Flying Instructors & Examiners A place for instructors to communicate with one another because some of them get a bit tired of the attitude that instructing is the lowest form of aviation, as seems to prevail on some of the other forums!

BIR instructor?

Old 14th Mar 2019, 09:27
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Live near Cardiff (from Scotland)
Age: 45
Posts: 803
BIR instructor?

Hi, with the liklihood of the IR r no longer being issued after 2021. Whats to become of instructors who teach the IR r (Imc Rating) only ? Able to teach for the BIR???
​​​​​​I am considering becoming an IR r instructor, but not full IR. I did hold an ME/IR for a few years but now only maintain my IR r.
Obviously I don't want to aquire a time limited qualification. I appreciate its still early days.
pipertommy is offline  
Old 14th Mar 2019, 09:59
  #2 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 6,328
In theory you must hold the rating for which you are giving instruction though I doubt that anyone has given any consideration to anything beyond a full IR. The IMC instructor is a UK only qualification that does not feature elsewhere in Europe.
Whopity is offline  
Old 14th Mar 2019, 14:07
  #3 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,889
Proposed Instructor and Examiner requirements for the BIR are included in Opinion 01/2019 under the parts referring to FCL.835. You can download the document at .

The RMT.0677 Task Force based the Instructor and Examiner requirements on those applicable for IR(R) instructors and examiners. Of course any BIR instructors would need hold at least a BIR themselves, although other prerequisites are less onerous than for IR instructors.

Please remember that these proposals still have to be voted upon.

Last edited by BEagle; 18th Mar 2019 at 22:16.
BEagle is online now  
Old 14th Mar 2019, 22:50
  #4 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Live near Cardiff (from Scotland)
Age: 45
Posts: 803
That's positive, if / when I decide to complete the IR r instructor course, it wouldn't be a waste of money. Providing I obtain the BIR.
pipertommy is offline  
Old 18th Mar 2019, 12:13
  #5 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 955

Has it been decided who would conduct the BIR flight test-would it be done by a PPL examiner with appropriate approvals?
RVR800 is offline  
Old 9th May 2021, 17:12
  #6 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 163
Just want to bump this thread to see if anybody has more information on the BIR.

I understand BIR will come into effect in EASA land from September.
Will the UK implement BIR for UK licence holders identical to EASA BIR.
Since the BIR is a sub ICAO rating it would be valid only in the airspace of the state that issues it unless mutual recognition is agreed. Will the UK and EASA agree so that holders of an EASA BIR can use it in UK airspace and holders of a UK BIR can use it in EU airspace?

As I understand it:
BIR training must be at an ATO
Trainee must have at least PPL, but no further experience post PPL is specified.
Training is entirely competency based, no minimum training hours are specified. Therefore it is up to the ATO to decide the mix of FNPT and aircraft training, though some aircraft training will be required before the test. This also provides a practical route to upgrade IR(R) to BIR since it would be for the ATO to assess the upgrade training required.
Skill test is essentially the same as for IR, but presumably the operating minima agreed with the examiner would be those for the BIR, so typically the applicant would need to fly an ILS down to 400ft.?
Validity is 12 months. Re-validation requires proficiency check with IRE on the aircraft at least every second year. The intervening re-validation could be by having flown 6 hours as PIC under IFR including 3 instrument approaches plus 1 hour refresher with an instructor, or by proficiency check with IRE in FNPT II.
Instructor minimum experience would be 200 hours flight time under IFR to instruct on the aircraft or 50 hours flight time under IFR to instruct on the FNPT. Instructor must hold at least the rating they are training for, so BIR instructor could hold BIR or IR?

P.S. I just noticed FCL.905.FI has a new paragraph c which shifts all the subsequent paragraphs down a letter. Hence where my licence says (g)/(g)(IR(R))/ it should now say (h)/(h)(IR(R))/.

Last edited by Rivet gun; 9th May 2021 at 18:13.
Rivet gun is offline  
Old 18th May 2021, 18:02
  #7 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 323
Because the UK took into law Part-FCL as it was on 31 Dec, the UK will not be introducing the BIR in Sept 2021. If the UK do decide to introduce the BIR it will take a couple of years to get the necessary legislation through Parliament. I think that the IMC/IRR is with us for a while yet.
Stan Evil is offline  
Old 20th May 2021, 20:35
  #8 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 163
I actually got a reply to this question from the CAA.

The amendment to the Aircrew Regulations that implemented the Basic Instrument Rating was included in the regulations that were incorporated in to UK domestic law when the UK left the European Union. Therefore it is now up to the CAA to decide whether or not to implement the BIR. A review to decide the matter is ongoing but unlikely to be complete by the time EASA implements the BIR in September.

The BIR would be of limited value unless a mutual agreement is made to allow a UK BIR to be used in EASA airspace and an EASA BIR to be used in UK airspace. Nobody knows if an agreement could be made notwithstanding that article 445 of the Trade and Cooperation Agreement provides for such cooperation.

In any event, I think the BIR is not a replacement for the IMC rating. The BIR significantly more demanding than the IMCR. I think therefore the IMCR should be retained as an entry level IFR qualification.

Given the precedent of the BIR, I would like to see the option of a competency based IMCR. Where the IMCR is done at a DTO there would be no change. However where the IMCR is done at an ATO approved for CB-IR or BIR, the regulatory requirement for 15 hours flight training should be removed. Instead it would be for the ATO to determine the training required to achieve competency. In practice this would enable an ATO to decide on the most effective use of FSTD, other training devices and aircraft to meet the training objectives and the needs of individual students.

Last edited by Rivet gun; 21st May 2021 at 08:11.
Rivet gun is offline  
Old 21st May 2021, 09:08
  #9 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bressuire
Posts: 467
In any event, I think the BIR is not a replacement for the IMC rating. The BIR significantly more demanding than the IMCR. I think therefore the IMCR should be retained as an entry level IFR qualification.
There can be no justification for the UK to end the IMCr given its fantastic safety record. The CAA have been immensely proud of the rating and fought and cajoled EASA for many years for the EU to adopt it. It will be strange to let it go now they are not forced to. My money is that it will be retained even if the BIR adopted. As for any agreements being achieved with the EU (EASA) for anything at all, this is going to be difficult for some time, the atmosphere within the powers of Europe is to make life for the UK difficult whenever they can.
Fl1ingfrog is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.