It's Official - Sunshine Express to replace the Bandit
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: vic
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's Official - Sunshine Express to replace the Bandit
From January 2002 Sunshine Express will replace their Bandit's with Metro 3's. The first Metro will arrive at Maroochydore next week. There are also plans to introduce another one by mid year.
I would have thought they would have gone for a few of the ex-FWA EMB120's, to me it would have been a step forward.
I would have thought they would have gone for a few of the ex-FWA EMB120's, to me it would have been a step forward.
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From OZJOBS.
METRO III CHECK & TRAINING CAPTAIN
Metro III Check and Training Captain. Min qualifications: Australian ATPL,TT 3000Hrs, TIC 2000Hrs,[ME 1500]CT 400Hrs.
Send applications to:
CHIEF PILOT
Sunshine Express
Friendship Avenue, Sunshine Coast Airport, Mudjimba. QLD 4564
What is happening with their fleet of Bandits? Seems like a backwards move to me.
METRO III CHECK & TRAINING CAPTAIN
Metro III Check and Training Captain. Min qualifications: Australian ATPL,TT 3000Hrs, TIC 2000Hrs,[ME 1500]CT 400Hrs.
Send applications to:
CHIEF PILOT
Sunshine Express
Friendship Avenue, Sunshine Coast Airport, Mudjimba. QLD 4564
What is happening with their fleet of Bandits? Seems like a backwards move to me.
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: australia
Posts: 53
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
apache,
There is a big difference in the running cost per hour between the Metro and the E120 especially on the route that Sunshine will operate the Metro on. However if this company was looking forward rather than backwards the E120 would be the way to go. Passengers hate Metro's, the Bandeirante has more passenger appeal. The Metro has one thing going for it, it's cheap and the best wat to describe the Metro is "cheap and nasty".
rpt2,
What recent acquisition of two sheds?
Turbine,
From what I hear their Bandit fleet will be reduced to 1. This aircraft will be held as a spare. I have also been told that most of the Bandit pilots have been told their services are no longer required.
There is a big difference in the running cost per hour between the Metro and the E120 especially on the route that Sunshine will operate the Metro on. However if this company was looking forward rather than backwards the E120 would be the way to go. Passengers hate Metro's, the Bandeirante has more passenger appeal. The Metro has one thing going for it, it's cheap and the best wat to describe the Metro is "cheap and nasty".
rpt2,
What recent acquisition of two sheds?
Turbine,
From what I hear their Bandit fleet will be reduced to 1. This aircraft will be held as a spare. I have also been told that most of the Bandit pilots have been told their services are no longer required.
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 184
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Foxtrotter,
Don't mean to offend you but the operating cost of a Metro 3/23 is about 25% less than that of a bandit. It's a fact thats been proven many times by various operators. They're cheap to operate and perhaps the pax don't like them but they will make money for whoever owns them.
Onya
Don't mean to offend you but the operating cost of a Metro 3/23 is about 25% less than that of a bandit. It's a fact thats been proven many times by various operators. They're cheap to operate and perhaps the pax don't like them but they will make money for whoever owns them.
Onya
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ramrod there is a topic some 4 days ago titled :-
"Sunstate Shorts heading to a new operator"
It would appear that the rumour in this topic may be correct and that they haven't obtained the sheds. Given that Sunshine interline with QF it would seem to be a logical step and a cheap way of getting into a 36 seat Aircraft with which to operate the routes in the topic. It would appear that my posting is not factually correct and I apologise for any hurt this may have caused.
Last Wednesday was not a good day with other inappropriate press releases being made.
"Sunstate Shorts heading to a new operator"
It would appear that the rumour in this topic may be correct and that they haven't obtained the sheds. Given that Sunshine interline with QF it would seem to be a logical step and a cheap way of getting into a 36 seat Aircraft with which to operate the routes in the topic. It would appear that my posting is not factually correct and I apologise for any hurt this may have caused.
Last Wednesday was not a good day with other inappropriate press releases being made.
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: australia
Posts: 53
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Foxtrotter,
Yes the Metro maybe pressurised and faster but that only helps if you are doing 250-300nm routes. The route the Metro will replace the Bandit on is about 220nm. The Metro will do it in about 55-60 mins and the Bandit would do it in about 65-70 mins. I have flown both types and the Bandit is much more of a pilots plane than the Metro. From a passenger point of view lets compare.
The Bandit from memory is around 5.3 feet high and about the same wide. The Sunshine aircraft have 15 high back seats with tray tables and armrests.
The Metro is is 4.8 feet high and about 5 feet wide. Has you can see there is a few inches difference with the Bandit holding the advantage. When I was flying the Bandit many passengers comment how much better it was than those "pencil shaped aircraft" (thats how most passengers remember the Metro).
rpt2,
Yes it would have been a logical step to purchase at least 1 other shed, but this company does not operate with logic. From what I've seen they have a very good product but they do not take advantage of it.
I think we will find this Metro that Sunshine will operate was the one that Aeromil (the company that owns Sunshine) advertised For Sale a few weeks back. This small airline will now have 3 types in their fleet and only 2 routes. They should be called "Mini Ansett".
In their defence, Sunshine Express like the other Ansett regionals was hurt when Ansett collapsed in September. From what I hear this company is waiting on a miracle. They are waiting to see if they have a future with Qantas.
Yes the Metro maybe pressurised and faster but that only helps if you are doing 250-300nm routes. The route the Metro will replace the Bandit on is about 220nm. The Metro will do it in about 55-60 mins and the Bandit would do it in about 65-70 mins. I have flown both types and the Bandit is much more of a pilots plane than the Metro. From a passenger point of view lets compare.
The Bandit from memory is around 5.3 feet high and about the same wide. The Sunshine aircraft have 15 high back seats with tray tables and armrests.
The Metro is is 4.8 feet high and about 5 feet wide. Has you can see there is a few inches difference with the Bandit holding the advantage. When I was flying the Bandit many passengers comment how much better it was than those "pencil shaped aircraft" (thats how most passengers remember the Metro).
rpt2,
Yes it would have been a logical step to purchase at least 1 other shed, but this company does not operate with logic. From what I've seen they have a very good product but they do not take advantage of it.
I think we will find this Metro that Sunshine will operate was the one that Aeromil (the company that owns Sunshine) advertised For Sale a few weeks back. This small airline will now have 3 types in their fleet and only 2 routes. They should be called "Mini Ansett".
In their defence, Sunshine Express like the other Ansett regionals was hurt when Ansett collapsed in September. From what I hear this company is waiting on a miracle. They are waiting to see if they have a future with Qantas.
Join Date: May 2000
Location: GAFA
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe the management of Sunshine Express should read www.airliners.net
A topic on the Metro3/23 and Big Sky Airlines has just started. This is what people are saying about the Metro over there;
"They (Metro) are the least popular aircraft in the Air NZ fleet"
"pencils or drainpipes"
"bring ear plug, they're loud and tiny"
"the Sewertube, they are heading to the scrapyard"
"Garrent engines are really creations of the devil"
Well it sounds like they have made a good choice (not!).
Even Air NZ are replacing their Metro's with an aircraft with better passenger appeal.
Are Sunshine Express the only operate on this route or do they have competition?
[ 08 December 2001: Message edited by: bentandtwisted ]
A topic on the Metro3/23 and Big Sky Airlines has just started. This is what people are saying about the Metro over there;
"They (Metro) are the least popular aircraft in the Air NZ fleet"
"pencils or drainpipes"
"bring ear plug, they're loud and tiny"
"the Sewertube, they are heading to the scrapyard"
"Garrent engines are really creations of the devil"
Well it sounds like they have made a good choice (not!).
Even Air NZ are replacing their Metro's with an aircraft with better passenger appeal.
Are Sunshine Express the only operate on this route or do they have competition?
[ 08 December 2001: Message edited by: bentandtwisted ]
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just a question.
Isn't there a significant difference between the Metro 3 and the Metro 23. I thought the there were some structural changes incorporated into the M23 that wasn't in any of the others.
Isn't there a significant difference between the Metro 3 and the Metro 23. I thought the there were some structural changes incorporated into the M23 that wasn't in any of the others.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 369
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes Foxtrotter this thread is a good example of why most route vs a/c studies are not derived from the question; what aircraft do I want to fly?
But when looking at what aircraft to operate you also need to look at what the competition is flying. I know Sunshine are the only operators on the Biloela/Thangool route but they do have competition. They have Sunstate and now once again Flight West flying to Gladstone. A little further up the road they have Airlink and Sunstate flying into Rocky. Biloela is a minning town, so the passenger travelling into Biloela are on business and the business traveller wants more than holiday traveller.
Both Gladstone and Rocky are within driving distance. These towns have both the Dash 8 and the B146 operating into them under the Qantaslink brand. Sunshine Express have just started to fly into TNG (after Flight West closed)so they are out to grab as many passengers has they can. Yes the Metro may be cheaper than the Bandit or buying another Shorts 360, but is it the aircraft to have when you are out to capture a new market? I have just read airliners net and the Metro does not appear to be very popular at all.
From what I've read here, Sunshine Express will have three aircraft types in their Fleet, 1 Shorts 360, 1 Metro and 1 E110. To me that does not appear to be an economical way to run a small regional airline. You would require 3 different lots of spare plus 3 different Check and Training pilots. I whish them well but I predict that in less than 6 months there will not be a Metro flying into TNG.
But when looking at what aircraft to operate you also need to look at what the competition is flying. I know Sunshine are the only operators on the Biloela/Thangool route but they do have competition. They have Sunstate and now once again Flight West flying to Gladstone. A little further up the road they have Airlink and Sunstate flying into Rocky. Biloela is a minning town, so the passenger travelling into Biloela are on business and the business traveller wants more than holiday traveller.
Both Gladstone and Rocky are within driving distance. These towns have both the Dash 8 and the B146 operating into them under the Qantaslink brand. Sunshine Express have just started to fly into TNG (after Flight West closed)so they are out to grab as many passengers has they can. Yes the Metro may be cheaper than the Bandit or buying another Shorts 360, but is it the aircraft to have when you are out to capture a new market? I have just read airliners net and the Metro does not appear to be very popular at all.
From what I've read here, Sunshine Express will have three aircraft types in their Fleet, 1 Shorts 360, 1 Metro and 1 E110. To me that does not appear to be an economical way to run a small regional airline. You would require 3 different lots of spare plus 3 different Check and Training pilots. I whish them well but I predict that in less than 6 months there will not be a Metro flying into TNG.
Join Date: May 2000
Location: OZ
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PUFF For yr info Eagle Air ie Air NZ Link who have just taken the 1st few of their large B1900 order are quickly finding out that the operating costs are simlar to the SAAB 340..................Not good
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: QLD, Australia
Posts: 252
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think this thread has shown the ever changing climate of air services to regional centres in Australia. In the last 15 years the BNE-TNG has had the following aircraft types;
Metro 2, Bandit, B200, Shorts 360, E120, J32 , then back to the Bandit and now a Metro 3. At one point both Flight West and Sunstate were flying the route. In the early- mid 90's Sunstate overnighted a 360 at TNG.
Small regional centres all over Australia are facing a decline in Air Services. The larger Regional Airlines have moved up to larger 30+ seat aircraft and the towns that these airlines once flew to cannot support the larger aircraft. In NSW many towns that once had turboprop equipment now only have a PA31 or no service.
The BNE - TNG is currently a stand alone route so it cannot support a 30+ seat aircraft. If it was linked with another town, such as BLK, GLD or BUD then it might required a larger aircraft such as a 360.
I think most would agree the Bandit does have a slight edge of the Metro with regard to passenger appeal, but the Bandit lacks range. The SEA Bandits are fitted with 15 leather seats. These seats are heavier than the old 1 + 2 bench seat that most Bandits have. The operating weights of the SEA Bandits are around 150-200 kg higher than those Bandits fitted with the standard seats. The Bandit on this run is limited to no more than about 14 passengers on a good day. The Metro on the other hand can carry 19 passengers on a bad day. The passengers may not like the Metro but it is better than no service at all.
This Metro is owned by SEA's parent company Aeromil (ie no purchase cost to SEA). I'm sure if they owned another Shorts or a Bras then they would have tried to use them on this route.
The B1900D has also been mentioned on this thread. Yes it does have the best passenger appeal out of all the 15-19 seat aircraft and yes it is expensive, but you are getting a very versatile aircraft. The B1900D has some very good gear up the front, 99% of the passengers can stand up in it, you can carry a small bag on with you plus it can carry 19 passengers fly for around 2-3 hours with reserves. The Dash 8 is the same, it is the most expensive of the 30+ seat aircraft but it is versatile. The B1900D needs to be doing more than 2000 hours flying per year otherwise you are in trouble. Unfortunately SEA do not have enough routes to make the 2000+ hours per year.
Metro 2, Bandit, B200, Shorts 360, E120, J32 , then back to the Bandit and now a Metro 3. At one point both Flight West and Sunstate were flying the route. In the early- mid 90's Sunstate overnighted a 360 at TNG.
Small regional centres all over Australia are facing a decline in Air Services. The larger Regional Airlines have moved up to larger 30+ seat aircraft and the towns that these airlines once flew to cannot support the larger aircraft. In NSW many towns that once had turboprop equipment now only have a PA31 or no service.
The BNE - TNG is currently a stand alone route so it cannot support a 30+ seat aircraft. If it was linked with another town, such as BLK, GLD or BUD then it might required a larger aircraft such as a 360.
I think most would agree the Bandit does have a slight edge of the Metro with regard to passenger appeal, but the Bandit lacks range. The SEA Bandits are fitted with 15 leather seats. These seats are heavier than the old 1 + 2 bench seat that most Bandits have. The operating weights of the SEA Bandits are around 150-200 kg higher than those Bandits fitted with the standard seats. The Bandit on this run is limited to no more than about 14 passengers on a good day. The Metro on the other hand can carry 19 passengers on a bad day. The passengers may not like the Metro but it is better than no service at all.
This Metro is owned by SEA's parent company Aeromil (ie no purchase cost to SEA). I'm sure if they owned another Shorts or a Bras then they would have tried to use them on this route.
The B1900D has also been mentioned on this thread. Yes it does have the best passenger appeal out of all the 15-19 seat aircraft and yes it is expensive, but you are getting a very versatile aircraft. The B1900D has some very good gear up the front, 99% of the passengers can stand up in it, you can carry a small bag on with you plus it can carry 19 passengers fly for around 2-3 hours with reserves. The Dash 8 is the same, it is the most expensive of the 30+ seat aircraft but it is versatile. The B1900D needs to be doing more than 2000 hours flying per year otherwise you are in trouble. Unfortunately SEA do not have enough routes to make the 2000+ hours per year.
