13th month.....are we getting it?
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13th month.....are we getting it?
So.........who reckons we're getting 13th month?
I need to know....I'm a Cathay Second Officer, and by definition am therefore exceedingly poor. I've been saving 10% of my salary for the past 6 months in order to give the kids a couple of Chrissie presents each - so far, I've got HK$58.20. I NEED 13th MONTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I need to know....I'm a Cathay Second Officer, and by definition am therefore exceedingly poor. I've been saving 10% of my salary for the past 6 months in order to give the kids a couple of Chrissie presents each - so far, I've got HK$58.20. I NEED 13th MONTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last edited by luvmuhud; 20th Oct 2008 at 12:19. Reason: forgot a freakin' question mark
That is the 6 million dollar question.
Fawlty towers are probably trying to work out how thay can NOT pay the full 13th month as we type this.
With fuel prices going south and loads factors still ABOUT the 70% mark we should make a fair profit.
So my guess is:--- Yes full 13th month.
Unless the market really does drop to nothing.
Fawlty towers are probably trying to work out how thay can NOT pay the full 13th month as we type this.
With fuel prices going south and loads factors still ABOUT the 70% mark we should make a fair profit.
So my guess is:--- Yes full 13th month.
Unless the market really does drop to nothing.
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I've been saving 10% of my salary for the past 6 months in order to give the kids a couple of Chrissie presents each - so far, I've got HK$58.20.
This just in from OUR AOA:
Revenue – the financial tsunami
In the Friday Telex of 17 Oct, it is reported that revenue fell 10.8% below budget for the first full week in October. For the sake of the exercise, let’s assume that revenue remains 10.8% behind budget for the remainder of the year. According to a previous Friday Telex, we were 3.6% ahead of the budget for the first 9 months of the year. So a shortfall from budget of 10.8% for the last 3months of the year, and not our ‘peak’ revenue months at that, would result in us being about 0.9% ahead of budget at year end. Hardly a figure to crow about, but not so bad if you consider that revenue for 2007, our record profit year, was only 2.0% ahead of budget!
Profit = Revenue – Costs!
Based on the latest figures, revenue will come in slightly above budgeted level for the year. Costs, on the other hand have fallen dramatically over the last few weeks. Crude oil prices are less than 50% of their peak values in summer. But more dramatic has been the fall in jet fuel prices. The margin for jet fuel above crude oil prices has decreased from around $40/barrel to just over $20/barrel. Additionally, as reported last week, fuel surcharges have fallen by up to $10,000US per ULR pattern, but fuel costs have fallen by over $70,000US per ULR pattern. So the surcharge is absorbing an ever increasing percentage of fuel costs.
At the operating level, the Company basically broke even in the first half of 2008 – that is revenue and costs were equal. Fuel recently peaked at about 50% of our costs – so the recent fall in fuel prices, over 40%, implies that our operating costs will fall by 20%. As this will only affect the last 3 months of the year it will reduce total annual costs by around 5%. On top of this it must be remembered that whilst Company communiqués incessantly declared that fuel surcharges rose too slowly and did not fully cover the fuel increases, the same slow CAD approval process will result in fuel surcharges absorbing an ever increasing percentage of total fuel costs as fuel prices fall!
So whilst the recent revenue drop of around 10% is cause for alarm, the more than 20% drop in operating costs, for the last quarter, should more than counter that revenue loss.
So there you go.....................
Expect a FULL 13th month I'd say.
Revenue – the financial tsunami
In the Friday Telex of 17 Oct, it is reported that revenue fell 10.8% below budget for the first full week in October. For the sake of the exercise, let’s assume that revenue remains 10.8% behind budget for the remainder of the year. According to a previous Friday Telex, we were 3.6% ahead of the budget for the first 9 months of the year. So a shortfall from budget of 10.8% for the last 3months of the year, and not our ‘peak’ revenue months at that, would result in us being about 0.9% ahead of budget at year end. Hardly a figure to crow about, but not so bad if you consider that revenue for 2007, our record profit year, was only 2.0% ahead of budget!
Profit = Revenue – Costs!
Based on the latest figures, revenue will come in slightly above budgeted level for the year. Costs, on the other hand have fallen dramatically over the last few weeks. Crude oil prices are less than 50% of their peak values in summer. But more dramatic has been the fall in jet fuel prices. The margin for jet fuel above crude oil prices has decreased from around $40/barrel to just over $20/barrel. Additionally, as reported last week, fuel surcharges have fallen by up to $10,000US per ULR pattern, but fuel costs have fallen by over $70,000US per ULR pattern. So the surcharge is absorbing an ever increasing percentage of fuel costs.
At the operating level, the Company basically broke even in the first half of 2008 – that is revenue and costs were equal. Fuel recently peaked at about 50% of our costs – so the recent fall in fuel prices, over 40%, implies that our operating costs will fall by 20%. As this will only affect the last 3 months of the year it will reduce total annual costs by around 5%. On top of this it must be remembered that whilst Company communiqués incessantly declared that fuel surcharges rose too slowly and did not fully cover the fuel increases, the same slow CAD approval process will result in fuel surcharges absorbing an ever increasing percentage of total fuel costs as fuel prices fall!
So whilst the recent revenue drop of around 10% is cause for alarm, the more than 20% drop in operating costs, for the last quarter, should more than counter that revenue loss.
So there you go.....................
Expect a FULL 13th month I'd say.
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so tired,
I suggest that you return to your cloud and dream on. This was the same year that those of us on contract with CX, were offered the amazing 12 month contract, instead of the 3 year contract at renewal. Of course you get to your 5% bonus quicker, but try getting credit....
Brgd's
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I suggest that you return to your cloud and dream on. This was the same year that those of us on contract with CX, were offered the amazing 12 month contract, instead of the 3 year contract at renewal. Of course you get to your 5% bonus quicker, but try getting credit....
Brgd's
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I will be very surprised if we were/are not profitable in the 2nd half. I don't think it will be a huge profit, depends on the tidal wave financial crisis or tsunami or whatever the disaster word du jour is.
Back in the late 90s, the last time 13th month was not paid, we were not notified until early December I think. So if you are relying on 13th month for tax, have a contingency plan!
By the way, we were paid half of 13th month in 2003 after SARS - the same year when earlier we 'volunteered' our 3 weeks leave without pay. AIrbus and Classic CNs had to wait about 12-24months to actually take the leave as we were undermanned...so I wouldn't expect to see layoffs this time.
Its always darkest just before the dawn!
Back in the late 90s, the last time 13th month was not paid, we were not notified until early December I think. So if you are relying on 13th month for tax, have a contingency plan!
By the way, we were paid half of 13th month in 2003 after SARS - the same year when earlier we 'volunteered' our 3 weeks leave without pay. AIrbus and Classic CNs had to wait about 12-24months to actually take the leave as we were undermanned...so I wouldn't expect to see layoffs this time.
Its always darkest just before the dawn!
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Management in this company - The Worlds most Admired Airline - that is - has no shame whatsoever.
No we will NOT get 13th month. We will get 1 month or 15.000Hkr whichever is the lower.
Now have an icecream and enjoy the taste.
No we will NOT get 13th month. We will get 1 month or 15.000Hkr whichever is the lower.
Now have an icecream and enjoy the taste.
Platts IATA Jet fuel price updated just now:
At $91 barrel, down 6% on 1 week ago, down 28.3% on 1 month ago and down 11.0% on 1 year ago. that will mean 5 or 6 months of cheaper fuel over the year. ie the second half of the year. So with a break even profit in the first half ( forgetting the fine ) and cheaper fuel in the second.........
Xmas and Chinese New Year ( the second half is always better ) are coming and people will still travel.
Still think the FULL 13th month wont get paid?
I think it will as we will turn a small profit around 1 to 2 billion. Maybe more.
Don't believe these people that tell you otherwise, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE A CLUE.
At $91 barrel, down 6% on 1 week ago, down 28.3% on 1 month ago and down 11.0% on 1 year ago. that will mean 5 or 6 months of cheaper fuel over the year. ie the second half of the year. So with a break even profit in the first half ( forgetting the fine ) and cheaper fuel in the second.........
Xmas and Chinese New Year ( the second half is always better ) are coming and people will still travel.
Still think the FULL 13th month wont get paid?
I think it will as we will turn a small profit around 1 to 2 billion. Maybe more.
Don't believe these people that tell you otherwise, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE A CLUE.
In a "normal" year the Company will pay 13th month salary. Most years are normal and this salary payment is an expectation of all staff.
The local staff in particular are very expectant each and every year for receipt of this 13th month salary. If for some reason it did not happen, then the local staff would be extremely upset.
The Company does not want to upset this very important element of their staff structure and also degrade the Company's status and standing in the Hong Kong community.
Precedent and Hong Kong Court rulings basically ensure that the 13th month salary is paid, except in the most extraordinary circumstances.
The local staff in particular are very expectant each and every year for receipt of this 13th month salary. If for some reason it did not happen, then the local staff would be extremely upset.
The Company does not want to upset this very important element of their staff structure and also degrade the Company's status and standing in the Hong Kong community.
Precedent and Hong Kong Court rulings basically ensure that the 13th month salary is paid, except in the most extraordinary circumstances.
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CX can't afford to pay 13th month they have to buy British Airways 
LONDON (Reuters) - Shares in British Airways (BAY.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) closed up 4.3 percent on Wednesday on market talk that Cathay Pacific (0293.HK: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) was planning a takeover bid, traders said.
LONDON (Reuters) - Shares in British Airways (BAY.L: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) closed up 4.3 percent on Wednesday on market talk that Cathay Pacific (0293.HK: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz) was planning a takeover bid, traders said.
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I know they'll do what they please...
Does anyone recall NR writing a few years back about the rationale behind 13th month. I seem to recall it was in response to the based guys, particularly the Freighter guys, questioning why they didn't get it. He argued that different countries have different market norms for paying annual salary. Some it's 52x 1 week salaries, others 26x fortnightly, others 12xmonthly. For HK it was 13 monthly salaries for the year and he therefore thought it was inappropriate to apply what was one country's norm to another Counrty which had a separate payment culture (particularly when it cost him money 
) Somehow don't think we will hear this argument this year!!
Researching a post for another thread got me reading my contract. My Clause 8.5 says..."In any year when profitability is marginal or negative, as determined by the company, the Annual Discretionary Bonus may be reduced or, in extreme circumstances, not paid."
Are these extreme circumstances...? SARs.. 911.. they struck me as extreme. We are in a cyclical industry, and now in the down cycle... is that extreme?...
PS Notice how I didn't mention the $US60m fine... Tony would be so proud
) Somehow don't think we will hear this argument this year!!Researching a post for another thread got me reading my contract. My Clause 8.5 says..."In any year when profitability is marginal or negative, as determined by the company, the Annual Discretionary Bonus may be reduced or, in extreme circumstances, not paid."
Are these extreme circumstances...? SARs.. 911.. they struck me as extreme. We are in a cyclical industry, and now in the down cycle... is that extreme?...
PS Notice how I didn't mention the $US60m fine... Tony would be so proud
Last edited by Liam Gallagher; 23rd Oct 2008 at 03:43.
Holy Crap.........it's all doom and gloom out there! They're just trying to soften everyone up for the bombshell!
Check out the URL title on the pic!! "Tony Serious" lol
At least use a different photo each week.....that shirt has to be quite off by now! 6 months without being washed
[edit] Doh, link won't work from secure website.
Check out the URL title on the pic!! "Tony Serious" lol
At least use a different photo each week.....that shirt has to be quite off by now! 6 months without being washed
[edit] Doh, link won't work from secure website.