Designation of Examiners
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It is purely CAA gold plating which has resulted in their cumbersome procedure, which is totally unsuitable for PPL purposes
I agree. But why is this any more suitabe for anything else?
The background is very murky on that line in ARA. Originally it wasn't even there in the NPA. There was pushback from some NAA protecting their fee-charging powers and bureaucracy. The EASA Final Opinion had a concession where the text read (my underline) "The competent authority shall develop procedures to designate examiners for the conduct of skill tests for the issue of the ATPL and MPL".
The actual EU legal text dropped the underlined bit. A total disgrace which not only makes a mockery of the entire process by which the Regulations are "consulted" on, but a mockery of the principles in FCL whereby Examiner privileges and the conduct and content of tests were clearly stated, and not subject to an "NAA procedure".
There was pushback from some NAA protecting their fee-charging powers and bureaucracy.
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Well i have just performed a skill test and knew nothing of the above.
I have had no communication whatsoever about anything EASA other than wanting written permission to publish my contact details.
So they obviously know i'm an examiner, so why no updates from them.
Almost seems like they want it to be a mess?
Only discovered the Examiners manual because one of our members was on a CAA notification e-mail list and passed the link onto me.
Its only via pprune i discovered the new forms.
I have had no communication whatsoever about anything EASA other than wanting written permission to publish my contact details.
So they obviously know i'm an examiner, so why no updates from them.
Almost seems like they want it to be a mess?
Only discovered the Examiners manual because one of our members was on a CAA notification e-mail list and passed the link onto me.
Its only via pprune i discovered the new forms.
Last edited by BigEndBob; 19th Oct 2012 at 21:12.
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As an examiner I have not had one piece of comms from the CAA about this, I heard through one of the schools I am affiliated and also through the email notification I have signed up to for Licensing, Engineering, ATC, Medical, Standards etc. Anyone can do that but surely the CAA had a duty to inform directly the people this procedure affected.
Anyway, perhaps we should take the lead from the UK airlines - I believe the airlines have been lumbered with many awkward choking procedures that could see many pilots/instructors/examiners becoming grounded with no valid qualification. They have got their heads together and taken it to the CAA. Words to the effect of - if this ain't fixed you shall shortly have few airlines left to manage and claim you revenue from.
Perhaps we should all do the same - OR, just sit back and watch the fallout around us. I can see this whole business going a##e over t#t sooner rather than later - with any luck.
Shame on the CAA.
Anyway, perhaps we should take the lead from the UK airlines - I believe the airlines have been lumbered with many awkward choking procedures that could see many pilots/instructors/examiners becoming grounded with no valid qualification. They have got their heads together and taken it to the CAA. Words to the effect of - if this ain't fixed you shall shortly have few airlines left to manage and claim you revenue from.
Perhaps we should all do the same - OR, just sit back and watch the fallout around us. I can see this whole business going a##e over t#t sooner rather than later - with any luck.
Shame on the CAA.
As an examiner I have not had one piece of comms from the CAA about this
There is an on-line Examiner brief and quiz; one might think that would contain all the relevant information, but it doesn't.
The question to ask the CAA is why there is any need for this stupid procedure, given that all the information they ask for in para 2.1.4.1 of IN-2012/156 will be provided either in the copy of the SRG 2127 or SRG 2128 Skill Test Report Form they will receive, or is already vailable from the Authoity's own personnel licensing and medical licence databases.
The CAA should develop its own internal system to ensure that the pointless €urocracy which they claim that Part ARA.FCL205(c) requires is captured from the documents they already insist on receiving, or from their own existing databases.
It seems to me that they are putting the onus on ATOs rather than themselves.
Or is it simply that their IT system is too archaic to cope with EASA?
The CAA should develop its own internal system to ensure that the pointless €urocracy which they claim that Part ARA.FCL205(c) requires is captured from the documents they already insist on receiving, or from their own existing databases.
It seems to me that they are putting the onus on ATOs rather than themselves.
Or is it simply that their IT system is too archaic to cope with EASA?
Join Date: Apr 1999
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Really dreadful service from the CAA. If I worked there I would not be able to live with myself. I had hoped that they would be providing some sort of buffer between pilots and the tides of ****e emanating from EASA but it would seem my optimism was sadly misplaced.
Incredible that this sort of thing can go on in connection with something as serious as aviation. We really, really need to be out of the EU.
Incredible that this sort of thing can go on in connection with something as serious as aviation. We really, really need to be out of the EU.
Last edited by DB6; 20th Oct 2012 at 09:46.
Another 8 page form has just rolled off the production line SRG1128: Examiner Certificates Issue, Revalidation, Renewal and Variation - Application Now one might think this form is all about Examiner Certificates, but on the first page it states:
Note: Your medical Certificate must be valid on the licence issue date. If your Medical Certificate is due to expire within
14 days after the date of application for licence issue, please complete the following:
14 days after the date of application for licence issue, please complete the following:
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Whopity,
I stand to be corrected but I believe Examiner Authorisations are no longer stand alone (National) authorisations but are now EASA authorisations and therefore need to be on a "Ratings Page" - hence when applying for, or renewing, Examiner privileges you will also need to apply for your first
paper EASA License.
I stand to be corrected but I believe Examiner Authorisations are no longer stand alone (National) authorisations but are now EASA authorisations and therefore need to be on a "Ratings Page" - hence when applying for, or renewing, Examiner privileges you will also need to apply for your first
paper EASA License.
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With rules changing for someone with a ME/IR class rating or similar, a renewal will become very expensive if they have to go to a ATO, do a minimum number of sessions as per the new rules for the time lapsed or more at the discretion of the ATO. Many people will walk away or slowly drop out of currency. Especially those in large debts from initial training.
What could happen is less people take up aviation training in the future, examiners have less work for initials, renewals and it may not help their income if they cannot float around examining outside of ATO's, like before.
Maybe in a few years, their could be a pilot shortage and of examiners, if examiner work reduces. Then the rules may change. Or perhaps these rules might be challenged by the expat pilot organisations that are flying abroad and have lost their IR but have an IR on another license. Those who worked for airlines that went bust and were hit by the recessions, could also be affected if their IR was renewed on types they use to fly and no longer have IR class ratings.
The FAA route is becoming more popular and some people have gone off and gained FAA licenses to get more work as its cheaper, more practical. Also some companies like UPS operate N reg in Europe to some extent or another. It would be an interesting period of time ....
What could happen is less people take up aviation training in the future, examiners have less work for initials, renewals and it may not help their income if they cannot float around examining outside of ATO's, like before.
Maybe in a few years, their could be a pilot shortage and of examiners, if examiner work reduces. Then the rules may change. Or perhaps these rules might be challenged by the expat pilot organisations that are flying abroad and have lost their IR but have an IR on another license. Those who worked for airlines that went bust and were hit by the recessions, could also be affected if their IR was renewed on types they use to fly and no longer have IR class ratings.
The FAA route is becoming more popular and some people have gone off and gained FAA licenses to get more work as its cheaper, more practical. Also some companies like UPS operate N reg in Europe to some extent or another. It would be an interesting period of time ....
Last edited by turbine100; 19th Nov 2012 at 16:48.
