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DHL Air UK/LEJ ASSESSMENT

Freight Dogs Finally a forum for those midnight prowler types who utilise the unglamorous parts of airports that many of us never get to see. Freight Dogs is for pilots and crew who operate mostly without SLF.

DHL Air UK/LEJ ASSESSMENT

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Old 14th Apr 2018, 08:32
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: all over Europe
Age: 34
Posts: 71
Still pondering that fatigue issue. EAM you mention 5 nights in a row. After a week like that, do you get time to recreate? What is the birds eye view on your rosters, say in weeks. Is there a week off after a full week of night work or is it pretty much like a regular job (5-2 days, more or less), just that the work hours are after dark?

If the latter applies, this would make the job similar to those gigs in ports or 24/7 plants, where some people are on a „night only“ crew, and adjust ALL of their lives to being night owls because there simply is no time to readjust. In fact, those people are told to adjust to nights 100% because 2 days off between weeks might just confuse you more if you try to switch to regular daytime activity.
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Old 15th Apr 2018, 09:11
  #102 (permalink)  
EAM
 
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We have 2 options, flex roster or fixed roster. On the fixed you work nights only, more or less a 8on 6off. On flex you might occasionally get some days flying and after 6 days working at least 3 off days, usually you will fly around 5-6 days having 3-4 days off, plus maybe a rest day.
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Old 15th Apr 2018, 11:40
  #103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
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Wow, 8-6 is 8 nights in a row? 6 off days probably cant compensate for that long term...

Which one do people prefer in terms of fatigue management? (Other factors like commuting/family not considered).
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Old 15th Apr 2018, 11:47
  #104 (permalink)  
EAM
 
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No, its not 8 nights in a row, you need a 34h rest in between, otherwise it would´t work with the EASA rules. You usually do 6 nights with the 34h break somewhere in between.

It depends on peoples need. the 8/6 is perfect for commuting and you have almost a week to recover, on the flex you sometimes just have a trip of 3-4 days.
The nights themselves can be very fatiguing, when you do 3 sectors every night for 3-4 or even 5 days, when you just do 2 sectors a night, it is usually quite ok.
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Old 16th Apr 2018, 06:43
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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Thank you for explaining.
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Old 16th Apr 2018, 18:26
  #106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2012
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Originally Posted by EAM View Post
No, its not 8 nights in a row, you need a 34h rest in between, otherwise it would´t work with the EASA rules. You usually do 6 nights with the 34h break somewhere in between.

It depends on peoples need. the 8/6 is perfect for commuting and you have almost a week to recover, on the flex you sometimes just have a trip of 3-4 days.
The nights themselves can be very fatiguing, when you do 3 sectors every night for 3-4 or even 5 days, when you just do 2 sectors a night, it is usually quite ok.

Depending on how many nights have been worked it is 36 hours / 2 local nights or 60 hours / 2 local nights. Usually this can be done over the weekend when the A/C are in MX.
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Old 16th Apr 2018, 19:18
  #107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
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Alright, so the idea is to let you sleep 2 nights out of the 8-9 nights in your working bloc?

I might try to go freight once I get all exams and hours sorted...do you guys feel that this is a healthy, steady business, or is it very (too?) dependent on the current economy being so busy?

Everybody kind of fears a downturn, but logistics like air freight may be hit real bad, no?
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Old 16th Apr 2018, 23:15
  #108 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by sarnold View Post
Depending on how many nights have been worked it is 36 hours / 2 local nights or 60 hours / 2 local nights. Usually this can be done over the weekend when the A/C are in MX.
That is EASA rules, the 34h is due to a variation approved by the CAA, it has a few different rules on it. But that is DHK only.

DHL is the biggest parcel service in the world, the growth becomes more every year. Yes, I would say it is quite a stable business for the next years.
The night flying can be quite hard, we have people who are only able to sleep 2-3h during the day, so it depends on how you can cope with it.
But then it is quite ok.
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 08:26
  #109 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: uk
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CV is right, freight is here to stay with the increase in internet shopping and just in time logistics. Revenues are so much bigger - consider how many 10kg parcels you can fit in a 757. DHK survived the last recession and now volumes just keep on growing. When I left Thomas Cook for DHK in 2002 there were 5 uk charter airlines, now there are two.

As for fatigue, I don’t miss multiple consecutive night DLM, TFS etc and the difficulty of resting for them in the home environment. Or the massive skewing of the program to the Summer period.

Horses, courses. At least at the moment there’s enough recruiting out there hopefully to make a choice.

AtB
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 10:59
  #110 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
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Originally Posted by Council Van View Post
DHL can not count the money fast enough, the profit on turn over is a million miles better than for airlines that fly self loading freight around. In a down turn being at DHL would leave me feeling less vulnerable than at virtually any other operator. I am no longer at DHL so hoping we don't have a down turn in the next 16 years.
In the last economic downturn DHL Air's sister, EAT-DHL made quite a big number of employees redundant. DHL (Air) is not known for its compassion...
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 11:02
  #111 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Tommy Gavin View Post
In the last economic downturn DHL Air's sister, EAT-DHL made quite a big number of employees redundant. DHL (Air) is not known for its compassion...
When was that?
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 13:07
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
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Can only speak for DHK which made no-one redundant during the big financial crisis and is now growing in numbers.
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 13:18
  #113 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: cambs.
Age: 55
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Last economic downturn was I believe 2009/10? Can’t speak for EAT but, (and I’m sure DH will confirm), there were 0 redundancies from DHL (UK). Right now we cannot recruit Pilots fast enough (specially type rated), and our trainers are maxed out constantly.
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Old 17th Apr 2018, 16:05
  #114 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
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In the period when EAT changed from the old to the "new" A300 without flight engineer. I think this was around the period 2008-2010.The flight engineers on the old A300's were made redundant.

I don't think any pilots were laid off.
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Old 18th Apr 2018, 15:38
  #115 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Tommy Gavin View Post
In the last economic downturn DHL Air's sister, EAT-DHL made quite a big number of employees redundant. DHL (Air) is not known for its compassion...
Tommy - quiet the reverse in my humble opinion especially for example to crew with medical issues. You want to back up that statement?
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 06:50
  #116 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
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No I don't! Plenty of FO's / FE's could back me up on this.
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Old 20th Apr 2018, 11:45
  #117 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Originally Posted by Tommy Gavin View Post
No I don't! Plenty of FO's / FE's could back me up on this.
So to make it a fair discussion DHL Air has never had F/E's. They started with B757's I'm sure a couple of the ex BA Captains might have liked a F/E but on the B757 there is no need
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 15:44
  #118 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 23
Any genuine DHL pilot here? Got some questions regarding base in LEJ, contract and taxes. Can you contact me via PM? Any help much appreciated.
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Old 28th Apr 2018, 08:47
  #119 (permalink)  
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What do you want to know? Might even be interesting for other? If it is going in to details I can still PM you.
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Old 28th Apr 2018, 08:50
  #120 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: European Administrative Area (Western District and Islands)
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I’d be interested too, but are you talking about the EAT LEJ operation, or being LEJ based for DHL UK? From what I understand they’re separate companies/contracts is that correct?
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