Aviation mechanic shortage
You might as well be a gynecologist for all the times you will be left feeling a tw@t.......
I love my job, I'm fairly early on in my career though but still feel the gap in earnings between us and flight deck crew could do with closing.
As is often mentioned in these kind of debates, whenever we fit a part and sign for it our name is against that in the aircraft records and so the responsibility is carried long after you get in your car and drive home at the end of a shift, does the pay for a certifying engineer truly reflect this? I suppose the difference with pilots is that they were able to achieve solidarity in the form of BALPA or equivalent, now what if there was a union for licensed aircraft engineers that had the same pulling power........
(Before anyone points out the ALAE, yes I am a member)
The point I am trying to make is (in a round the houses way) make it worthwhile for people to devote all the time and effort to get qualified, in terms of money and respect, then maybe more young talent will want to go down the aircraft maintenance route.
By the way I was not trying to spark an 'us and them' debate ref the pilots pay, I dont have enough of a chip on my shoulder (yet!) to take away any credit due for the drivers, I mean without them breaking them we wouldnt be fixing them!
I love my job, I'm fairly early on in my career though but still feel the gap in earnings between us and flight deck crew could do with closing.
As is often mentioned in these kind of debates, whenever we fit a part and sign for it our name is against that in the aircraft records and so the responsibility is carried long after you get in your car and drive home at the end of a shift, does the pay for a certifying engineer truly reflect this? I suppose the difference with pilots is that they were able to achieve solidarity in the form of BALPA or equivalent, now what if there was a union for licensed aircraft engineers that had the same pulling power........
(Before anyone points out the ALAE, yes I am a member)
The point I am trying to make is (in a round the houses way) make it worthwhile for people to devote all the time and effort to get qualified, in terms of money and respect, then maybe more young talent will want to go down the aircraft maintenance route.
By the way I was not trying to spark an 'us and them' debate ref the pilots pay, I dont have enough of a chip on my shoulder (yet!) to take away any credit due for the drivers, I mean without them breaking them we wouldnt be fixing them!
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Most kids leaving school now want to earn 30K right away doing I.T. jobs etc. The thought of doing an apprentiship on half that for 3 years and doing shift work puts 'em off a bit. I might be bias but i've been in a/c maintenance for 30 years and i still have the buzz now as i did when i first got into it.
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Having just recently worked with some "highly experienced" American Fitters/Mechanics/Un-licensed chaps, I'd say that the market drying up for them isn't a bad thing.
The posts of this thread high-light the confusion in the States with regard to qualifications and certification of work... goodness what will happen if they had to implement modern working practices and ensure the standards of the people that they are employing to certify aircraft.
The posts of this thread high-light the confusion in the States with regard to qualifications and certification of work... goodness what will happen if they had to implement modern working practices and ensure the standards of the people that they are employing to certify aircraft.
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who said there is shortage o aircraft mechanics??
I find it so ironical when you say a''shortage"'!!! has any one looked out for us guys here in Africa and find what great experience and expertise guys got??
Well,think twice!!!!!!!!!!!Im one of them who leave alone complain of low salary wages but looking for the job itself!!!! with 6yrs of heavy maintanance,Aeronautical engineering cert,Kenyan licence in both Airframe ,turboprop and gas turbine engines,type courses in Germany,and still i cant afford to buy myself a car!!! what a pity!!! then if you need a garret man or a good mechanic,write to me i get you myself and i wount complain much !!!Job first!!
Well,think twice!!!!!!!!!!!Im one of them who leave alone complain of low salary wages but looking for the job itself!!!! with 6yrs of heavy maintanance,Aeronautical engineering cert,Kenyan licence in both Airframe ,turboprop and gas turbine engines,type courses in Germany,and still i cant afford to buy myself a car!!! what a pity!!! then if you need a garret man or a good mechanic,write to me i get you myself and i wount complain much !!!Job first!!
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Yes, the job placement for ame's is pretty much tied to present world economic exploitation & nationality discrimination...
Really, I wish there was a shortage!
Don't hold your breath Stevedornier, it will never happen.
I passed all section L exams in one sitting last century and am still contemplating easa part-66 conversion. This is all baloney.
You may have a better chance trying the Australian migration process, points thing.
Really, I wish there was a shortage!
Don't hold your breath Stevedornier, it will never happen.
I passed all section L exams in one sitting last century and am still contemplating easa part-66 conversion. This is all baloney.
You may have a better chance trying the Australian migration process, points thing.
Last edited by aquamon; 26th Jan 2009 at 05:53.
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a spare pair of hands??
I have worked in the industry for 30+ years, some 20+ in the RAF. I don't see myself as a 'spare pair of hands!!' as an unlicensed mechanic. In deed I have worked in places as a contractor where LAE’s asked for help and advice on carrying out some tasks on 767 C-checks. This I willing gave and the advice was much appreciated. Experience goes a long way in our industry. Just because I don't have a Licence doesn’t mean I'm clueless!!! As for any shortages world wide - in the EE states I believe the worst is still to come. Anyone entering the industry strives for that magic qualification. Who then carry’s out the '****e' jobs getting their hands dirty, that no one else is willing to do? The 'lowly unlicensed mechanic I guess 
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"Shortage"? This is being adressed every day with more and more Engineers losing jobs as airlines go bust or cut back on fleet size.
There will be no shortage in the next couple of months as the down turn buries it teeth further and further into the jugular!!
Next 5 years are going to be tough.
Hunker down and get ready for the storm.
Good luck to all out there, its going to be a very, very tubulent ride.
There will be no shortage in the next couple of months as the down turn buries it teeth further and further into the jugular!!
Next 5 years are going to be tough.
Hunker down and get ready for the storm.
Good luck to all out there, its going to be a very, very tubulent ride.
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No surprise we're running out of engineers!
It is hardly surprising that there is a shortage of guys in the civil sector when the pay is so rubbish!
I worked for a company in Sheffield on a fitters wage of 20k, having left the Royal Navy on 34k. I applied for a job at Eurocopter in Oxford, they offered me 22k! 22k in Oxford...a house costs half a mil!!!
I now work as a conny for BAE on 35k with a fraction of the tax! So all the ex-forces guys are going straight back working on similar airframes on a similar wage to before they left instead of taking a 15k pay cut.
I would love to work for a civil sector employer, get the years experience I need and pass the exams to become a B2 engineer but I have a mortgage and a wife and kids! I can earn as much working in Tesco's as the civil sector pays it's fitters!
I worked for a company in Sheffield on a fitters wage of 20k, having left the Royal Navy on 34k. I applied for a job at Eurocopter in Oxford, they offered me 22k! 22k in Oxford...a house costs half a mil!!!
I now work as a conny for BAE on 35k with a fraction of the tax! So all the ex-forces guys are going straight back working on similar airframes on a similar wage to before they left instead of taking a 15k pay cut.
I would love to work for a civil sector employer, get the years experience I need and pass the exams to become a B2 engineer but I have a mortgage and a wife and kids! I can earn as much working in Tesco's as the civil sector pays it's fitters!
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Masterofnone,
I'm sorry that your children and mortgage have stifled your ability to get a B license, most of us who left the military did our exams before we left so we could look after out families and mortgages.
As for the industries attitude of paying fitters poor money, while I appreciate that there are some truly exceptional fitters out there, the industry doesn't have a problem recruiting fitters in general; it needs licensed engineers who can certify there own and the work of the people that work for them, which is reflected in the current situation where license pay is at last starting to go up!
Any fitter who doesn't sit his exams is seriously missing out on the current pay rises, and those that we all know are to come, however it is an individuals choice to not too, but they should hardly complain of being badly done too when a bit of studying and a few exams can get you up to a 100% pay rise.
Masterofnone, it sounds to me that your just another bitter ex forces chap who couldn't be bothered to do his exams and expects the commercial sector to top up your pension.
There are many ex-forces chaps industry who have come out of the military, have done there licenses and are doing well, in fact I would stick my neck out and say that the industry still to a certin extent relays on ex-forces people making the effort to get licenced...
Good luck to you with your contracting, i'm sure the job security in the current economic climate is a comfort, enough to stop you from bothering to put your attitude where your mouth is and sit your trade exams.
I'm sorry that your children and mortgage have stifled your ability to get a B license, most of us who left the military did our exams before we left so we could look after out families and mortgages.
As for the industries attitude of paying fitters poor money, while I appreciate that there are some truly exceptional fitters out there, the industry doesn't have a problem recruiting fitters in general; it needs licensed engineers who can certify there own and the work of the people that work for them, which is reflected in the current situation where license pay is at last starting to go up!
Any fitter who doesn't sit his exams is seriously missing out on the current pay rises, and those that we all know are to come, however it is an individuals choice to not too, but they should hardly complain of being badly done too when a bit of studying and a few exams can get you up to a 100% pay rise.
Masterofnone, it sounds to me that your just another bitter ex forces chap who couldn't be bothered to do his exams and expects the commercial sector to top up your pension.
There are many ex-forces chaps industry who have come out of the military, have done there licenses and are doing well, in fact I would stick my neck out and say that the industry still to a certin extent relays on ex-forces people making the effort to get licenced...
Good luck to you with your contracting, i'm sure the job security in the current economic climate is a comfort, enough to stop you from bothering to put your attitude where your mouth is and sit your trade exams.
Last edited by Miles Gustaph; 15th Feb 2009 at 15:38.
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In this field.....one has to study/work odd times/hrs/places & be willing to keep learning.
There is a surplus currently of qualified persons due to the Finanicial situation prevailing worldwide.
regds
MEL.
There is a surplus currently of qualified persons due to the Finanicial situation prevailing worldwide.
regds
MEL.
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Nope, haven't converted, it's STILL all baloney to me! As long as the companies have pilots from a saturated pool to fly planes and current insurance, who the hell needs mechanics? The only people that prosper from my licenses is one that advertises UK rated AMEL on their website. I don't get anything out of renewing/converting FOR THEM.
Last edited by aquamon; 8th May 2009 at 14:29.
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Aqua, convert it AND retain your section L, I did and my 2 yrly section L was due renewal....................I was stunned as my cheque was returned, CAA say that if u still need your Section L to do your job alongside your part 66 they WILL NOT CHARGE for the Sect L renewal as you are paying for the 5 yrly 66..........................................
Something for free from the CAA....... gobsmacked!
Something for free from the CAA....... gobsmacked!
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No the part 66 is 5 yrs, the Section L was reduced to 2 yrs when you get Part 66, but then it is free to renew the Section L.
For part 66 see
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/177/PART-6...al%2009_10.pdf
For part 66 see
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/177/PART-6...al%2009_10.pdf
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In the United States, the shortage is not of qualified technicians but rather a shortage qualified technicians who will work for the wages offered.
It's almost like the companies offering these positions are trying to make them non-career positions much like the line service jobs at most major chain FBOs.
I'm sure there are many exceptions but someone with A&P level abilities can easily jump right into making 22.00 a labor hour at a top car dealership with the ability to turn upwards of 100 labor hours in a 40 hour week with 60 hours being average.
It's almost like the companies offering these positions are trying to make them non-career positions much like the line service jobs at most major chain FBOs.
I'm sure there are many exceptions but someone with A&P level abilities can easily jump right into making 22.00 a labor hour at a top car dealership with the ability to turn upwards of 100 labor hours in a 40 hour week with 60 hours being average.
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Guys, can I dip a toe in here and point out I am not licensed.
But having seen some of the guys notes who are studying I was quite surprised at just how little you had to comprehend (note: not fact memorising) about system functions to get the credit!!
For example asked one chap about batteries, got a monologue of facts, then decided to be a bugger and hit him with a simple question about internal resistance-stumped but "I don't need to know that as its not on my sheet"
I believe the subjects are not being covered in enough depth.
GR.
But having seen some of the guys notes who are studying I was quite surprised at just how little you had to comprehend (note: not fact memorising) about system functions to get the credit!!
For example asked one chap about batteries, got a monologue of facts, then decided to be a bugger and hit him with a simple question about internal resistance-stumped but "I don't need to know that as its not on my sheet"
I believe the subjects are not being covered in enough depth.
GR.