Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.


Old 29th Jun 2012, 05:07
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: everywhere
Posts: 81

So please can someone tell me the way I do my jumpseats is incorrect..Give away j3 thru 6 and leave j1/2 for fellow pilots or wives etc for essential travel

Because trying to get a jumpseat on our aircraft can be impossible when you are fighting against ground staff, Flight attendants etc..

I understand constantly getting jumpseat request can be a pain but please guys lets leave J1 and/or 2 open for our fellow aviators ,pilots wives etc,...esp last minute family essential travel

In a day and age when there are 6 jumpseats ,and people will auto move there is no need to worry that j1/2 won't be occupied..

There is very little we can do in this job to help each other,please can we think of the other guys who may need them last minute ...

Mind you may be you would rather have your fellow skipper give his jumps to a check in agent or sales girl ahead of you..

Small thing to ask but hugely nice and useful thing for the boys!!

Thanks for hearing me out
blade is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 06:44
  #2 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Fragrant Harbour
Posts: 4,733
Singin from the same songsheet bro!
Dan Winterland is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 08:20
  #3 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 754
Code of Honour

It has always been the unwritten rule that Captains coming onto a flight off reserve, where jumpseats have been allocated by the previous captain, will honour those allocations.

I have always honoured that ethic, but help me out guys. It really hurts when I get put onto a flight and someone has given a J1 to a HK checkin staff, or someone in finance, or a member of the rostering "team".

Before you flame me, 999 out of 1000 of our "colleagues" in those categories have at best, disdain, and at worst, contempt, for us & out profession.

Furthermore, I don't give jumpseats so that I can be thanked, I give them to help my colleagues. That being said, at least I know when a cabin crew or pilot has a JS on my flight, even if they get a passenger seat, they will still come & say thanks. As do I when I travel. Shows some appreciation & courtesy, rather than this attitude of entitlement we get from some.
broadband circuit is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 08:47
  #4 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Out of the pollution.
Posts: 674
As a KA commuter, I cannot tell you how much the security of a J1 means when getting back for work. (and equally how devastating a J3 is when the flight is red and zeros)

Thanks Gents.
AAIGUY is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 09:21
  #5 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: with the porangi,s in Pohara
Age: 62
Posts: 984
Broadband quote....."I have always honoured that ethic, but help me out guys. It really hurts when I get put onto a flight and someone has given a J1 to a HK checkin staff, or someone in finance, or a member of the rostering "team".

Well mate..understand your pain.....for me...the jumpseat always goes to flight crew ....period......and if flightcrew are not there,then it goes by company designation,........even if the "flightcrew"shows up late with other company personal in the seat......the jumpseat should be solely for flightcrew .....and then the discretion of the Captain .........the jumpseat is and has traditionally been a flightcrew (not cabin crew) needs to stay that way.......
pakeha-boy is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 10:09
  #6 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Brexitland
Posts: 1,135
Please don't book 3 J1's. It's greedy and not necessary. If you already have J1 on another flight that day you ain't gettin' another one from me.
Arfur Dent is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 10:40
  #7 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,163
1/ as said above don't keep multiple J1's. One Melbourne commuter regularly keeps 3 J1's for weeks without choosing one and I don't give him first go anymore.

I don't agree with the above poster as sometimes you strike gold and get assigned more than 1 J1, but makeup your mind quick and cancel what you don't want so others can have a chance.

2/ pop your head in and say thanks ( you'd be surprised how many don't )
3/ if you don't need it or get an earlier flight CANCEL IT WITH CC

Last edited by nitpicker330; 29th Jun 2012 at 10:42.
nitpicker330 is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 13:37
  #8 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 378
9 out of 10 Pilots do say thanks etc. but 9 out of 10 Cabin Crew don't which I find a tad discourteous. generally because 9/10 cabin crew don't even turn up for the flight having taking an earlier/later flight without having the common courtesy to cancel it, which would allow the next in line to at least think they are in with a chance.

Ground staff, (of the handbag/high heel model) have also repeatedly demonstrated they don't know how to behave. Likewise many of them, despite good English speaky, fail to understand the brief, evidenced by the Q&A to ensure check of understanding at the end, leading to an offloading in one case.

End result, only flt deck crew, their families, and the occasional cabin crew get the JS. Cabin crew partners and grd staff have shot themselves in the foot and no longer travel with me.
LongTimeInCX is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 14:17
  #9 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Honkers
Posts: 383
Got to say guys,

Great thread...lovely to see some great blue sky thinking regarding the jumpseats.

See it a hundered times on the crew list, all the jumpseats and no one shows or says thanks etc. Always know you have a good capt when you see j1 free and others in j2 etc.
badairsucker is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 14:58
  #10 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Cupboard
Posts: 264
Now how about compiling this info into an AOA document on the web site so that MEL commuter and the HK ground staff names are known to all, as well as the concepts behind some good personal choices listed above?

You may feel great about your little battle against the system, but if the 1000 others are not doing the same, it has little to no effect.
Iron Skillet is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2012, 23:18
  #11 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: hong kong
Posts: 42
I think we're preaching to the converted here fellas, but love the thread, keep it running.
Posts are spot on with my personal jump seat allocation policy - just wish more 'Left Seaters' were on the same page
scavengepump is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 01:44
  #12 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Chained to the kitchen sink, barefoot and pregnant
Posts: 4
I find the views expressed here somewhat distasteful. I realize I am but a lowly wife, possibly in the eyes of some posters here further down the food chain than staff checkin staff, but this thread has irritated me enough to express my opinion.

I have been lucky enough to have been afforded the use of the jumpseat on many occasions and have yet to encounter views such as those expressed here. I do not seek to comment on those who book multiple jumpseats but rather on the somewhat hypocritical attitude expressed towards your colleagues who work in other parts of the company. I do not deny that there are staff at checkin who's demeanour and attitude leaves a lot to be desired but there are many amongst your own ranks who behave with unbridled arrogance and contempt for others whom they clearly think beneath them. Particularly of late, I have found a much improved attitude when checking in at HK and I have been treated with courtesy and helpfulness behind what is required both there and in outports on many occasions.

Perhaps if some of you demonstrated a less pompous and self-important attitude towards others, you might find it reciprocated. You sneer at the line "Same team, same dream" but you seem interested in a one-way street only.
er indoors is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 01:59
  #13 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 180
As a Aus commuter, I can't thank my Airbus colleagues enough.
Applied for a JS to Phuket several weeks ago and all were vacant. Got a reply that I'm J4 and that only arrived a few days go, so guess what!! Spending the weekend in Typhoon Alley and missing free drinks.
I think I'll remember that one for the future.
40Deg STH is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 03:47
  #14 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: hong kong
Posts: 193
Most of the problems occur because the jump seat system closes way too early and the fact that staff are instructed not to contact the Captains directly to request or cancel jumpseats. ( fair enough rule) Non aircrew would not have a clue how to cancel jumpseats by calling crew control if they happen to get on a earlier flight. As for cabin my experience many of them come to the flight deck very appreciative often with little gifts for the crew which is a nice touch. I see it a more a system fault rather than people not doing the right thing.
CYRILJGROOVE is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 03:53
  #15 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Eden Valley
Posts: 1,804
40 Deg Sth

I'm sorry to hear that you were not looked after on HKT flight. Most of us at KA are very happy when we get the chance to look after a CX pilot and their families. If there are more than two jump seat requests I email all involved an organize an outcome. I've had our guys on the cabin crew seats and the jumps with CX pilots.

Thanks to all those who provide the jump seats and I try to get up to flight deck and pass on my appreciation. Some of your cabin crew are a little scary to get past though. And I wonder if my messages are always passed on?

I would suggest if you really need to get somewhere on KA, we are keen to help, so perhaps email. Our rosters can be very unstable and this could be part of the problem.

Last edited by Gnadenburg; 30th Jun 2012 at 03:54.
Gnadenburg is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 05:33
  #16 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The Underside
Posts: 65
40 deg Sth

Also sorry to hear you were not better looked after.... Most of the guys I know all do our best accommodate KA and CX pilots as priority.

It's not always easy to pass on our thanks after the flight so I email the Capt to show my appreciation.

Feather Boa is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 08:10
  #17 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 754
I see it a more a system fault rather than people not doing the right thing

Why does the jumpseat system lock at 24hrs before departure? That means in the last 24hrs, no one can apply, and captains can't approve requests (an annoyance with a reserve call where the flight has been uncrewed for so long that all the JS requests are still pending), but most critically, applicants can't withdraw their unneeded already approved application.

Surely they can modify the cut off time for jumpseats to 3 or 4 hrs before STD. Come to mention it, why not 1 hr before STD, ie after sign on? What about 40 mins before STD, just before the counter closes?

Shouldn't this be within the capabilities of our "award winning" IT manager?
broadband circuit is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 11:56
  #18 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: everywhere
Posts: 81
Sitting on an ER(777) regional gate 69..intergrating so 90min before departure I tell the ground staff 4 jumps available as I know the flight is scheduled to be oversold and being the last flight of the day to a commuter rich environment ..

All staff left behind,4 jumps empty..ground staff say oh I didn't call them like you asked as I don't have the authority...

Ah excuse me what did I just tell I really look like duck liver pate

Hkg really needs to get its act together,a complete lack of caring for its staff,by its staff...
blade is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 14:54
  #19 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: At home
Posts: 21
Thumbs up Yep....

I agree with Arfur

If I see a J1 already assigned elsewhere, you won't get mine.

Mind you, I exclusively save them for cockpit crew, and then open them up to cabin crew if no cockpit takers.

As for office staff, corporate, blah blah

Declined. Always. Not just not responding. Declined.

Love that button.
crwass is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2012, 18:06
  #20 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 1998
Location: .
Posts: 2,945

Thanks for that, there was me thinking we were all part of the same team, I guess I was mistaken. Guess I won't be giving any favours back to you either.
spannersatcx is offline  

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