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The Coming Battle

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

The Coming Battle

Old 16th Apr 2020, 15:27
  #81 (permalink)  
 
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Wow advent, I can't argue with the middle bit of your post, but as for the beginning and end.... stop drinking the bloody kool aid! It's not good for you. Or the gin, or whatever it is that's clouding your judgement.

Hong Kong is a dump, and there's no way I would live and work here if it wasn't for the money. The life I'd have in Europe would be infinitely better and if I wasn't earning 30,000 usd on an average month there's no way in hell I'd put up with this place and the clowns who run it.

So if you need to, commute, because no-one in their right mind would spend an extra minute in this shite hole.

That leaves our friends from South Africa who've got no choice, or the 500 hour flight instructors. Can't blame them for joining.

Last edited by Flying Clog; 16th Apr 2020 at 19:40.
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Old 17th Apr 2020, 07:21
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Cathay to sack 300 US based cabin crew.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/...-cabin-crew-us
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Old 19th Apr 2020, 22:29
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Sadly, there are far bigger changes than that to come. CX will be unrecognisable as an employer after this crisis is passed. Plan accordingly.
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Old 20th Apr 2020, 04:05
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I think the battle already been lost from our point:
A maximum saving of USD 150,000,000 if around 3000 pilots gave half their salary for few months.
Selling 10 aeroplanes would generate at least 10 times that figure.
And since we all say we are short of pilots in normal times, would that not solve that too?

The company’s agenda is now clear, and we’re falling for it.
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Old 20th Apr 2020, 04:54
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Originally Posted by Angel 8 View Post
I think the battle already been lost from our point:
A maximum saving of USD 150,000,000 if around 3000 pilots gave half their salary for few months.
Selling 10 aeroplanes would generate at least 10 times that figure.
And since we all say we are short of pilots in normal times, would that not solve that too?

The companyís agenda is now clear, and weíre falling for it.
Who would buy these 10 aircraft? Unless it is a sale/ leaseback at high interest rates... (like just done with Bank of China)
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Old 21st Apr 2020, 10:22
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an oil company might buy them to burn fuel - cheaper than trying to store it................
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Old 22nd Apr 2020, 14:31
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40000 pilots on the scrap heap so far and sure as night follows day the whingers on PPRuNe are complaining about possible changes to their contract at CX. While still getting paid every month.


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Old 22nd Apr 2020, 14:34
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Thank [email protected] for some common sense.
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Old 23rd Apr 2020, 13:59
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take a look at Mole's post Fuel Contracts

The management are planning a massive restructuring and there will be "difficult days" ahead for everyone
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Old 25th Apr 2020, 06:12
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Originally Posted by Pickuptruck View Post
40000 pilots on the scrap heap so far and sure as night follows day the whingers on PPRuNe are complaining about possible changes to their contract at CX. While still getting paid every month.
And itís always the same sad people, some who arenít even here anymore. Pathetic.
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Old 25th Apr 2020, 15:07
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Originally Posted by Bokpiel View Post
And itís always the same sad people, some who arenít even here anymore. Pathetic.
True, a lot of BS, but also a lot of wisdom on here if you have a filter. The new generation of pilots seems to be anxious for us old farts to leave so they can sit in the left seats and learn the same old lessons, the hard way!
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Old 27th Apr 2020, 02:08
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There is absolutely no reason to agree to a permanent cut to our conditions of service, if anything there is an argument for an improvement.

The company wants to reduce expenditure so that the cash reserves last longer. Part of this is reducing salaries of staff not working. Fair enough. So let us make it a loan. Cut my pay by the same as the senior managers and repay it when we are back in profit in a market of reduced competition. As the company says it wants to retain staff and airframes to make the most of the recovery we would be helping by making a loan in the short term. The alternative is to follow the COSs and pay out redundancy until the aircrew numbers fit the task. And then re-employ as the task increases. Costs more in the short term, placing more stress on the cash reserves.
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Old 6th May 2020, 16:51
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"There is absolutely no reason to agree to a permanent cut to our conditions of service, if anything there is an argument for an improvement."

I see no-one thinks you have a case here....................
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Old 6th May 2020, 17:18
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In light of the world situation for pilots at the moment, I canít see any scenario that would give us leverage for improvement in our COS.

I do, however, agree that any cuts or concessions should be temporary to help the company through the current situation. The market for pilots has always been fluid and volatile, cut too much and all the experienced pilots will leave when they are able. The world will fly again, airlines will need pilots.
There will always be applicants to CX, regardless of how poor the package is, look at who we have hired in the past three years.

Management seems to think that these airplanes fly themselves and anyone can do it, this is simply not the case. The level of experience in our flight decks is alarming and shedding even more experienced pilots will not end well. Think Korean air of the 90ís, front page pictures of burnt and twisted airplanes doesnít do well for the airlines image.

I am more than happy to agree to concessions to weather this current crisis, it is unprecedented. Any concessions should be tied to a return to profitability which should signal their end.
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Old 6th May 2020, 17:19
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Controlled, I admire your confidence. However, if you read the GMA's missive from yesterday, it is quite apparent what is about to happen. I certainly don't believe that will include any "increases" in pay or benefits !
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Old 6th May 2020, 21:10
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26 Years

It's now starting to be humorous that some are even considering that any cuts/concessions given now, whether they say temporary or not, will return to their pre-existing levels.. Please please say you're not that gullible.. This would require that CX management, including 3rd floor bend overs, be benevolent and they most certainly are NOT.. They "will" take advantage of this turn of events as the Golden Goose has just dropped them the Golden Egg they have been after for 26 long years..
These are sad days..
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Old 7th May 2020, 00:53
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This thread is a joke that starts with the title. The Coming Battle will be about as one sided as the US invasion of Grenada in Ď83.

Sign or leave. New COS. Really simple. Your choice.
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Old 7th May 2020, 01:03
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Originally Posted by Pickuptruck View Post
This thread is a joke that starts with the title. The Coming Battle will be about as one sided as the US invasion of Grenada in Ď83.

Sign or leave. New COS. Really simple. Your choice.
I donít think so at this stage, if you look at the bases, itís more of a temporary salary exchange for time off, a furlough of sorts..

unless they can be more rigorous in Hong Kong due to lack of proper labour laws.
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Old 7th May 2020, 01:03
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Pickup, from what i've been hearing, you are regretfully most likely correct. There is still a slim chance our management will step back from the brink, though unlikely. If they should go for the nuclear option, they can be certain that the unintended consequences will be grave. They may succeed in a radical transformation of the company, but they will also end up with a largely unmanageable entity that will cause them years of misery. You would have thought they learned their lesson with the 49ers. I fear they are tone deaf to their own dysfunction.
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Old 7th May 2020, 07:48
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Originally Posted by mngmt mole View Post
.... You would have thought they learned their lesson with the 49ers......
They certainly did learn a lesson. Sack 49 pilots and the next day the flights are all flown. No more go slow. No more sickness.
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