CX FO based in KUL
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Pilots joining the base in KL will not be welcome in Cathay .Not on the grounds of skin colour, religion or any other sinister motive. But simply that they will be used to denigrate my earning potential at some future point, with or without their consent .
I'm sure that there are some very personable highly skilled and competent pilots in KL. Probably a lot better than myself, they would be most welcome if they joined mainline like every other new recruit. But not if recruited directly to a base at yet another salary scale.
This is not just another slap in the face, for the existing aircrew.
What is going on here is a blatant attempt to recruit another workforce that will be used as leverage to launch yet another attack on A scale pilots at some future date.
We allowed ASL to be formed, we allowed B scales into our ranks, it is time to take a stance and stop this continual rot. it's like a fungus . If you do not get rid of it , it will consume you.
I'm sure that there are some very personable highly skilled and competent pilots in KL. Probably a lot better than myself, they would be most welcome if they joined mainline like every other new recruit. But not if recruited directly to a base at yet another salary scale.
This is not just another slap in the face, for the existing aircrew.
What is going on here is a blatant attempt to recruit another workforce that will be used as leverage to launch yet another attack on A scale pilots at some future date.
We allowed ASL to be formed, we allowed B scales into our ranks, it is time to take a stance and stop this continual rot. it's like a fungus . If you do not get rid of it , it will consume you.
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Relax, guys, it's not going to happen.
CX "management" have started this as a bargaining chip for the real crunch at the end of April.
I'll wager the company will put this on the table as an "if you accept THIS part of the deal" (whether it be an overtime package, rosters deal or whatever) "we'll drop the idea of the KUL base."
If you think that it's too far-flung an idea, those of us who have been here for a while will well remember the poker game that CX played with the Airport Authority over the new training base in SYD if the AA didn't lower the cost of the land leases...guess who won?
Sorry to say this to you guys (in KUL) well, not really sorry, but IT AIN'T GONNNA HAPPEN. Don't quit your jobs or start an new HP agreement, because you're all being used by NR and Co.
Don't get your knickers in a knot over this, anyone. Do you really think the company would be SO stupid as to start ANOTHER ASL?
Relax. The AOA has this one.
CX "management" have started this as a bargaining chip for the real crunch at the end of April.
I'll wager the company will put this on the table as an "if you accept THIS part of the deal" (whether it be an overtime package, rosters deal or whatever) "we'll drop the idea of the KUL base."
If you think that it's too far-flung an idea, those of us who have been here for a while will well remember the poker game that CX played with the Airport Authority over the new training base in SYD if the AA didn't lower the cost of the land leases...guess who won?
Sorry to say this to you guys (in KUL) well, not really sorry, but IT AIN'T GONNNA HAPPEN. Don't quit your jobs or start an new HP agreement, because you're all being used by NR and Co.
Don't get your knickers in a knot over this, anyone. Do you really think the company would be SO stupid as to start ANOTHER ASL?
Relax. The AOA has this one.
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Mole,
It is the venom contained within the posts that has me wondering.
I readily accept that Freighter salaries are not good news; I receive one! However, every other week since 1st Jan 2000 people are joining CX with the AOA's blessing on salaries only a few thousand dollars more than the KUL base and yet there has been no mass hysteria or threats.
As regards your final comment "I give up"; should it be that you resign and join one of the airlines that hold up as an example, BA, you have no doubt read the threads on Rumours and News regarding train drivers in the UK being paid more than Yr1 FOs and BA's treatment of DE Fo's on the 744. Surely BA are not "hiring at the cheapest rate they can get away with "? Equally, you may have followed the somewhat tragic thread last month (or so) detailing how BA busted a Captain back to FO because he suggested over the PA that one of the passenger was nuts.
Good luck with the building blocks and the Human Resources luvvies; let us know how great BA is.
It is the venom contained within the posts that has me wondering.
I readily accept that Freighter salaries are not good news; I receive one! However, every other week since 1st Jan 2000 people are joining CX with the AOA's blessing on salaries only a few thousand dollars more than the KUL base and yet there has been no mass hysteria or threats.
As regards your final comment "I give up"; should it be that you resign and join one of the airlines that hold up as an example, BA, you have no doubt read the threads on Rumours and News regarding train drivers in the UK being paid more than Yr1 FOs and BA's treatment of DE Fo's on the 744. Surely BA are not "hiring at the cheapest rate they can get away with "? Equally, you may have followed the somewhat tragic thread last month (or so) detailing how BA busted a Captain back to FO because he suggested over the PA that one of the passenger was nuts.
Good luck with the building blocks and the Human Resources luvvies; let us know how great BA is.
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Liam,
I do not read any venom in Mole's posting. Merely telling it like it is . We no longer work for a career airline anymore true , we have no protection under HK law true, Our record of taking action to prevent this company from denigrating our contracts is not good true.
Maybe you are reading something into his post that isn't there???
I do not read any venom in Mole's posting. Merely telling it like it is . We no longer work for a career airline anymore true , we have no protection under HK law true, Our record of taking action to prevent this company from denigrating our contracts is not good true.
Maybe you are reading something into his post that isn't there???
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I have to say I am with LG on this one. There is no way we should accept this and it is typical of the company's duplicitousness and mendacity that they should be trying this out now. However, there is an element of bigotry in some of the posts which speaks volumes. On the face of it (and I hasten to refer to my opening comments) there is very little difference between a base in KL to a base in Chicago, Sydney or London. They are all paid at "regional rates".
Again the company is trying it on. We have to treat this in the manner it deserves and not descend to fellow-professional-bagging. Don't take it personally - that falls straight into their devisive trap. Let the AOA deal with it and let us support their stance when called upon to act.
Again the company is trying it on. We have to treat this in the manner it deserves and not descend to fellow-professional-bagging. Don't take it personally - that falls straight into their devisive trap. Let the AOA deal with it and let us support their stance when called upon to act.
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Kubota,
The company presently aims to crew the 744F with North American and London based Freighter Crews. I understand the introduction of FO's onto a KUL base is seen as desirable from the company's vantage due to, not only the slightly lower salary, but the advantages the KUL base represents in terms of Flight Time Limitations in that the KUL FO's can be sent to either North America or Europe. Traditionally, the company would use Australian based pilots, but I understand the new roster practices and the the crew hourly pay (when they both arrive????) will be an additional cost for the extensive Base Travel (Dead Head) duties.
You seem to have further information when you say, "The AOA has this one" and "its not going to happen". Further to my post of the 6th;
1. What are the AOA's objections to the KUL base, and
2. The company is going to crew the new 744F's. Should it be that their fallback position is to form a 744F SYD base on Freighter salaries, will the AOA object to that?
I look forward to your response.
The company presently aims to crew the 744F with North American and London based Freighter Crews. I understand the introduction of FO's onto a KUL base is seen as desirable from the company's vantage due to, not only the slightly lower salary, but the advantages the KUL base represents in terms of Flight Time Limitations in that the KUL FO's can be sent to either North America or Europe. Traditionally, the company would use Australian based pilots, but I understand the new roster practices and the the crew hourly pay (when they both arrive????) will be an additional cost for the extensive Base Travel (Dead Head) duties.
You seem to have further information when you say, "The AOA has this one" and "its not going to happen". Further to my post of the 6th;
1. What are the AOA's objections to the KUL base, and
2. The company is going to crew the new 744F's. Should it be that their fallback position is to form a 744F SYD base on Freighter salaries, will the AOA object to that?
I look forward to your response.
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77;
It has nothing to do with skin colour. It has to do with further cheapening of the job. A pilot working for less than half of even a B-scale threatens all of those ahead of him. If there are no takers to the CHEAP jobs then the price goes up, FIGURE IT OUT!!! We don't want our jobs and careers attacked any further. It has been relentless for the last seven years and we are fed up. Kindly P&SS OFF!!
It has nothing to do with skin colour. It has to do with further cheapening of the job. A pilot working for less than half of even a B-scale threatens all of those ahead of him. If there are no takers to the CHEAP jobs then the price goes up, FIGURE IT OUT!!! We don't want our jobs and careers attacked any further. It has been relentless for the last seven years and we are fed up. Kindly P&SS OFF!!
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squak 7700,
I'm saddened that you think that this is a racial issue. We have lots of Chinese Pilots in the company right now and we all get along very well together. It has nothing to do with race . It has to do with diluting my position in this company, It has to do with you being used to attack my salary and conditions.
I'm against any bases if the crew do not join mainline. we have had it with ASL now you lot
I'm saddened that you think that this is a racial issue. We have lots of Chinese Pilots in the company right now and we all get along very well together. It has nothing to do with race . It has to do with diluting my position in this company, It has to do with you being used to attack my salary and conditions.
I'm against any bases if the crew do not join mainline. we have had it with ASL now you lot
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7700... yes it is very funny to note that Cathay have never employed a Malaysian pilot before. All of a sudden because they are prepared to work here for next to nothing..Cathay think they are the best pilots since sliced bread. Funny that. Not good enough all these years...but now they are the best.
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" If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for everything "
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" If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for everything "
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From The Star Newspaper today.
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Cathay Pacific ad upsets pilots
HONG KONG: An advertisement placed in The Star by Cathay Pacific Airlines to recruit pilots has upset the Hong Kong Airline Officers Association, which is accusing the company of trying to employ cheap labour from Malaysia.
The association has warned that this would lead to worsening industrial relations between the staff and the company.
Cathay Pacific has denied the association's claim and said the scheme was still at an "exploratory stage,'' according to a report in the South China Morning Post.
However, association general secretary John Findlay countered: "You don't advertise in a newspaper and set up interviews if the scheme is merely intended to be exploratory.''
He said this was in breach of the spirit and details of the agreement on conditions of service reached in 1999.
In the advertisement, Cathay Pacific is offering first officer freight pilots RM163,848 (HK$344,888) in the first year, similar to that for a second officer here.
Successful applicants would get a chance to move to the territory after three years of service.
The airline, in dismissing the association's allegations, said it would pay the pilots according to market forces.
"At this stage, I would say that we are at the exploratory stage and will be looking to see if the candidates are good enough,'' said corporate communications manager Rosita Ng, adding that Cathay Pacific was looking to recruit the best pilots in the world.
The dispute is the latest in a series between the union and the airline.
In December, the airline struck a compromise deal with its pilots, agreeing to a 4% pay rise over the next year to avert the threat of flight disruptions during the Christmas holiday season.
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Related Link;
http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story...ewspage=Search
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Cathay Pacific ad upsets pilots
HONG KONG: An advertisement placed in The Star by Cathay Pacific Airlines to recruit pilots has upset the Hong Kong Airline Officers Association, which is accusing the company of trying to employ cheap labour from Malaysia.
The association has warned that this would lead to worsening industrial relations between the staff and the company.
Cathay Pacific has denied the association's claim and said the scheme was still at an "exploratory stage,'' according to a report in the South China Morning Post.
However, association general secretary John Findlay countered: "You don't advertise in a newspaper and set up interviews if the scheme is merely intended to be exploratory.''
He said this was in breach of the spirit and details of the agreement on conditions of service reached in 1999.
In the advertisement, Cathay Pacific is offering first officer freight pilots RM163,848 (HK$344,888) in the first year, similar to that for a second officer here.
Successful applicants would get a chance to move to the territory after three years of service.
The airline, in dismissing the association's allegations, said it would pay the pilots according to market forces.
"At this stage, I would say that we are at the exploratory stage and will be looking to see if the candidates are good enough,'' said corporate communications manager Rosita Ng, adding that Cathay Pacific was looking to recruit the best pilots in the world.
The dispute is the latest in a series between the union and the airline.
In December, the airline struck a compromise deal with its pilots, agreeing to a 4% pay rise over the next year to avert the threat of flight disruptions during the Christmas holiday season.
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Related Link;
http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story...ewspage=Search
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