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A certain cargo airline

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

A certain cargo airline

Old 21st Oct 2021, 19:31
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: May 2020
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 34
A certain cargo airline

The obsession with a certain American cargo airline that has been named in heaps of WhatsApp chats is becoming very scary.

People are willing to jump ship to work for this airline without knowing anything about pay and rostering.

Do Cx pilots not question why an American cargo operator is looking to drastically hire foreigners while they aren't increasing their fleet size? To Cx pilots not realize that this jobs involves you flying rosters that aren't even legal here in Hong Kong.

CX pilots are just hopeless
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Old 21st Oct 2021, 21:20
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Not where I want to be
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Instead of labelling all Cathay pilots as hopeless, why don’t you try and view circumstances from their point of view.

Leaving CX for a certain American cargo airline means you leave HKG. A huge appeal for many. No more constant testing, the threat of quarantine, unable to see family not in HKG, not being able to leave hotels on a layover, a management that pretends to care for employee welfare but the evidence shows otherwise.
NO indication that a return to some normality is imminent or even possible. The current renumeration following a 40% permanent pay cut gives no reason to tolerate all that.

The issues at the American cargo airline have been identified and discussed at the wattsapp groups so the ones that leave to go there will make an informed decision and in their judgement it is still better than being in CX and languishing in HKG. What does that say about CX?

Many cannot see a future here. They have sacrificed a lot to leave their home countries in terms of family connections, and lifestyles and did it when there was a clear financial benefit. That no longer holds true. And HKG has increasingly become Authoritarian and anti “foreigner”, a term they love to use in HKG.

As for rosters not being legal by CX practices. Many here are doing rosters that previously were not legal. Think closed loop and EDTF. Rosters are habitually late, you can’t swap anything as that process has been deliberately suspended.

As for your statement about the discussion concerning the American cargo airline being an “obsession” I think you are projecting. And as for it being “scary” that’s what I expect a management type would say.

Last edited by From a distance; 22nd Oct 2021 at 04:51.
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Old 21st Oct 2021, 23:00
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Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: HKG
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"To Cx pilots not realize that this jobs involves you flying rosters that aren't even legal here in Hong Kong."

Said American cargo carrier operates duty periods of up to 30 hours, the second half of which is paid at 0.25x credit, of which you get notice on the 27th of each month to operate 3 days later on the 1st?
Wasn't aware of that.

For what it's worth, said carrier as far as I'm aware offers a 1.75x hazard pay for certain areas which include HKG... funny that.

And that's not even including all the of the points eloquently summarised by the poster above.

If your point is, it's not all roses and sunshine over there, I don't think anyone is under the illusion that is. However it is objectively, all around, much less decidedly than it is here.
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 00:17
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: Asia
Posts: 533
The excitement a bit suspicious I have to admit. Their latest flyer looks good but why would they need to do this if they were an attractive employer.

Cathay never had to advertise for pilots when they paid B scale plus ARAPA. When I interviewed back then the recruitment girl told us they had 20000 SO applications on file - only when their package turned to shit we could see them updating their website to make it more attractive (remember the 10 reasons to love living in HKG) and arranging roadshows in JNB and LGW.

Looks like a similar pattern to me

Last edited by AQIS Boigu; 22nd Oct 2021 at 02:30.
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 02:37
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: HKFKGG
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I'm not in any of the cool kid whatsapp groups, who the hell are you talking about?

Coronavirus, you're friggen hilarious. Go read the FARs...they're not full of 'shoulds' 'mights' 'be nice too's' and 'if possible but dont sweat its' like our POS AFTL.s
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 03:43
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Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: The Poorhouse
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Coronavirus

Not quite. There is plenty of information about this available from the company itself if you request it. Lots of people crunching the numbers. The new contract isn't available yet with many people waiting to see that before making a final decision. People are quite aware that it isn't the greatest pilot job on earth, but a decent one. Long story short, its appears to be a more affordable, pleasant and safe lifestyle than what Hong Kong now dictates to its peasants...sorry, pilots.
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 03:52
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Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Hong Kong
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Coronavirus,

why the would I stay here?
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 04:02
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Atlas ......
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 04:10
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: HKFKGG
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They're not sponsoring visas though so why the excitement? Or has something very recently changed? Apparently a DCP has a course date there so it can't be THAT bad.

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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 04:36
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Join Date: Jun 2005
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Nice try ‘rona. The particular cargo airline is a 14 CFR Pt. 121 operation with Pt. 117 FTLs (airline standard). Look it up. The Regs are accessible online.

Some great ex-CX folk there loving life now. Upset you can’t join them?
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 07:30
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Veruka Salt

US Part 121 cargo doesn't follow Part 117.
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Old 22nd Oct 2021, 23:11
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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So said airline has a new contract. They also have a union and a 3 year upgrade. They also have basing that allows you to reside wherever you want. That 27 hour day has a legal bunk. That airline isnít a terrible job. That airline is expanding. That airline has union and US legal representation. That airline isnít toxic. That airline has issues. It also has career potential.
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Old 23rd Oct 2021, 20:33
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Join Date: Nov 2018
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FWIW: I havenít met that many happy Atlas pilotsÖ


However, I havenít met ANY happy Cathay pilot!

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Old 24th Oct 2021, 11:25
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Join Date: May 2019
Location: Aust
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Get out anyway you can, do yourselves a favour.
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Old 24th Oct 2021, 12:53
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: FL, USA
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Max duty day for a 4-person augmented crew is 22hrsÖ..
How do we get to 30?

Said American cargo carrier operates duty periods of up to 30 hours, the second half of which is paid at 0.25x credit, of which you get notice on the 27th of each month to operate 3 days later on the 1st? Wasn't aware of that.
This is hogwash also.
Pay is the highest of:
- min monthly garantee
- CRT
- actual block time

Unlike the ME with US carriers you make as much snoozing in the bunk as you do driving.
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Old 24th Oct 2021, 14:53
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: HKFKGG
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IRONY
i∑ro∑ny1
/ˈīrənē/
noun
  1. the expression of one's meaning by using language that normally signifies the opposite, typically for humorous or emphatic effect.
    "“Don't go overboard with the gratitude,” he rejoined with heavy irony"
    Similar:
    sarcasm

    sardonicism

    dryness

    causticity

    sharpness

    acerbity
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Old 24th Oct 2021, 23:46
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
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B2n2, btrdux was referring to the fact that such a roster is (unbelievably) legal in HK right now, so any criticism of any other state’s flight time limitation scheme is laughable.
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