggest distance to the edges.
Dani
The problem is that many corporate organisations these days lack leadership. They are "controlled" by accountants who have no entrepreneurial or people skills worth talking about and they know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
The only people that understand the pilot's job are pilots! Nobody else understands what it feels like when you strap that big shiny jet to your backside with 200 + people behind you and the responsibility which is involved.
I have always said that the most challenging bit of being an airline pilot is staying with it when you are feeling tired. With the current "creative crewing" practices which are around in many companies now this is even more true.
I started airline flying in 1971 - no doubt about it, the job is NOT what it used to be. Pilots are no longer respected by management and most of the travelling public regard us as overpaid button pushers!
The only people that understand the pilot's job are pilots! Nobody else understands what it feels like when you strap that big shiny jet to your backside with 200 + people behind you and the responsibility which is involved.
I have always said that the most challenging bit of being an airline pilot is staying with it when you are feeling tired. With the current "creative crewing" practices which are around in many companies now this is even more true.
I started airline flying in 1971 - no doubt about it, the job is NOT what it used to be. Pilots are no longer respected by management and most of the travelling public regard us as overpaid button pushers!
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Man I wish you pilots would stop winding ! I always admired the job of a pilot untill I discovered PPRUN.
You guys have the best jobs on earth. You stay in great hotels all over the world. Every day you go to 'work', you go on another holiday!
You do not know what it is to do a real job!
And how high would your aeroplanes get off the ground if the check-in staff where not there, or the engineers did not sign out the aircraft, or the marketing department did not sell tickets, or the baggage handlers did not load the aircraft ? I should not mention the words, "glorified bus drivers" ? Sorry!!
You are just part of a team and part of a huge company.
If you realy want to get rich, you will have to bite the bullet and start you own business (own airline like Nikki Lauda did) ! Then you will find out what real pressures are! Not just raking in huge salaries without knowing where the money comes from.
Enjoy your next holidays !!!
You guys have the best jobs on earth. You stay in great hotels all over the world. Every day you go to 'work', you go on another holiday!
You do not know what it is to do a real job!
And how high would your aeroplanes get off the ground if the check-in staff where not there, or the engineers did not sign out the aircraft, or the marketing department did not sell tickets, or the baggage handlers did not load the aircraft ? I should not mention the words, "glorified bus drivers" ? Sorry!!
You are just part of a team and part of a huge company.
If you realy want to get rich, you will have to bite the bullet and start you own business (own airline like Nikki Lauda did) ! Then you will find out what real pressures are! Not just raking in huge salaries without knowing where the money comes from.
Enjoy your next holidays !!!
