Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Flying Instructors & Examiners
Reload this Page >

Survey: 2018, Instructor's terms and conditions on a changing market?

Flying Instructors & Examiners A place for instructors to communicate with one another because some of them get a bit tired of the attitude that instructing is the lowest form of aviation, as seems to prevail on some of the other forums!

Survey: 2018, Instructor's terms and conditions on a changing market?

Old 21st Oct 2018, 21:07
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
Do people really rack up thousands of hours just instructing circuits in Cessnas? I would've thought that someone would be looking at expanding their repertoire after a few hundred hours of instructing, go into CPL or ME or IR stuff. I agree that getting 00s of hours just flying circuits would be boring!
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 21st Oct 2018, 22:28
  #62 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 0
I’m not sure you are really getting into here......you’ll spend a lot of time with students in the circuit. You’ll spend a lot of time doing trial lessons. We used to sell dozens at Xmas - now those get really dull after the 100 th....

you our talk of the more advanced ratings - well they cost money. And on an instructors pay ( bearing in mind you’ve paid almost £9k for your instructors ticket ) you won’t be keen to pay for more flying. Multi engine is fairly specialised and not that common.

i think you should get that PPL before you think any further, I’m not sure you are living in the real world at present TBH.
Meester proach is offline  
Old 21st Oct 2018, 22:47
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
Granted I am probably clueless about the "real world" of aviation and that's why I'm here, asking questions and learning about this.

However, you seem to be too focused on what the instructor is teaching... which is obviously useless in an airline environment. My point, which you seem to still miss, is that this is about evidence of the desire to and ability to teach.... are you saying this is also useless? I say it isn't, and if so, that'll make this "real world" of aviation close to the "real world" of healthcare where effective teachers are very valuable. Granted basic PPL FI pay isn't reflective of the value they bring, do you say it is the same for TRE/TRI in airlines?

As for advanced ratings, well, I think this thread already established that flight instructing pays a pittance compared to other types of jobs so if you think I was referring to getting other ratings while relying solely on FI pay, you've missed a few posts.
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 22nd Oct 2018, 05:10
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 0
Well, I’m not entirely sure where you are going with this.
Are you saying PPL instructing is useful because airlines recruit potential instructors ?

airlines recruit potential captains, instructing comes later and again most airline LTCs, TRIs don’t have a light instructing background ( in current airline ), because even if they have done it before they have to do a core course and the instructors course, and, of course pass the own airline selection routine.

pilots in the airline tend to go down one of three routes - instructing on the line or sim, management or “ other peripherals “ like safety department or recruitment. Of course many choose not to go down any of those routes and just remain line pilots
Meester proach is offline  
Old 22nd Oct 2018, 11:02
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by Meester proach View Post
Are you saying PPL instructing is useful because airlines recruit potential instructors ?

airlines recruit potential captains, instructing comes later and again most airline LTCs, TRIs donít have a light instructing background ( in current airline ), because even if they have done it before they have to do a core course and the instructors course, and, of course pass the own airline selection routine.
I'm not saying that is a fact, I'm asking. True, anything a non-airline dude can teach has already been-there'd and done-that'd by airline pilots so he can't really teach them anything new, but the fact is that he has shown ability to and desire to teach. If you were to hire one person and in front of you are two candidates - a potential captain and a potential captain with flight instruction experience - which one do you think you'd want to recruit?
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 29th Oct 2018, 18:17
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Hampshire, UK
Posts: 17
I'd love to be able to do my FI rating, but I just simply cant afford it right now. I'm currently flying for an airline but have loads of debt left over from all of my training etc.....whilst there's sponsorship out there to help people get their FI ratings, I know I wouldn't stand a chance in getting that sponsorship.....one of the captains I flew with was on the board for either the Air League or GAPAN and said that whilst he'd love to give me funding, the organisation wouldn't as I'm deemed as not needing help with sponsorship etc.

If schools want more instructors, then they're going to have to do something other than just offer a couple quid an hour extra.....they need to be prepared to offer bonded sponsorship so they don't lose out if the instructors walk. I'd love to get my FI rating, not to build hours or anything, but because I want to teach.
AdzMc is offline  
Old 29th Oct 2018, 18:36
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Bournemouth, UK
Posts: 12
Originally Posted by AdzMc View Post
I'd love to be able to do my FI rating, but I just simply cant afford it right now. I'm currently flying for an airline but have loads of debt left over from all of my training etc.....whilst there's sponsorship out there to help people get their FI ratings, I know I wouldn't stand a chance in getting that sponsorship.....one of the captains I flew with was on the board for either the Air League or GAPAN and said that whilst he'd love to give me funding, the organisation wouldn't as I'm deemed as not needing help with sponsorship etc.

If schools want more instructors, then they're going to have to do something other than just offer a couple quid an hour extra.....they need to be prepared to offer bonded sponsorship so they don't lose out if the instructors walk. I'd love to get my FI rating, not to build hours or anything, but because I want to teach.
There are sponsored FI courses out there, I recently completed one! As of right now there are two that I know of in Greece and Portugal that are still accepting applications, wages are going up for the bigger schools from what I've seen and heard.
Luminance is offline  
Old 29th Oct 2018, 19:09
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Hampshire, UK
Posts: 17
Originally Posted by Luminance View Post
There are sponsored FI courses out there, I recently completed one! As of right now there are two that I know of in Greece and Portugal that are still accepting applications, wages are going up for the bigger schools from what I've seen and heard.
Doesn't help the people who are in full time work though. I certainly couldn't give up my airline job to go on a full time course in spain/portugal and I doubt many others could either.
AdzMc is offline  
Old 29th Oct 2018, 22:53
  #69 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 14
Dan Brown, exactly my point!

Luminance, can you give any specifics of the sponsored FI course you've undertaken? Thanks!
Nurse2Pilot is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2018, 09:39
  #70 (permalink)  
NP1
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Greece
Posts: 1
Large ATO in North Greece just upgraded their FI terms & conditions (all net):
FI PPL: Basic 1160 euro up to 35 hours then 25euro/hourFI CPL: Basic 1250 euro up to 35 hours then 35euro/hourIRI: Basic 1330 euro up to 35 hours then 40euro/hourCRI/IRI: Basic 1550 euro up to 35 hours then 50 euro/hourBasic is paid 14 times per year in Greece (strange but true, all the better)

They provide accommodation, transportation, license and medical revalidation, even some tickets home.Somebody is taking their instructors seriously...But they are quite picky about selecting their employees
NP1 is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2018, 19:19
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Bournemouth, UK
Posts: 12
Nurse2Pilot, I'll PM you some details, all I am going to say is that the course I took bonded me for the FI course and IRI including hour building and they paid me from day one. They offer flexible working contracts and good incentives for working overtime, there's lots of work so you'll never not be busy!

If anyone is actually interested in working UK/Portugal and has at least a CPL send me a PM and I will give them more details as we are recruiting for both our bases for qualified pilots with and without a FI rating.

@ Nurse2Pilot Your inbox is full apparently so drop me a PM when you free up some space.

Last edited by Luminance; 30th Oct 2018 at 19:50.
Luminance is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.