Ops Pay.......
Guest
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Interesting thread...
For all those guys/gals who are not happy with pay in Ops or any Opsbods in general....where do you see yourselves going in say, 3-5 years ?
My personal grind with Ops is the general career enhancement, Ok, so you make Ops Super./Duty Manager, then what..how often do Ops Managers move on these days leaving a space for someone to step into...
Commercial / Marketing seems to be a popular one with many collegues and of course there is flight crew move....
Any thoughts ?
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Hear All...See All...Say Now't.
For all those guys/gals who are not happy with pay in Ops or any Opsbods in general....where do you see yourselves going in say, 3-5 years ?
My personal grind with Ops is the general career enhancement, Ok, so you make Ops Super./Duty Manager, then what..how often do Ops Managers move on these days leaving a space for someone to step into...
Commercial / Marketing seems to be a popular one with many collegues and of course there is flight crew move....
Any thoughts ?
------------------
Hear All...See All...Say Now't.
Guest
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Pavetack,
Are you so lost in your own little world that you fail to appreciate that other people from other countries might happen to operate under different rules ? You see, the world stopped revolving around your pathetic island a f*ing 100 years ago, and has since moved on to a point where they realise that you just can't screw people around and expect them to come back asking for more. Sorry, wasn't meant as a general insult to our brit friends, but really you got to lighten up mate ! (And we'll never forget when the Lord Nelson dude and the audacity to bomb our capital back in 18xx
)
If you prefer to work 12 hours a day, or if your company orders you to do so, well that's your bloody problem ! And doesn't add to the size of your cojones if you work that long, if I may add. Trust me, I've tried it. Your di*k doesn't grow either, so please try to answer politely if you must say something at all.
Right, that vented I'll get back on the thread:
5 days nights, 7 off. 6 days evening, 7 off. Around 30K UKP at current exchange rate.
30 + 9 days holiday pa. 37 hour week. Max shift 9 hours. Free travel on company a/c, discount on assorted airlines.
[This message has been edited by Juliet November (edited 14 January 2001).]
Are you so lost in your own little world that you fail to appreciate that other people from other countries might happen to operate under different rules ? You see, the world stopped revolving around your pathetic island a f*ing 100 years ago, and has since moved on to a point where they realise that you just can't screw people around and expect them to come back asking for more. Sorry, wasn't meant as a general insult to our brit friends, but really you got to lighten up mate ! (And we'll never forget when the Lord Nelson dude and the audacity to bomb our capital back in 18xx
)If you prefer to work 12 hours a day, or if your company orders you to do so, well that's your bloody problem ! And doesn't add to the size of your cojones if you work that long, if I may add. Trust me, I've tried it. Your di*k doesn't grow either, so please try to answer politely if you must say something at all.
Right, that vented I'll get back on the thread:
5 days nights, 7 off. 6 days evening, 7 off. Around 30K UKP at current exchange rate.
30 + 9 days holiday pa. 37 hour week. Max shift 9 hours. Free travel on company a/c, discount on assorted airlines.
[This message has been edited by Juliet November (edited 14 January 2001).]
Guest
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JN
Hope you're not smoking that stuff while you're on the ramp.
JB007
I mentioned elsewhere that if you're not going flying then career prospects are limited. I will add something if I may.
If you are willing to start in either check-in or res and work your way through to supervisor level, the world is your lobster.
Next step in most outfits is some sort of DM level but the mere fact that you have gained contact with SLF, know the product etc, you are on the right road - seen it time after time. Automated Check-in - remember that one - get some in. I was in Ops for eight years and the next step you were expected to take was flight planning after some poor old sod had popped his clogs. I have since seen people on the Airport Services side rise to DM after 4 years - not 'graduate calibre' and no in-house accelerated promotion scheme (although I did see this system operate many years ago - great if you can get on such a scheme - a chap I went to school with and worked in Ops with is now UK big chief for US carrier). Ranting again - must go - remember - get a bit of pax servs behind you if you can. (and giz a job when you see me next).
offload
Hope you're not smoking that stuff while you're on the ramp.
JB007
I mentioned elsewhere that if you're not going flying then career prospects are limited. I will add something if I may.
If you are willing to start in either check-in or res and work your way through to supervisor level, the world is your lobster.
Next step in most outfits is some sort of DM level but the mere fact that you have gained contact with SLF, know the product etc, you are on the right road - seen it time after time. Automated Check-in - remember that one - get some in. I was in Ops for eight years and the next step you were expected to take was flight planning after some poor old sod had popped his clogs. I have since seen people on the Airport Services side rise to DM after 4 years - not 'graduate calibre' and no in-house accelerated promotion scheme (although I did see this system operate many years ago - great if you can get on such a scheme - a chap I went to school with and worked in Ops with is now UK big chief for US carrier). Ranting again - must go - remember - get a bit of pax servs behind you if you can. (and giz a job when you see me next).
offload
Guest
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Offload,
Nah, trying to keep smoke & work seperated
On the career advancement part, I guess it is mostly dependent on the company you work for. I consider myself lucky to work for a company who doesn't have any SLF's, so advancing thru check-in is, well, not really an option. However, there are several other roads to advancement if you are willing to consider other departments than OPS.
Nah, trying to keep smoke & work seperated
On the career advancement part, I guess it is mostly dependent on the company you work for. I consider myself lucky to work for a company who doesn't have any SLF's, so advancing thru check-in is, well, not really an option. However, there are several other roads to advancement if you are willing to consider other departments than OPS.
Guest
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JN
Thanxs for your message. What is the problem with ref to the profanity in your message.
Are you a "DANISH KAFFER" you sure sound like one especially if your working for DHL -the worst Cargo carrier around.
Anyway my message was to Deep Float, where did you crawl in from you Ma Ka Bosra, Kuthey Ke Aulad.
Are you some sort of a collaborator with the Nazi's / Krauts, do you not beleive in free speech, I suppose all you Danes are like that Queer and Nasty.
Are you a Lic FAA Dispatcher , if not then you shouldn't be on this forum.
For you information my Tally Whacker grows
just fine unlike yours.
Ok thats all I have at the moment in time.
Oh by the way JN your mother says Hi
Thanxs for your message. What is the problem with ref to the profanity in your message.
Are you a "DANISH KAFFER" you sure sound like one especially if your working for DHL -the worst Cargo carrier around.
Anyway my message was to Deep Float, where did you crawl in from you Ma Ka Bosra, Kuthey Ke Aulad.
Are you some sort of a collaborator with the Nazi's / Krauts, do you not beleive in free speech, I suppose all you Danes are like that Queer and Nasty.
Are you a Lic FAA Dispatcher , if not then you shouldn't be on this forum.
For you information my Tally Whacker grows
just fine unlike yours.
Ok thats all I have at the moment in time.
Oh by the way JN your mother says Hi
Guest
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JN & Pavetack
RED CARD. There is no call for 'racial abuse' on this forum. You have taken this thread beyond what is being discussed.
I enjoy a good lively debate, your recent contributions are anything but!!!!!!! Racial slurs are uncalled for.
RED CARD. There is no call for 'racial abuse' on this forum. You have taken this thread beyond what is being discussed.
I enjoy a good lively debate, your recent contributions are anything but!!!!!!! Racial slurs are uncalled for.
Guest
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Scarry W***ker
Who asked you to BUTT in this between JN & ME
he is just not man enough to come and fight me. I suppose all these Danes are P*****s.
These are not racial slurs - just operational titles in SOUF EFFRIKA - something that you Britis wouldn't understand. Stiff upper lip and possibly D**K
Who asked you to BUTT in this between JN & ME
he is just not man enough to come and fight me. I suppose all these Danes are P*****s.
These are not racial slurs - just operational titles in SOUF EFFRIKA - something that you Britis wouldn't understand. Stiff upper lip and possibly D**K
Guest
Posts: n/a
Hey!
Shall we just take a Chill Pill, and settle down a wee minute
! Struth aren't we just getting a little stressed here? The subject is Ops pay, NOT, disputes between "rival" individuals 
. We are supposed to be backing each other up(aren't we?!) 
I think that the pay should be structured, as such, to show the amount of work-load and to a certain degree, the area that each operation is centred on. I won't start giving examples, I'm sure that you've got the "gist" of what I mean.
Every airline seems to have a varied pay structure and sometimes appears to think that an Ops/Crewing officer will be on the same level as "A N Other" office pleb who works Nine-to-Five and knows Zip about how an airline works. Pay should be structured on 1. Experience
2. Qualifications
3. Apptitude for the job
Of course this is not in order of preference.
Any opinions?!
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Watch Out....
You maybe flying too low Captain!
Shall we just take a Chill Pill, and settle down a wee minute
! Struth aren't we just getting a little stressed here? The subject is Ops pay, NOT, disputes between "rival" individuals . We are supposed to be backing each other up(aren't we?!) I think that the pay should be structured, as such, to show the amount of work-load and to a certain degree, the area that each operation is centred on. I won't start giving examples, I'm sure that you've got the "gist" of what I mean.
Every airline seems to have a varied pay structure and sometimes appears to think that an Ops/Crewing officer will be on the same level as "A N Other" office pleb who works Nine-to-Five and knows Zip about how an airline works. Pay should be structured on 1. Experience
2. Qualifications
3. Apptitude for the job
Of course this is not in order of preference.
Any opinions?!
------------------
Watch Out....
You maybe flying too low Captain!
Guest
Posts: n/a
3 ways to improve operations:
1 Stop wanabee pilots getting into Ops and working for next to nothing making it hard for us whom want to make it a career.
2 Ops DO`s should have a license. (If you work for schedule/charter airline)
3 have industry standard names for our jobs
(Ops DO in an airline is not quite the same as Ops DO at a flying school so why give it the same name).
This is not a “I hate pilots plot” but I think if it is just a stepping stone to fly then stick to flying schools…
[This message has been edited by Homer Simson (edited 16 January 2001).]
1 Stop wanabee pilots getting into Ops and working for next to nothing making it hard for us whom want to make it a career.
2 Ops DO`s should have a license. (If you work for schedule/charter airline)
3 have industry standard names for our jobs
(Ops DO in an airline is not quite the same as Ops DO at a flying school so why give it the same name).
This is not a “I hate pilots plot” but I think if it is just a stepping stone to fly then stick to flying schools…
[This message has been edited by Homer Simson (edited 16 January 2001).]
Guest
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-Homer Simson-
Stopping wannabe pilots getting into ops would'nt necessarily improve an operations dept. Some wannabe pilots i know are excellent at there job and deserve to have it and are better at it than those who have no ambition in life.
Also not everybody's pay is 'next to nothing'
Yours might be though?
Stopping wannabe pilots getting into ops would'nt necessarily improve an operations dept. Some wannabe pilots i know are excellent at there job and deserve to have it and are better at it than those who have no ambition in life.
Also not everybody's pay is 'next to nothing'
Yours might be though?
Guest
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I take it you are or were a wannabe.. 
Any way I think you miss my point its like a wannabe formula 1 driver working for a taxi company, bad example I know but I do believe if you wanna fly then fly don’t be exploited by these company’s...
I have worked with some very good wannabe pilots. But that doesn’t sort out the problems we encounter in this totally unregulated trade.
Any way I think you miss my point its like a wannabe formula 1 driver working for a taxi company, bad example I know but I do believe if you wanna fly then fly don’t be exploited by these company’s...
I have worked with some very good wannabe pilots. But that doesn’t sort out the problems we encounter in this totally unregulated trade.
Guest
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Just thought I would put this bit in before I go off Shift!
-The United Kingdom Operations Managers Association-
This appears to be the only "regulatory" group for Ops/Crewing.
However, its run by......our Managers!
who........regulate our wages!
These circles get smaller and tighter......
Whos' on shift tonight then?
See Ya Later
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Watch Out....
To Err is Human....
To Forgive is not Company policy...!
-The United Kingdom Operations Managers Association-
This appears to be the only "regulatory" group for Ops/Crewing.
However, its run by......our Managers!
who........regulate our wages!
These circles get smaller and tighter......
Whos' on shift tonight then?
See Ya Later
------------------
Watch Out....
To Err is Human....
To Forgive is not Company policy...!
Guest
Posts: n/a
FOR ALL YOU UNDERPAYED OPS STAFF
IF ANYONES INTRESTED
JOB GOING FOR A CREWING DUTY OFFICER AT OUR PLACE 20kISH AND NICE WEATHER
PASS YOUR CV'S
TO [email protected]
IF ANYONES INTRESTED
JOB GOING FOR A CREWING DUTY OFFICER AT OUR PLACE 20kISH AND NICE WEATHER
PASS YOUR CV'S
TO [email protected]
Guest
Posts: n/a
With the airline I work for, the starting position in Ops pays about 15k a year plus shift with about 28 days leave a year. I personally don't understand why it is such a poorly paid and un-appreciated job, working in Ops. You could earn a lot more doing other jobs outside the industry that require you to have little or no qualifications, but I suppose, as has been said before, it is the thrill and enjoyment that keeps us there.
But for how long??? The career path in most airlines, does not provide great opportunities like other industries. It is no wonder that a lot of us working in Ops set our ambitions on flying for a living where there is a more exciting career path that is recognised and rewarded for by the company.
I think ops needs to become regulated in some way, and forming some kind of union may help push this.
Cheers
But for how long??? The career path in most airlines, does not provide great opportunities like other industries. It is no wonder that a lot of us working in Ops set our ambitions on flying for a living where there is a more exciting career path that is recognised and rewarded for by the company.
I think ops needs to become regulated in some way, and forming some kind of union may help push this.
Cheers
Guest
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Pavetack,
I'll pass your infantile remarks in utter silence.
To your only question: No, I'm not an FAA licensed dispatcher. I'm licensed by the danish civil aviation auth.
Homer Simpson,
Quite agree with the wannabe pilots. We've had the "pleasure" of having quite a few of them in the department, and just when they've reached a satisfactory level they're off for a flying job and we can start all over training a new guy. After a while that gets kind of boring. So to end that regime, the lot of us (dispatchers / rostering / flightwatch / loadcontrol) approached management and "advised" them of how we felt about that policy. And they've stopped hiring wannabees, which has worked wonders for the department and thus the product we deliver is far better than previous.
I get the feeling that some, if not most, of you guys feel unappreciated by the companies you work for. Maybe not on a personal level, but there is not much in the way of respect for the jobs you do. Is this something generic to british aviation ? Where I'm from the entire operation, be that flightcrews, rostering, despatch, loadcontrol etc, is seen as a team. Surely, some pilots have a "superiority complex" but it doesn't go well with management, and as such the feeling of being in it together is what dominates the way we do business. Maybe we're just lucky, or maybe it's something you need to work on with your respective companies.
I'll pass your infantile remarks in utter silence.
To your only question: No, I'm not an FAA licensed dispatcher. I'm licensed by the danish civil aviation auth.
Homer Simpson,
Quite agree with the wannabe pilots. We've had the "pleasure" of having quite a few of them in the department, and just when they've reached a satisfactory level they're off for a flying job and we can start all over training a new guy. After a while that gets kind of boring. So to end that regime, the lot of us (dispatchers / rostering / flightwatch / loadcontrol) approached management and "advised" them of how we felt about that policy. And they've stopped hiring wannabees, which has worked wonders for the department and thus the product we deliver is far better than previous.
I get the feeling that some, if not most, of you guys feel unappreciated by the companies you work for. Maybe not on a personal level, but there is not much in the way of respect for the jobs you do. Is this something generic to british aviation ? Where I'm from the entire operation, be that flightcrews, rostering, despatch, loadcontrol etc, is seen as a team. Surely, some pilots have a "superiority complex" but it doesn't go well with management, and as such the feeling of being in it together is what dominates the way we do business. Maybe we're just lucky, or maybe it's something you need to work on with your respective companies.
Guest
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Now I'm not sticking up for the wannabe pilots they are big enough to look after themselves!
BUT its not just these people that start and move on to other things, unfortunately because of the way some airlines treat their ops bods, everybody from all backgrounds feel they would be better off jumping ship.
Which is annoying for those left to train the new ones, no disrespect to those who are starting out, we've all been there!!
ANYONE SEEN THE OPS MANAGER ?????
BUT its not just these people that start and move on to other things, unfortunately because of the way some airlines treat their ops bods, everybody from all backgrounds feel they would be better off jumping ship.
Which is annoying for those left to train the new ones, no disrespect to those who are starting out, we've all been there!!
ANYONE SEEN THE OPS MANAGER ?????
Guest
Posts: n/a
What industry has as many changes and ups and down as aviation how can anybody slag it of. I work for a company that’s 24/7, 5 OP’s DO`s working 4on, 5off, 5on, 4off, 25days holiday, 21K + overtime for a job I love.
And if the seats are not all full free travel. Wake up and smell the coffee guys/gals.
Oh and stop giving ops jobs to fly by night Wannabe pilots I’m sick of training them. I don’t know why they always know better anyhow.
Keep those chairs warm....
And if the seats are not all full free travel. Wake up and smell the coffee guys/gals.
Oh and stop giving ops jobs to fly by night Wannabe pilots I’m sick of training them. I don’t know why they always know better anyhow.
Keep those chairs warm....
Guest
Posts: n/a
O.K the Maggie, how do you get a job with VS?
What is the problem with Pay within this sector?
Why can't there be an industry standard?
How can people actually afford housing (to buy, not rent) when wages are so varied?
Personally I'm gonna start my C&G A.S.A.P get some more experience and then go for my FAA Disp.
It just so happens I have a PPL and enjoy flying, but flying a load of Coffin-Dodgers to AGP or sitting down systems checking for 12 to hours to LAX (or whereever) doesn't really appeal. But telling the blighters what we want them to do DOES!!
------------------
Watch Out....
To Err is Human....
To Forgive is not Company policy...!
What is the problem with Pay within this sector?
Why can't there be an industry standard?
How can people actually afford housing (to buy, not rent) when wages are so varied?
Personally I'm gonna start my C&G A.S.A.P get some more experience and then go for my FAA Disp.
It just so happens I have a PPL and enjoy flying, but flying a load of Coffin-Dodgers to AGP or sitting down systems checking for 12 to hours to LAX (or whereever) doesn't really appeal. But telling the blighters what we want them to do DOES!!
------------------
Watch Out....
To Err is Human....
To Forgive is not Company policy...!
Guest
Posts: n/a
I'll defend hiring of wannabes, usually they are dedicated to aviation, often with frozen CPL's/ATPL which give them a good grounding in the studies and almost without fail are very good at the job. They hold the position for a few years while they get their hours and, as the world turns, they move on to a flying job where their background in Ops and Crewing often balances their view when they are on the other side of the fence.
Rarely does it prevent someone not getting a job if equally qualified applicants are available. We've got three in our department all excellent, been with us at least two years each and probably another year or so before they move on.
Rarely does it prevent someone not getting a job if equally qualified applicants are available. We've got three in our department all excellent, been with us at least two years each and probably another year or so before they move on.
