Duh !
 

Duh ! And Atlas got theirs off Tower, thanks to me and a few others (A/C 505). I was also with Dick Dunn at SAT getting the Cert done.

You seem to be finding out things others have known for years.

And you might just be Moving on up to the East Side, Mr. Jefferson....

Actually they both got started using Tower to carry their freight until they got certificates.
Probably the first and last thing they have in common.

Moving On...
 

Rob Rilly: Duh?!? This stuff may not be new to you or I, but it's news to some of the PPrune surfers who've been starved of factual information. Not only that but it gets people talking, rather than just spraying invective. A little substantive posting isn't a bad thing. In that vein, you might have to explain your East Side, Mr Jefferson, comment.:confused:

Belowmins: Yes, Sir. Inextricably linked, in this business with only one degree of separation.

This thread may just be MOVING ON! (finally):)

Lets Move on and leave the revisionist history behind
 

Nope. SO not true. Revisionist history from the Polar guys AGAIN.

Southern Air began business in Miami FL as a front company for the CIA. It was founded in 1947 and became a subsidiary of the CIA's airline proprietary network known as the Pacific Corporation. Even though Congress divested the Government of any for profit corporations in 1976, the Certificates were sold to a CIA lawyer named Jim Bastian who continued to operate the airline for the CIA. He even wet leased his L382s to a group of Pilots called "East Inc." who then operated directly for the CIA. Bastian owned SAT until the Bankruptcy in 1998 and his death in 1999.

Tower on the other hand was co-founded, majority owned, and managed by Morris K. Nachtomi, who was an Israeli who immigrated to the US in 1981. He had been employed by El Al and when he came to the US he started working with a company called Tower Travel Corporation. 1n 1982 he co-founded Tower Air with Zev Melamid, Mordechi Gill, and Sam Fondlier.

Tower Air filed for Chapter 11 in Feb of 2000 (Feb 29th to be exact) and ceased all operations on May 1st of that year, surrendering its FAA certificate in November of 2000.

Polar was formed in 1993 as a joint venture between Southern Air Transport and Jack Welch's GE Capital Aviation Services which had a bunch of old Flying Tigers lease returns (from Polaris Leasing, a division of GCAS) just sitting around. Polar began operations in June of 1993 with Charter flights and gained its Supplemental Certificate in 1994. After several years of modest growth, the entire company was acquired by GECAS.

In November of 2001 Polar was acquired by Atlas Air World Wide Holdings a company formed by upstreaming profits from Atlas Air Inc. and indeed having all of the same major officers as Atlas Air.

Wrongo ther whale
Polar was started not my Southern nor Jack Welch , although he may have had a hand in aircraft aquisitions, but by Ned Wallace who was the marketing guy for Flying Tigers.

Moving On...
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_Air

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Air_Transport

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polar_Air_Cargo

Wikipedia has some of the information, but by no means, all of the information, and indeed some mis-information. Welcome to life!
It's time to throw all those old uniforms out of the closet and move on I guess.

Moving On...
 

Layinlow: Some agreement there! Ned had the plan and the contacts with promises but he didn't have all the money or the airframes. SAT had the quick paper way to get it started. Many fingers, pies and backs getting scratched, that's for sure! :)

Whale
Both Ned Wallace and Michael Chowdry approached Morris Nachtomi about operating freighters they would provide prior to getting operating certificates. Tower operated N505MC for Chowdry and a GATX door conversion for Ned. I was involved in the planning, set up stations in Hong Kong (Ned) and Taiwan (Chowdry). Ned subsequently started Polar and Chowdry, Atlas. There are quite a few Tower Air crewmembers who were involved. Are they all victims of revisionist history?.

There are a ton of stories on a ton of startups and they seem to last a few years or so using the same players and only a few that survive for any time. So what's new with the Polar/Atlas story. Nothing changed, nothing will change. These "outfits" have learned to reinvent themselves every few years under a now name with someone else's money.

Moving On...
 

Doing the reverse start for a new company, as Tower did, is a very effective means of providing the new service to your new customer straight away without having your own infrastructure in place and until you can become self reliant.

belowmins: Now there's some good stuff; thanks for sharing. Why don't you go to Wikipedia and submit that information for update?

Moving On...
 

layinlow:I do agree with the first line of your post on start-ups. I don't agree with the Nothing will change statement though. 400's,800's,DHL and more money in cash and cash equivalents than debt. IT's changed, IT will change and WE'RE MOVING ON!

Sorry guys Tower may have operated an aircraft for anyone at anytime. But Polar was started by Jack Welch and GE from Polaris leasing - read his book. Polar initially operated under the Southern Air Transport certificate which is a whole lot different than someone operating an airplane for you. Tower may indeed have operated an airplane for Atlas - I wasn't here then and I don't know. But I do know that Southern Air did NOT spring from Tower - which is what I was replying to. I doubt if Jack Welch would lie in a nationally published book. Ned Wallace may have been the head guy - but Polar was owned by GCAS, started by Jack Welch, and operated under SATs certificate.

Doesn't really matter I was only trying to illustrate yet another example of revisionist history and untruths from some on this board.

The truth
 

Jack Welch took credit for a lot of things other people did. Treat self-boasting books just like the internet, don't believe everything you read.

Does it really matter? Polar is now with AAWWH who is trying to run them into the ground. What happend years ago has no bearing on what is happening today. I just wonder how long DHL is going to put up with this brouhaha. I hope they are a patient bunch.

WhaleFR8 - Other than initial ownership / partnership interest, I believe your assessment was reasonably accurate. I remember actually operating a leg of Atlas's next after inaugural flight when with Tower (and a few months later watching Southern's "snail tail" with a Polar call sign operating out of JFK).

In a somewhat joint partnership with GE, Ned Wallace provided the operational / marketing expertise (used from his Tiger days), and his leveraged investment group contributed 49% of the Polar / GE venture. Also, when later employed with Polar at it's old LGB headquarters, Ned had hinted to me that Polar's awarded Japan routes were a gift to him from his old retiring drinking buddies in Washington, along with his old Jap connections from Tigers.

I had believed, however that Tower's Morris Nachtomi, although a former El Al employee, was actually an Iraqi Jew (odd) and not Israeli. . . . in never actually meeting Morris, I may be wrong.

Correct L38, Nachtomi was indeed an Iraqi Jew.

Is that why was able to secure all those Haj flights?

An Iraqi Jew operating /profiting from Hajj flights - That certainly was an ironic feat of Tower's notorious owner/CEO.

I recall that one of the airplanes used, would leak/drip it's upper deck toilet onto the front lower deck pax's after the cabin had pressurized. Mx had never seemed to be able to fix it. Hajj or not.

Morris N. was indeed born in Baghdad ................FR8, No one ever said Tower started SAT.

Moving On...
 

layinlow : What brouhaha?
Definition: 1890, from Fr. brouhaha (1552), said to have been, in medieval theater, "the cry of the devil disguised as clergy."

PPRuNe; the new medieval theatre?

Best Angle: True dat! :ok:

From Atlast
From BELOWMINS, a few posts above, in response to Atlast:
Try to keep up willya.

Atlast, Keep up will ya !

Moving On...
 

RobRilly: I'm not keeping up; I'm moving on! :ok:

We know.....just a very old catch phrase. Seems you are sure to wear it out at this rate. I've been Teamsters before, you can't imagine what you are in for. Good Luck.

Moving On...
 

RobRilly: I've only been using it under 2 weeks but yes, I like it because it fits.
Let's quit the rehash and move on. :D

Atlast:Let's, will you now......?

Originally posted 28 April:


This is about a favorable outcome for Bourne and his inner circle, as engineered by Cato to end Polar. Period.

Honorable representation of his crewmembers is not on Bournes list of To Do items. Look for the following:

1...HARD press for Teamster representation (w/ Cato support).

2...Move for Single Carrier (w/ Cato support).

3...Subsequent vote to pull Polar from ALPA (w/Cato support).

4...Bourne installed at Teamster National.

5...Caputo/Alves/Allen Atlas Teamster positions.

6...Continuous blame of ALPA and Polar for concessionary contract from all of the above (and WhaleFr8) rings suddenly hollow with Atlas membership-

AND THE REGRET AND DISAPPOINTMENT WILL CONTINUE...

At least Dave will still be eating in the same expensive DC restaurants on the membership dime.

So it looks like NWA Cargo is going down the tubes unfortunately, because of DHL shifting to Polar. Thats too bad.

hhhh..... Yet another grievance filed against Atlas today by Polar. Wouldn't be so bad if the remedy requested was not designed to unjustly take jobs and away from Atlas pilots. This one also will be paid for by the entire ALPA membership using an outside counsel. Does the Polar MEC not understand that they are merely the puppets of the newly elected ALPA Treasurer? He doesn't care about them. He just has some ill conceived idea that this will help keep jobs and NWA.

Moving On...
 

Rob Rilly: Consistent isn't it?

cptvac: Now your latest diatribe would fit the definiton of a brouhaha.
I will agree with Of course it's not on his list of to do items! He's already doing it! Is it on the Polar MEC's to do list?

Your points ending "(w/CATO support)".... has he told you that personally?
Please share with us where you get this from after all, this is the forum to hear rumors/rumours.

They will have positions if the membership vote for them. We'll have a lot of very good guys vieing for those positions. Maybe some of our Polar sisters might like a shot?

This will happen wether Atlas go Teamsters or not and has nothing to do with Cato.

FOR THOSE THAT DON'T MOVE ON!

Atlast your obviously a politicain, because you have the skills needed to ignore the facts. GOOD LUCK AT TEAMSTERS PLEASE JUST GO. Us actual professional pilots can't wait to shrink that SCAB LIST. By the way who cares who started ya'lls freight airlines. They were smart, they left the business.

Moving On...
 

BillyBob521: I believe you meant Politician, but no I am not. I don't have a college degree and I do not even hold a union position. I am rank and file which brings some honest consistency to this thread.

I'm having a tough time pushing aside the rumor and conjecture to find your facts, let alone ignore them!

I gather by this ill informed quote that you are not an ALPA member and not a POLAR airman because both ALPA and the POLAR MEC say extremely publicly that there is no such list. If you are a POLAR airman, then by definition you can not be a professional Pilot by quoting such. What are your true colors Sir/Madam?

It finally dawns on me now, looking at cptvac's posting.

Polar is scared about the Atlas move to Teamsters.

Polar's purchased (by election vote) influence of Pres. Prater to keep a thumb on the Atlas council by removing funding while inequitably providing Polar more council funding, the bureaucratic stalling of the merger, filing grievance after grievance using outside lawyers requiring more National funding, and etc... It will render the current behind the scenes sabotage of the Atlas council by Polar and ALPA National pretty much nullified.

Putting us at least back on equal terms again and they don't like that.

Heck, I would vote Teamsters just so I wouldn't be funding Polar's legal fees used against me from my dues.